I'm not saying their evil I'm saying that if they were they wouldn't be stupid it about it and just gut them willy nilly. Your argument amounted to well their not showing anything obvious and overt so they aren't doing anything like that which presupposes if they were going to do the evil of removing the palestinians from palestine that they would use the most obvious and overt evil which is whole sale killings but there are ways of removing them that aren't as obvious and overt. They are ridding the land of palestinians though. they keep taking land and pushing the increasing population into smaller areas. Just because the population is increasing doesn't preclude them from being removed.
Netanyahu aide: Israel using Collective Punishment on children of Gaza because parent
- Thread starter common_sense_seeker
- Start date
I'm not saying their evil I'm saying that if they were they wouldn't be stupid it about it and just gut them willy nilly. Your argument amounted to well their not showing anything obvious and overt so they aren't doing anything like that which presupposes if they were going to do the evil of removing the palestinians from palestine that they would use the most obvious and overt evil which is whole sale killings but there are ways of removing them that aren't as obvious and overt. They are ridding the land of palestinians though. they keep taking land and pushing the increasing population into smaller areas. Just because the population is increasing doesn't preclude them from being removed.
No,they aren't disposing of the Palestinians, pushing them into ever small enclaves does not get rid of them, they are still there and they become even more fanatical! It not the kind of policy smart and evil people would make, smart and evil would have been having a global plague come out of nowhere with mysteriously high death toll rates in the west bank and gaza and non-existent death toll in Israel.
Bells
Staff member
Depends on the person I suppose. If you support collective punishment with the specific intent of making innocent people suffer, then no, you are not a human being in my opinion. Just as those who support and actively help others who deliberately set out to harm others through acts of terrorism are not human.
Your religion really means fuck all in this debate.
Now, you may want to attempt to whip the anti-Jewish fervour on this forum for your own personal gain. But I can assure you, you would be best to take it elsewhere.
Let me put it this way. If you're one of those individuals who watches from the sideline and cheers as harm being done to innocent civilians, then you deserve to burn in the very depth of hell for all of eternity, regardless of what side you belong to..
Calling out children specifically is also weasely. Wars unfortunately tend to harm children, and this is a war. Israel realizes they can't just wipe out the Palestinians quickly, so they will do it slowly, bureaucratically, through building permits, the legal system, lack of employment or resources, settlements in their midst, destroying orchards, wiping out their manufacturing base... The Palestinians cannot win, nor can Arab countries do anything significant about it as long as Israel has nukes.
Israel is responsible for its choice of tactics, its aggression against civilian populations, and its conduct as an occupying power - if this is in fact a war, which is not obvious.spidergoat said:
Israel's tactics and policies have harmed Palestinian children seriously, disproportionately, and unnecessarily. Calling them on that is completely reasonable. Withholding aid and support for such tactics and policies is long overdue, as a response.
The most you are going to achieve is a more careful policy of war by attrition.
Their enemies are our enemies, for whatever reason. We will continue to support them. Think about it this way, if Republicans are elected, the policy will be only more supporting of Israel. And how likely is it that a more liberal president than Obama will be elected?
Nothing weaseling about it, Israel is not intentionally harming children, unintentionally sure, but there is no evidence they are directly trying to harm the children, just the adults.
We do not have to throw our soul into the mix, and continue to fool ourselves about what they do, or pretend they aren't doing it.spidergoat said:
If you think we will inevitably support Israel, regardless, why pretend? Why not do so honestly?
Weasel wording, again.electric said:
Israel is not blind to the effects of its deliberately designed and deliberately implemented policies. It is accountable for the known, predicted, and observed consequences of its actions over many years, direct and indirect. It is responsible for its choices of tactic and means, and for its deliberate omissions as well as commissions.
There's nothing honest about international politics. It's a media war as much as a physical one.
I wonder, what is "weasel wording" to you?
Again this has nothing to do with them directly or indirectly punishing children. I never said they were not responsible, merely that the children were harm indirectly and the this is to be expected in war.
But we do not have to throw in our lot with lies.spidergoat said:
Again: if you are supporting Israel, why not honestly?
Squirming around out from under the pointed question, deflecting attention from a failure to confront the major issue, reframing the matter so that the uncomfortable issue is hidden or set aside, or just dealing in meaningless platitude, while pretending to answer.electric said:
Israel's policies are designed and imposed in such a way that they disproportionately, unnecessarily, and seriously, harm Palestinian children. Israel knows this, and chooses to continue.
The 2009 Israeli assault on Gaza was directly responsible for the deaths of around 300+ children. Particulars of the nature of war crimes committed against civilains and children can be found in the Goldstone Commission Report.
Shooting into a sealed room with the foreknowledge that it is filled with both adults and children equates to the willful targeting of children. Continual denial of such a simple reality is indicative of serious and offensive moral shortcoming. :m:
"We could not guard every water pipeline from being blown up and every tree from being uprooted. We could not prevent every murder of a worker in an orchard or a family in their beds. But it was in our power to set high price for our blood, a price too high for the [Palestinian] Arab community, the Arab army, or the Arab governments to think it worth paying. . . .
Moshe Dayan
Moshe Dayan
their enemies are our enemies because we support them.
the winds of fate are shifting. the time is rapidly approaching where they(Israel) will need to choose between keeping palestinian land and its continued existence.
maybe not next election but the day is coming when justice for palestine becomes what the US demands from Israel.
that's pure propaganda. the arab militaries never had the ability to inflict such wide spread destruction
On the contrary, it's an admission of the premise of this thread. The Israelis have always felt that their military response to Arab violence should not be proportional, but rather overwhelmingly harsh, in order to discourage it in the future.
really I thought the thread was about Israel killing children because?
which never works when your the aggressor which Israel is and it rarely works in defense. it just causes escalation.