If a man is raped by a woman...

[Asguard]

no these two posts,

this is a very interesting document that might interest people like bells (though im sure she already knows most of it) and james but MH and ABS should really read it

its produced by a center called the Australian Institute for the Study of Sexual Assult (ACSSA) under the goverment institute for family studies (commonwealth gov)

i found it while trying to find the clincal guidelines for treating sexual assult victioms ironically enough concidering that everytime i have searched for male victoms of sexual assult its come up with rapes BY males

anyway i wont post the whole document but here is the heading and the link

ACSSA Wrap
No.2 September 2006
Male survivors of sexual assault and rape
by Sarah Crome
Published by the Australian Institute of Family Studies
ISSN 1833-1483 (Print); ISSN 1834-0148 (Online)
ACSSA Coordinator: Zoë Morrison


http://www.aifs.gov.au/acssa/pubs/wrap/w2.html

about the previlance of male victoms. if i have calculated this correctly a third of victoms are men

that number was taken from The Royal Australian and New Zealand College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists medical fact sheet on sexual assult

it states that:



as the genders are roughly equal that means 1/3 of victoms are male

then there is also the victorian crimes act 1958 section 38

(3) A person (the offender) also commits rape if he or she compels a person-

(a) to sexually penetrate the offender or another person, irrespective of
whether the person being sexually penetrated consents to the act; or

(b) who has sexually penetrated the offender or another person, not to
cease sexually penetrating the offender or that other person,
irrespective of whether the person who has been sexually penetrated
consents to the act.

(4) For the purposes of subsection (3), a person compels another person (the
victim) to engage in a sexual act if the person compels the victim (by force
or otherwise) to engage in that act-

(a) without the victim's consent; and

(b) while-

(i) being aware that the victim is not consenting or might not be
consenting; or

(ii) not giving any thought to whether the victim is not consenting or
might not be consenting.


http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/vic/consol_act/ca195882/s38.html

 

[Randwolf]

Unforunately, I have little time to devote to SF these days, but a quick Google search turned these up (I did not try to track back and verify sources):

http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/11/30/alimony-to-the-murderous-mom-and-child-support-to-the-female-rapist-franz-kafka-real-life-has-outdone-ya/ Viewed July 25 at 12:15 AM EST

This case reminds me a lot of one I previously read about in which a woman had sexual intercourse with a man while he was drunk and unconscious, then bragged to some friends of hers that she had saved herself a trip to the sperm bank. When a man has sex with a drunk and unconscious woman, few people have trouble calling it what it is: rape.

The woman who had sex with an unconscious man in lieu of going to the sperm bank got pregnant, as she intended, and then sued the man for child support. The court ordered him to pay it.

http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/11/30/alimony-to-the-murderous-mom-and-child-support-to-the-female-rapist-franz-kafka-real-life-has-outdone-ya/ Viewed July 25 at 12:15 AM EST


Next Case:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.child-support/browse_thread/thread/364d4bbf2bf4cfd5/41e656fa0ba4df68?lnk=raot Viewed at d12:18AM July 25, 2008

It gets worse. Take the famous "Frank S." case(2) for example. The court ordered Frank to pay child support even though Pam lied to him about using birth control. Men can't use fraud as a defense. I'm not making this up. This demonstrates the "No" means "No" principle. When a man says "No" to parenthood, he really means 'Ignore me, I have "No" reproductive rights'.

And it's not just Frank. Ask Shane Seyer(3). Despite the fact that he was just twelve years old and too young to legally consent to sex, he was forced into parenthood by his baby sitter, and a court is making him pay child support. The February 12th 1995 issue of the St. Louis Missouri Post-Dispatch had article about another babysitter who forced a boy into fatherhood. This brings up the burning issue: did the boys' parents raise their allowances to pay child support?

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.child-support/browse_thread/thread/364d4bbf2bf4cfd5/41e656fa0ba4df68?lnk=raot Viewed at d12:18AM July 25, 2008



http://truthformen.wordpress.com/2007/10/25/wrongly-convicted-man-sued-for-child-support/ Viewed 12:20 AM EST. July 25, 2008

Wrongly Convicted Man Sued for Child Support
Raleigh — A man who was pardoned after spending 18 years behind bars for a rape he didn’t commit has been sued for child support for the years he was in prison.

Wow, only in the Matriarchy, you mean the man was wrongfully convicted of rape? I thought this never happens…

Dwayne Allen Dail, 39, was cleared in August of the 1987 rape of a 12-year-old Goldsboro girl. The girl identified him as her attacker, and hair found at the scene was similar to his. DNA evidence found on a fragment of the girl’s nightgown years after the trial proved Dail wasn’t involved in the attack, however.
Gov. Mike Easley pardoned Dail two weeks ago, making him eligible to receive $360,000 from the state – $20,000 for each year he spent in prison.
Dail, who now lives in Florida, was served Tuesday with a lawsuit by Lorraine Michaels, the mother of his son, who is seeking back child support. The suit does not specify how much money she wants, as is normal in North Carolina, but asks a “reasonable sum for the care and maintenance of the minor child” for the years Dail was in prison.

Didn’t take her long to try and sponge off the man. Just when you thought people couldn’t go any lower, they do.

http://truthformen.wordpress.com/2007/10/25/wrongly-convicted-man-sued-for-child-support/ Viewed 12:20 AM EST. July 25, 2008



And while not directly on point as far as child support, here is another rape story against a man. This does happen folks! It may not be, nay, it is not as prevalent as male on female rape, but don't kid yourself, it does happen. And, the kicker is, yes, if the chickie gets pregnant, after raping the man, legally, she has a good chance of collecting child support. It's all part of "male privilege", ya know?

http://www.lasiksightplus.com/lasiknews8.html Viewed at 12:25 AM, EST, July 25, 2008

Two Women Convicted of Raping Male College Student in 2007
Saturday, March 29 2008
A Jefferson County jury found Jessica Turck and Alexandra Blackford guilty of raping 19 year old college student in May of 2007.

During a walk home from work on the night of May 15th, 2007, the victim was reportedly taken into a small sedan and driven to a nearby boat launch where the two women preformed oral sex on the male. They then took turns having sexual intercourse with the male while his arms were duct taped to the handles of the doors in the back seat. The victim was forced to ejaculate into Alexandra Blackford before leaving him at the boat launch.

The two females had no prior relationships with the male, and claimed that the act was consensual. However the male stated that he was threatened and told that he would be killed if he resisted or began to scream.

Earlier this week a jury of 5 men and 7 women found both Jessica Turck and Alexandra Blackford guilty of rape, involuntary deviate sexual intercourse, kidnapping, aggravated indecent assault, and unlawful restraint.

Jefferson County Judge Timothy Randall revoked bail for both the females and ordered them held in the county prison until sentencing.

http://www.lasiksightplus.com/lasiknews8.html Viewed at 12:25 AM, EST, July 25, 2008


But, this is all fair and equitable, right? Or maybe we will here the "statistically insignificant" argument. Or perhaps the whole concept will be dismissed out of hand as "ludicrous". Should be great. What, are we supposed to "man up" here?

Also, I noticed a reference by someone, maybe our man Tiassa, as to what "precautions' a man should take to prevent this sort of thing from happening, assuming that we grant the existence of the issue in the first place.

My answer to that one is very easy. The same f**cking precautions that women should take! Don't drink to excess in unsafe places, etc. What constitutes unsafe places? Use common sense people, those are the boundaries. It's not wizardry, it's just every day horse sense. Should we, women or men, have to take these precautions? Of course not, we shouldn't have to, but we live in reality, and reality, at least my reality, dictates that we observe / use common sense. Period.

How can this be so heretical?

 

[madanthonywayne]

Medicine Woman and Madanthonywayne:

While yes it does sound far fetched, it is entirely possible for a woman to rape a man by legal definition and dictionary definition. To think otherwise is to be plain unimaginative, sexist, and (well let's just say it) stupid.

I didn't say it was impossible, anything's possible. I just said, as you did, that it sounds absurd. Furthermore, I'd bet that many cases that would be considered rape or at least sexual asault by females is just considered good fun by most men.

Ever been to a strip bar? What's the rule? No touching the female strippers. She can touch you, you can't touch her. Now I've never been to a strip bar with male strippers, but from what I heard, they have the opposite rule. The female patrons are free to grope the male strippers at will.

Men and women are just different. Even if a woman is in to dominating and humiliating a man; rather than try to rape someone, she could probably get some guy to pay her to be a dominatrix.

So, yes. A woman raping a man is technically possible and may even occur from time to time. But it's really a man bites dog situation.

 

[Asguard]

not really mad, what about a gay guy who is raped?

as i stated before its estimated that 1 in 8 men will or have been raped at some time in there life as compared to 1 in 4 women

now the majority of rapes will be peritrated by men but not all, men are more likly to be raped by women acording to the artical i posted though it didnt have statistics

 

[draqon]

men or women are more likely to inflict damage on themselves before any damage is done by others.

 

[madanthonywayne]

not really mad, what about a gay guy who is raped?

You're talking about a man raping a man? Of course that can happen. It's a big part of the deterent effect of prison. I was talking about a woman raping a man.

as i stated before its estimated that 1 in 8 men will or have been raped at some time in there life as compared to 1 in 4 women

Do you have data that breaks that down by age? I'd bet that less than 1% of those male rape victims were victimized as adults by women. Most were probably victims of child molestation.

 

[Randwolf]

not really mad, what about a gay guy who is raped?

Asguard, I appreciate what you are saying here, but on topic, the gay guy getting raped (presumably by other guys) doesn't exactly have to worry about paying child support, does he? The crime is still horrendous, but unless maybe I misread part of the thread, aren't we talking about the inequity of a man being forced to pay child support even if he was forced against his will to conceive a child?

And, more generally, isn't it about the unfair and disproportionate application of penalties and punishment to male rapists vs. female rapists? Some people can not even conceive of a female rapist. That's ludicrous, especially if you apply the same standards established in the recent debate - "non consensual sex is rape".

Imagine rape that you then pay for for eighteen years. Talk about adding insult to injury...

 

[Randwolf]

One more...

http://www.halfsigma.com/2008/04/punishing-the-v.html Viewed at 2:07 AM EST July 25, 2008

Is this crazy result is just restricted to Kansas? Nope, many states have followed this decision. For example, in L.M.E. v. A.R.S., 261 Mich. App. 273 (2004), the Michigan Court of Appeals reached the exact same result, holding a minor responsible for child support, even though “the child was conceived as a result of [the mother’s] criminal action in having sexual relations with respondent when he was a fourteen-year-old boy.” The mother was six years older than the statutory rape victim. She was also married, and the woman’s husband thought the kid was his own for more than a decade, until they got divorced and a paternity test showed that the kid belonged to someone else. And then, out of the blue, the statutory rape victim was socked with a child support order

http://www.halfsigma.com/2008/04/punishing-the-v.html Viewed at 2:07 AM EST July 25, 2008

 

[Asguard]

sorry i left off the vital end of my sentance for some reason.

i ment to say "what about a gay guy who is raped by a women, even if aroused to the point of ejaculation are you really trying to say that he wasnt raped"

as for the percentages i have no idea, every time i search i find different statistics because this area is so under reported

acording to the The National Crime and Safety Survey of 2002 the figures were 0.1 percent of men and 0.4 percent of women over the age of 18 reported being raped but as i said acurate statistics are dam near impossable to find

the other artical makes no sence how can 1 in 6 children become 1 in 8 people across there whole life time, you would have to have negitive rape, those figures have to be just adults otherwise this doesnt make sence

It is estimated that one in four women and one in eight men experience sexual assault during their lifetime, though many instances of sexual assault are never reported. It is also estimated that one in three women and one in six men experienced sexual assault in their childhood [summary estimates of figures from Women’s Health Statewide, South Australia].

http://209.85.141.104/search?q=cach...s+of+sexual+assaults&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=6&gl=au

 

[Asguard]

here is an interesting question, has a rapist ever won custody of the product of that rape? if not why dont these fathers aplie for sole custody and then put the kid up for adoption if they chose?

 

[Asguard]

i dont know if these have already been posted or are real cases and i cant be bothered tracking them down but while searching for the answer to my above question i found this:

1)A 14 year old boy in Kentucky, raped by his 27 year old babysitter,
was ordered to pay child support and back AFDC to Kentucky, after the
woman filed for support. The Kentucky Supreme Court ruled rhat though
the sexual act was not consensual, the rape did not release the boy from
the legal and moral obligation to support any progeny from the rape.


2) An 18 year old woman in Colorado has sued a 12 year old boy, and his
parents, for chiid support for a baby born to her. The woman, recent
released from prison after serving 9 months for raping the boy, was
awarded $100/mo in child support, and the court ordered the parents of
the boy to reimburse the State for foster care for the child while the
mother was in prison.


3) A 17 year old boy in Wisconsin, raped by his 17 year old baby sitter
when he was 12, was ordered to repay the State $16,000 in AFDC, and 17%
of his wages to the woman, now 20 years old, in child support. This
court also ruled that the circumstance of rape does not remove the boy's
responsibility to pay child support.
Paternit of JLH, 149 Wis 2d 349 441 NW 2d 273 (1989)


4)A 12 year old Kansas boy has been ordered to pay child support to his
18 year old babysitter, who gave birth after she raped him.
Hermessman v Sayer, Kansas Supreme Court 1995


5) In the case of Schierenbeck v Minor 148 Colorado 582 367 P 2nd 333
1961: a 12 year old boy was ordered to pay child support to his 17 year
old babysitter who gave birth after she raped him.


6)From the St. Louis Post Dispatch, Feb 15, 1995: A 13 year old Missouri
boy has been ordered to pay child support to an 18 year old Illinois
woman. The woman raped the boy when he was 11. She served 2 years in
prison. The courts ruled rape did absolve the boy of his responsibility
to support his child.


http://groups.google.com/group/alt....ordered+to+pay+child+support#d26547b0def24821

i really liked *sarcastic* the one where the state ordered the rape victom to pay the state for looking after the product of that rape because the rapist was in prision. Really encorages victoms to come forward doesnt it

 

[Randwolf]

"Bizarre Case Has Woman Who Raped Teen Fighting Him for Child Custody"

Video here: http://www.breitbart.tv/?p=127353

 

[angrybellsprout]

as i stated before its estimated that 1 in 8 men will or have been raped at some time in there life as compared to 1 in 4 women

I'd really love you to prove that 1 in 4 women are raped.

 

[visceral_instinct]

Medicine Woman and Madanthonywayne:

While yes it does sound far fetched, it is entirely possible for a woman to rape a man by legal definition and dictionary definition. To think otherwise is to be plain unimaginative, sexist, and (well let's just say it) stupid. I don't believe either of you are stupid, so i guess you must not be trying to use your imagination wise or are you are very sexist.

Basically anything a man can do to rape woman, a woman can turn around on a man. Even struggle is an option as the hormonal difference between Flight, Fight, or F--k are nonexistant. Men often become arroused during struggles. Also honestly arrousal does not mean a man wants to have sex with that particular woman. Just becuase it is hard does not mean men have to use it, or even want to.

I do agree with the rest of your post, but this? I don't know about everyone else, but adrenaline does not make me horny.

 

[TW Scott]

I do agree with the rest of your post, but this? I don't know about everyone else, but adrenaline does not make me horny.

Adrenaline is produced while you are aroused by any condition, actually. And truth be told adrenalin doesn't make you feel anything, what you feel can trigger adrenalin releases.

 

[TW Scott]

here is an interesting question, has a rapist ever won custody of the product of that rape? if not why dont these fathers aplie for sole custody and then put the kid up for adoption if they chose?

Actually if our court systems were fair and just, full and sole custody would automatically be granted to the raped parent. The rapist would be stripped of all parental rights to a child born of a rape, but would be responsible for child support. In no way should a rapist be allowed to collect child support as that would be profiting from a crime.

To all you judges saying that that isn;t in the best interest of the child, grow up. if that child is left in the home of a rapist, obviously you were not too interested in the child's welfare. If the child is in the foster care system just treat it as parent unknown. Billing a rape victim for childsupport of a child created of rape is much like shooting someone, letting the wound almost heal and opening it every month just for giggles.

 

[madanthonywayne]

I don't know about everyone else, but adrenaline does not make me horny.

Really? Maybe you just haven't had a good enough adrenaline rush yet. That effect is quite well known and real.

It makes sense, too. From an evolutionary perspective. In times of danger, we need higher fertility to repopulate once the danger passes.

 

[Asguard]

i dont think people quite realise that there is another option from fight or flight that adreniline causes and thats freeze. its something i have experianced when i witnessed a motorcycle acident a while ago. you litterally cant move, i wanted to go and help but i couldnt move. now if this occurs during a rape it really doesnt matter how strong or weak the person being raped is, there body itself wont let them do anything

 

[visceral_instinct]

Really? Maybe you just haven't had a good enough adrenaline rush yet. That effect is quite well known and real.

I've had a pretty immense adrenaline rush form downhill, and yes I did get horny a while afterwards, but I assumed that was because you produce some sex hormone from your adrenal glands, not the actual adrenaline though....? Correct me if I'm talking crap...

 

[visceral_instinct]

^^?