Homesexuality

[Frencheneesz]

"Homosexuals claim God created them gay why couldn't pedophelia's?"

Anyone can claim anything, but god isn't accepted by everyone. Not only that, there are many gods that people believe in (for those christians that seem not to know that). You can not make something legal by blaming your existence on god.

 

[Tiassa]

Adam--am I serious?

I'm serious that I've read that tidbit. The unfortunate part of the story is that the particular poli-sci text in which I came across that tale was among the books my college girlfriend chose to sell back to the University despite my protestations and while I was at work, so that she could pay for some more weed. Fair enough; I once spent my financial aid on her makeup; live and learn. (If I'm ever excessively harsh toward women and makeup, there stands my reason.)

But unfortunately I'm quite serious. Reagan is one of the original "gay measles" proprietors. What, however, can we expect of a man who stood before Congress thirty years before and placed his hand on a Bible and proceeded to (A) name names of suspected Communists in his association, and (B) lie while doing so? While I'm grateful that his anti-Communist zeal helped bring an end to the Cold War, I wish he hadn't been part of the ridiculous effort to take the world to the brink.

Such editorial comments aside, I am, unfortunately, quite serious that such information exists in my experience. I shall in the coming days, given the extremity of the assertion, attempt to provide some citation of that idea, but it's one of those obscure ones that came up in an article written by a guy who resigned from the Reagan administration in protest of certain social policies (HIV, obviously, one of them).

It's a fair question if it seems a little beyond belief. I'll give you that. It's one of the reasons I don't often speak of that girlfriend. It's hard not to speak ill of people when that's all they leave you.

thanx,
Tiassa

 

[Tiassa]

Lady

Trying to discredit the Bible doesn't cause me to believe homosexual behavior is cool....questions concerning Lot and mentions of the Amikelalits...I'm not the author I have to ask for understand as well.(you can too)....but the subject concerns homosexuality.. I asked two questions.. Why lead the world to believe God deliberately created a behavior he considers perverse in which the penalty of is hell. Everyone is not going to accept that God is Evil. Why not just admitt it's a choice.... simple. It would make it so much easier.

It's not a matter of that. It's a matter of taking what one finds in the Bible and assuming or concluding it to equal knowledge. That's the notion I protest, for, after all, these other things I've mentioned are also knowledge.

Now, it is hardly my problem that "everyone is not going to accept that God is Evil". It's a hard issue, especially in Biblical terms. God is good, but God is also the Supreme Thing. That is God is omnipotent in theory, but I've found that Christians find this problematic functionally. Other people find it problematic conceptually, but Christians often have problems understanding the implications of omnipotence. For instance, I was reading Kenneth Wade's Savage Future, a critique of the New Age movement that I picked up in a Christian (Seventh-Day Adventist) bookstore. I'm not entirely sure if he intended to do so, but he proclaimed in essence that God is not omnipotent and does not have nearly as great of authority in the Universe as even I was lead to believe by Lutheran and Catholic preachers. (It was more important, unfortunately, for Mr. Wade to get his potshots in against the New Age than it was to pay attention to the implications of his own arguments.)

God is no more purely good than purely evil. That's the problem. If people cannot accept the fact that the God to whom they plead for mercy--mercy for the fact of their birth, for they are born into sin--is also responsible for evil, it is hardly my problem.

So rather than ask, Why lead the world to believe God deliberately created a behavior he considers perverse in which the penalty of is hell? I would ask Why does God create people to be born into sin, requiring salvation through Jesus Christ, in essence creating beings which are unsatisfactory to his own needs?

And no, I don't expect everyone to accept the fact that the God described in the Bible is a moron, but come on ... if God has a problem with the design, that's His Own Problem.

Why not just admitt it's a choice.... simple. It would make it so much easier.

You know, I'm not touching that with a ten foot pole.

I don't choose too........

Why don't you choose to? Don't you think it would feel good? No? Well, believe it or not, some people are inclined to feel that heterosexual union does not feel good. It happens. Such is God's will.

Deal with it.

In the meantime, while I rarely pull out this standard, I am compelled to for simplicity's sake:

• If you have not had a sexual partner of the same gender, I'm not sure you're really qualified to speak to why homosexuals feel as they do.

I always find among Christianity a presumption that God intentionally creates human beings to be unsatisfactory to Him.

This statement is what I have been trying to prove wrong...

A simple way to look at it:

• At what point in a person's life do they require salvation through Jesus Christ? One year? Two? When they develop a moral conscience? Why, then, was I and many of my generation baptized as infants before we could choose to accept God?

The simple fact is that Christian doctrine prescribes a state of human sin from the moment of birth. I would be very interested if some of our Christians were to discuss at what point sin enters the existence of a human being. I would be happy to moderate such a topic.

So basically fall for anything........ there's no hostility or cruel treatment being done to any homosexual...by me.

Compassion? Persecution? Hell, there's always apathy. How silly of me to forget.

In the meantime, while you need not celebrate it, and while you might disclaim homophobia, you do create a condition whereby you demonstrate a certain xenophobia. God doesn't condone homosexuality. But God does condone heterosexual rape; how do you feel about that?

By partitioning out homosexuality--for God doesn't condone it--you are, in fact, making it something foreign or alien. Hence xenophobia, since it is enough of a worry to you to wonder how to address it. Technically, the answer is to address homosexuality as no different than anything else. If, however, a book tells you what to think, address it as the book sees fit. Or, specifically, as you decide the book tells you is proper.

But you've made homosexuality something alien. You choose to discriminate against it in order to award it more negative consideration than other concepts. Are you sure there is no cruelty done?

I mean, because it's easier that way is no reason to subscribe to an idea and call it knowledge.

It's knowledge to me I might understand it all (who does) but developing a personal relationship with God makes it all the better.........If you don't believe in the Bible or God........to each his own.

Yes but you're wrong because I have a book that says if they take my corpse to the appropriate place on a river and drop me over a waterfall, my soul will be given the opportunity to pass through several challenges which I will be well prepared for by sorcerers and necromancers of my House, and upon completion of these tasks will be admitted to the glory of God, regardless of my conduct.

It's in a book, so I call it knowledge.

To each his own, indeed.

thanx,
Tiassa

 

[Lady]

Originally posted by Frencheneesz
"Homosexuals claim God created them gay why couldn't pedophelia's?"

Anyone can claim anything, but god isn't accepted by everyone. Not only that, there are many gods that people believe in (for those christians that seem not to know that). You can not make something legal by blaming your existence on god.

French,

This is my point anyone can claim anything and the homosexual community has made a claim which science can't back up.

 

[Lady]

Tyler,


Good info on perverts........you don't' have to convince me pedafiles weren't created sick, nor can you convince me that homosexual are created gay. However just because homosexuals are more excepted has nothing to do with the creation claim. Other individuals with other non- accepted lifestyles could make the same claims that homosexuals make.

 

[Lady]

Re: Lady

Originally posted by tiassa
God is no more purely good than purely evil. That's the problem. If people cannot accept the fact that the God to whom they plead for mercy--mercy for the fact of their birth, for they are born into sin--is also responsible for evil, it is hardly my problem.

Now, it is hardly my problem that "everyone is not going to accept that God is Evil". It's a hard issue, especially in Biblical terms. God is good, but God is also the Supreme Thing. That is God is omnipotent in theory, but I've found that Christians find this problematic functionally. Other people find it problematic conceptually, but Christians often have problems understanding the implications of omnipotence. For instance, I was reading Kenneth Wade's Savage Future, a critique of the New Age movement that I picked up in a Christian (Seventh-Day Adventist) bookstore. I'm not entirely sure if he intended to do so, but he proclaimed in essence that God is not omnipotent and does not have nearly as great of authority in the Universe as even I was lead to believe by Lutheran and Catholic preachers. (It was more important, unfortunately, for Mr. Wade to get his potshots in against the New Age than it was to pay attention to the implications of his own arguments.)



Deal with it.

In the meantime, while I rarely pull out this standard, I am compelled to for simplicity's sake:

God is no more purely good than purely evil. That's the problem. If people cannot accept the fact that the God to whom they plead for mercy--mercy for the fact of their birth, for they are born into sin--is also responsible for evil, it is hardly my problem.


The simple fact is that Christian doctrine prescribes a state of human sin from the moment of birth. I would be very interested if some of our Christians were to discuss at what point sin enters the existence of a human being. I would be happy to moderate such a topic.Compassion? Persecution? Hell, there's always apathy. How silly of me to forget.


By partitioning out homosexuality--for God doesn't condone it--you are, in fact, making it something foreign or alien. Hence xenophobia, since it is enough of a worry to you to wonder how to address it. Technically, the answer is to address homosexuality as no different than anything else. If, however, a book tells you what to think, address it as the book sees fit. Or, specifically, as you decide the book tells you is proper.



It's in a book, so I call it knowledge.

To each his own, indeed.

thanx,
Tiassa [/B]

Tissa,




***I asked a simple question.......Why claim God created homosexual behavior? Can't prove it nor has science found a heter or homo gene.(thats not discrimination) The discussion has nothing to do with the battle of reiligons(but you are Tyler should start a thread) I do apologize for not knowing that people believe in so many gods. Are that there are so many gods. I personally don't believe that but it would be an interestiong to discuss the many gods.Perhaps the homosexual community can claim your Pagan God made them gay(everbody's happy)





In the meantime, while you need not celebrate it, and while you might disclaim homophobia, you do create a condition whereby you demonstrate a certain xenophobia. God doesn't condone homosexuality. But God does condone heterosexual rape; how do you feel about that?




*** I'm sure a rapist would have to ask forgiveness as well. And if you are referring to Lot I don't recall God tellling him to give his daughters to the men.Nor do I even remeber them going.







I mean, because it's easier that way is no reason to subscribe to an idea and call it knowledge.Yes but you're wrong because I have a book that says if they take my corpse to the appropriate place on a river and drop me over a waterfall, my soul will be given the opportunity to pass through several challenges which I will be well prepared for by sorcerers and necromancers of my House, and upon completion of these tasks will be admitted to the glory of God, regardless of my conduct.




***Sounds interesting have you met the sorcerers and necromancers....Is it kinda like a Catholic purgatory? I should ask.. you mentioned being admitted to the Glory of God........what God(name)







God is no more purely good than purely evil. That's the problem. If people cannot accept the fact that the God to whom they plead for mercy--mercy for the fact of their birth, for they are born into sin--is also responsible for evil, it is hardly my problem.





*** This is my understanding.....personally. Satan wanted the Power Of God and to be worship as God without the holiness..... he could only achieve this by being the total opposite and in some sense he is a God but of Evil and is worshipped. He wasn't forced to leave his orginal state nor where his followers but by choice. (Power hungrey monster) and when trying to rationlize his thinking I often ask how he expected to overthrow that which is infinite?




So rather than ask, Why lead the world to believe God deliberately created a behavior he considers perverse in which the penalty of is hell? I would ask Why does God create people to be born into sin, requiring salvation through Jesus Christ, in essence creating beings which are unsatisfactory to his own needs?


**Can't blame God for Eve's mistake but I am grateful he provided a way out. I'm sure Christ didn't enjoy being crucified(by devils) either. If I was in his shoes the whole human race would be lost.

And no, I don't expect everyone to accept the fact that the God described in the Bible is a moron, but come on ... if God has a problem with the design, that's His Own Problem.You know, I'm not touching that with a ten foot pole.Why don't you choose to? Don't you think it would feel good? No? Well, believe it or not, some people are inclined to feel that heterosexual union does not feel good. It happens. Such is God's will.




*** homosexuals, pedafilians, murders, rapist........(pick one) could all claim such is God's will............however he claims different...............anybody can say anything. Futhermore my argument isn't why homosexuals choose the lifestyle.




At what point in a person's life do they require salvation through Jesus Christ? One year? Two? When they develop a moral conscience? Why, then, was I and many of my generation baptized as infants before we could choose to accept God?




*** I'm not catholic (SATANIC CULT) my opinion. But perhaps you could ask the priest. I know one... he's trying to convert me..... would you like to contact him?




But you've made homosexuality something alien. You choose to discriminate against it in order to award it more negative consideration than other concepts. Are you sure there is no cruelty done?



homosexuality is hardly alien in my neck of the woods. I believe it would be easier on everybody, homosexuals included, to not state claims that aren't fact..............Choices is far more acceptable/respectable

 

[Tiassa]

Lady

[quote[I'm sure a rapist would have to ask forgiveness as well. And if you are referring to Lot I don't recall God tellling him to give his daughters to the men.Nor do I even remeber them going.[/quote]But, of course, being blessed by an angel of the Lord for sending his daughters out to be raped? Consider the Bible itself.

Why was Lot spared? Because instead of permitting homosexuality, he offered his two daughters to the crowd?

Sounds interesting have you met the sorcerers and necromancers....Is it kinda like a Catholic purgatory? I should ask.. you mentioned being admitted to the Glory of God........what God(name)

Don't know that I've met them yet, but some of the sorcerers I've come across may be of that vein. However, it's in a book, and that makes it knowledge if I apply the standard you're advocating.

This is my understanding.....personally. Satan wanted the Power Of God and to be worship as God without the holiness..... he could only achieve this by being the total opposite and in some sense he is a God but of Evil and is worshipped. He wasn't forced to leave his orginal state nor where his followers but by choice. (Power hungrey monster) and when trying to rationlize his thinking I often ask how he expected to overthrow that which is infinite?

Seems to me it was God's will that he should try.

However, I might recommend Pagels' The Origin of Satan as well as several books on the history of the Devil in Christianity penned by Dr. Jeffrey Burton Russell. While I'm familiar with this traditional story, its Biblical foundation is weak, and when we stop and consider the evolution of the idea of Satan (cf Pagels) the story becomes less and less credible.

I guess the question I need answered, then, is what the limits of God's knowledge and authority?

By your understanding, of course.

Can't blame God for Eve's mistake but I am grateful he provided a way out. I'm sure Christ didn't enjoy being crucified(by devils) either. If I was in his shoes the whole human race would be lost.

Christ was crucified by devils? I thought he was crucified by Romans.

What, again, are the limits of God's knowledge and understanding? According to the Bible, it seems that God was afraid of the newly-endowed couple: Then the LORD God said: "See! The man has become like one of us, knowing what is good and what is bad! Therefore, he must not be allowed to put out his hand to take fruit from the tree of life also, and thus eat of it and live forever." (Gen. 3.22)

So God, the Alpha and Omega, creator and master of all things, was unable to create a better situation?

Quite obviously, God's "way out" is the best he could manage, which speaks volumes about his capabilities in terms of why he was frightened of Adam and Eve. I tend to think that we can't blame Adam, Eve, or the Serpent for God's will.

homosexuals, pedafilians, murders, rapist........(pick one) could all claim such is God's will............however he claims different...............anybody can say anything.

I just think it's a lot harder to demonstrate the social damage caused by homosexuality than it is to demonstrate the social damage caused by heterosexuality, or even by child molesters. If God is as the Bible describes, then yes, God did make pedophiles as they are, or at least will that result. What we humans do about it is an entirely different thing. Remember, though, that buying (hetero-) sexual favors from a 10 year-old girl was legal in Massachusetts in 1875 while drinking alcohol was not. It's all a matter of priorities, and if we look to the motivations of such laws, we see Biblical communities all over the Boston experience.

Seems to me that in the face of such a God as the Bible describes, this situation can only be as God wills.

Futhermore my argument isn't why homosexuals choose the lifestyle.

If you assert that homosexuals choose, then the reason why is very important. They "choose" because their natural impulse makes heterosexual contact unpleasant?

Seems to me you're recommending that homosexuals should "choose" to be raped--that is, to submit to sexual contact they do not wish.

I'm not catholic (SATANIC CULT) my opinion. But perhaps you could ask the priest. I know one... he's trying to convert me..... would you like to contact him?

You could try not being lazy and ask him yourself. In the meantime, try answering the question: At what point in a person's life do they require salvation through Jesus Christ?

homosexuality is hardly alien in my neck of the woods

Yet you make it something separate from you and your community. Are they "people" or are they "gay people"?

Hint: they're merely people. Any adjective you wish to stick onto the word people is your own choice according to those priorities most important to you.

Choices is far more acceptable/respectable

You've gone from "easier" to "more respectable"?

What's your foundation for that assertion?

The foundation for homosexuality as a natural part of life has much evidence. Primarily, it occurs in nature. Gay human beings are not the creatures on the planet who enjoy same-sex gratification.

Or did you miss Spookz's post? (9/17/02)

Obviously, you did not miss that post, since you brought in choice and "right and wrong" without establishing any basis for that "right and wrong". Yet you point out that if it was a matter of choice, it would be easier to deal with, and then you assert it more respectable to consider homosexuality a choice. Yet what I see is your dismissal of evidence that homosexuality does occur in nature compounded with the statement that it would be easier on everybody if we did not state claims that aren't fact, such as the fact that homosexuality occurs in nature outside the human experience.

You're treading a fine line between hypocrisy and horsepucky. Perhaps you could clear up a simple idea:

• Why are you so hooked on choices and the aspects of right and wrong to dismiss on the one hand evidence of homosexuality as a natural condition while on the other hand asking people to accept that homosexuality is a choice (artificial) because you don't think there's any factual basis to the natural aspect of homosexuality?

Seriously: you have isolated homosexuality as an issue, claimed it is a choice and not a natural condition, ignored evidence of homosexuality as a natural condition, and now hold that such claims as that homosexuality is a natural condition are not fact?

Just because it's easier doesn't make it the right resolution to the issue. In the meantime, you'll have to build a basis for "acceptable" and "respectable".

thanx,
Tiassa

 

[Lady]

Re: Lady

Originally posted by tiassa
[quote[I'm sure a rapist would have to ask forgiveness as well. And if you are referring to Lot I don't recall God tellling him to give his daughters to the men.Nor do I even remeber them going.

But, of course, being blessed by an angel of the Lord for sending his daughters out to be raped? Consider the Bible itself.


However, I might recommend Pagels' The Origin of Satan as well as several books on the history of the Devil in Christianity penned by Dr. Jeffrey Burton Russell. While I'm familiar with this traditional story, its Biblical foundation is weak, and when we stop and consider the evolution of the idea of Satan (cf Pagels) the story becomes less and less credible.
So God, the Alpha and Omega, creator and master of all things, was unable to create a better situation?



What's your foundation for that assertion?

The foundation for homosexuality as a natural part of life has much evidence. Primarily, it occurs in nature. Gay human beings are not the creatures on the planet who enjoy same-sex gratification.

Or did you miss Spookz's post? (9/17/02)


You're treading a fine line between hypocrisy and horsepucky. Perhaps you could clear up a simple idea:


Seriously: you have isolated homosexuality as an issue, claimed it is a choice and not a natural condition, ignored evidence of homosexuality as a natural condition, and now hold that such claims as that homosexuality is a natural condition are not fact?


thanx,
Tiassa [/QUOTE]





Tissa,





Why was Lot spared? Because instead of permitting homosexuality, he offered his two daughters to the crowd?Don't know that I've met them yet, but some of the sorcerers I've come across may be of that vein. However, it's in a book, and that makes it knowledge if I apply the standard you're advocating.Seems to me it was God's will that he should try.


**Lot's daughter's were never raped (God's will?) you mentioned that homosexuals don't find pleasure in heterosexual relations....so nothing would have happened to Lot's daughter's EVEN IF THEY WANTED IT.




I guess the question I need answered, then, is what the limits of God's knowledge and authority?


** You said he was the supreme being..........you answered that one.



By your understanding, of course.Christ was crucified by devils? I thought he was crucified by Romans.


**Devil's inside the Romans.



What, again, are the limits of God's knowledge and understanding? According to the Bible, it seems that God was afraid of the newly-endowed couple: Then the LORD God said: "See! The man has become like one of us, knowing what is good and what is bad! Therefore, he must not be allowed to put out his hand to take fruit from the tree of life also, and thus eat of it and live forever." (Gen. 3.22)



*** Adam and Eve was commanded not to eat of the tree which possed the knowledge of good and evil. They did eat of the TREE OF LIFE. As far as I understand God forgave Adam and Eve therefore they posses inmortality. True being that God is Alpha & Omega he knew Adam and Eve would fall therefore causing him to lose his creation to burn with Satan but he made a way.(NOW IT'S UP TO US) WOULD YOU HAVE DIED FOR US?



Quite obviously, God's "way out" is the best he could manage, which speaks volumes about his capabilities in terms of why he was frightened of Adam and Eve. I tend to think that we can't blame Adam, Eve, or the Serpent for God's will.I just think it's a lot harder to demonstrate the social damage caused by homosexuality than it is to demonstrate the social damage caused by heterosexuality, or even by child molesters. If God is as the Bible describes, then yes, God did make pedophiles as they are, or at least will that result. What we humans do about it is an entirely different thing. Remember, though, that buying (hetero-) sexual favors from a 10 year-old girl was legal in Massachusetts in 1875 while drinking alcohol was not. It's all a matter of priorities, and if we look to the motivations of such laws, we see Biblical communities all over the Boston experience.



**Why does God have to fear his creation? Let us not forget Satan's a factor. And even Satan can't posses us unless allowed. No one's forced to serve God, you do it because you believe in him, therefore, do to his non-tyrant
nature we are under free moral agency and if one choose to allow the spirit of pedophila rule his temple..... (choice)


** I'm sure the kids molested by priest and other per's would beg to differ on social damaged caused by homo or hetero pedophilans.



Obviously, you did not miss that post, since you brought in choice and "right and wrong" without establishing any basis for that "right and wrong". Yet you point out that if it was a matter of choice, it would be easier to deal with, and then you assert it more respectable to consider homosexuality a choice. Yet what I see is your dismissal of evidence that homosexuality does occur in nature compounded with the statement that it would be easier on everybody if we did not state claims that aren't fact, such as the fact that homosexuality occurs in nature outside the human experience.



**First, I didn't dismiss Tyler's post on homo animals........I stated... I was taught that animals have sex during mating season only. And if animals of the same sex are having sex I haven't found no passage in the Bible demanding the animals not to do so. Futhermore they don't have to worry about their soul or forgiveness or going to hell...... What the scientist saw they couldn't say with 100% surety it was a sexual act.



Seems to me that in the face of such a God as the Bible describes, this situation can only be as God wills.If you assert that homosexuals choose, then the reason why is very important. They "choose" because their natural impulse makes heterosexual contact unpleasant?



**I don't care why they choose it. (Free Moral Agency)





• Why are you so hooked on choices and the aspects of right and wrong to dismiss on the one hand evidence of homosexuality as a natural condition while on the other hand asking people to accept that homosexuality is a choice (artificial) because you don't think there's any factual basis to the natural aspect of homosexuality?


**Why are homosexuals so hooked on blamming God for their choices? I BELIEVE it's wrong(and have that right) and if others don't (Free Moral Agency)




Seems to me you're recommending that homosexuals should "choose" to be raped--that is, to submit to sexual contact they do not wish.You could try not being lazy and ask him yourself. In the meantime, try answering the question: At what point in a person's life do they require salvation through Jesus Christ?Yet you make it something separate from you and your community. Are they "people" or are they "gay people"?


** How can I answer that........that's up to the individual.
I can't make homosexuals separate from me, they live in my neighborhood, some are kin folks(eat my food up,pay no rent and sleep on my couch), and one in particular who recently became bi-sexual has been my best friend since childhood.




Hint: they're merely people. Any adjective you wish to stick onto the word people is your own choice according to those priorities most important to you.You've gone from "easier" to "more respectable"?



** I know their people(never denied that)
** It would make it eaiser and I have no reason not to respect other's choices (not the sex act )but the Choice.
** The crackheads in my shoot don't blame God for their addiction therefore nobody cares and I still respect them and their choice (not the act ) but the choice.
** I don't hate anyone and I don't hide how I feel to the homosexuals in my life and they respect it. ButI can say that these self proclaimed homo sexuals take it from who's ever putting it out that night.(just another booty call)



Just because it's easier doesn't make it the right resolution to the issue. In the meantime, you'll have to build a basis for "acceptable" and "respectable".


** Eventually you will see a split in the homosexual community those who will claim choice with no quarms and others who feel they have to claim God created them Gay for acceptance.(All in time)



**I've grown board of talking about people's sexual choices I'm more interested in learning about different religions and those wizards and where there power comes from( Are there any wizards on this board that you know of?)

 

[Frencheneesz]

It seems like this has turned into a pseudo battle of religion vs science.

Why do religious people always talk about gaining knowledge, like you gain knowledge by working in a knowledge mine? Knowledge is blah blah blah. Define knowledge.

 

[Voodoo Child]

"...despite their has been no discovery of a homo or hetero sexual gene, and still there is yet another group who believes its choice, which excludes God & science."

"This is my point anyone can claim anything and the homosexual community has made a claim which science can't back up."

You do not have to discover the exact gene to provide evidence of homosexuality being genetically caused. eg. there is a correlation between finger length and fingerprint ridges and homosexuality, twin studies as I mentioned before, the fact it tends to run in families, and homosexuality can be predicted at preschool(to the tune of 75% success) Also homosexuals are more likely to have an identical sequence at a certain location on their X chromosome.
If there WERE a lack of evidence it would not suggest that there is no genetic cause, but just that there is no evidence.
Homosexuals, I suspect, make this claim because they have first person experience of being gay and thus they perceive through introspection that it is innate and fixed rather than changable.
Personally, I think homosexuality is caused by physiological and genetic factors, in the main given the above evidence and that homosexuality rates are constant across all cultures

 

[Lady]

Originally posted by Voodoo Child
"...despite their has been no discovery of a homo or hetero sexual gene, and still there is yet another group who believes its choice, which excludes God & science."

"This is my point anyone can claim anything and the homosexual community has made a claim which science can't back up."

You do not have to discover the exact gene to provide evidence of homosexuality being genetically caused. eg. there is a correlation between finger length and fingerprint ridges and homosexuality, twin studies as I mentioned before, the fact it tends to run in families, and homosexuality can be predicted at preschool(to the tune of 75% success) Also homosexuals are more likely to have an identical sequence at a certain location on their X chromosome.
If there WERE a lack of evidence it would not suggest that there is no genetic cause, but just that there is no evidence.
Homosexuals, I suspect, make this claim because they have first person experience of being gay and thus they perceive through introspection that it is innate and fixed rather than changable.





Personally, I think homosexuality is caused by physiological and genetic factors, in the main given the above evidence and that homosexuality rates are constant across all cultures

Voodoo


Science still hasn't back it up(physiological,genetic) and they can't..............given your name is Voodoo I'm going to make a wild assumption that you know something about the spiritual realm. Now it's my opinion and belief that homosexuality, pedophilia,incest, sex with animals, and other deviant sexual behaviors are influenced by the spiritual realm, and science can't fix what's not tangable. Possession by a spirit is beyond The Scientific Method, unfortunately we don't have many who have the power to perfom exorcism's.(Gift) I do believe people have the ability to change but not with prozac or thordazine. By now I'm sure you know I believe in God, and because there are so many others who have different God's I'll call mine ( God) cool....As I was saying it's more of a spiritual battle.......the moment you want to be free....Satan lets the hyena's out.

 

[Voodoo Child]

Science still hasn't back it up(physiological,genetic) and they can't...... Now it's my opinion and belief that homosexuality, pedophilia,incest, sex with animals, and other deviant sexual behaviors are influenced by the spiritual realm

I see. So how do you explain the correlation between physical and genetic attributes and homosexuality? It seems people with shorter index fingers are targeted by Satan to a greater extent. Beelzebub also likes to check the Xq28 region of the X chromosome of the person he is about to tempt.
If you think that a spiritual explanation of these things fits the data better, then you must have a convincing explanation for the concordance between homosexuality, physical traits and the aforementioned region of the X chromosome. I'd really like to hear it. I've shown a good deal of evidence that suggests homosexuality is indeed the result of biological factors, however, there isn't any evidence at all to suggest that it has spiritual causes. There isn't any evidence at all to even suggest that:

a) There are spirits

b) They like to(and are capable of) messing with people's sexual orientation.

Voodoo Child BTW, is after the Jimi Hendrix song.

edited to fix whacky [] bracket

 

[Xev]

Just out of curiousity, what's with the intellectual hairshirts? Don't any of you realize how futile it is to argue with Lady and her sort?

 

[Tyler]

Now, now Xev; anyone who believes it's more likely we evolved from snakes than monkeys can't be all bad!

 

[Xev]

Tyler:

I'd rather have evolved from Yaks. Good heavens. She could be the next Sir Loone or Fox Mulder.


(I swear, I am not Lady.)

 

[Voodoo Child]

What's a hairshirt?

 

[Xev]

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07113b.htm

 

[Voodoo Child]

Yes, there is the lingering odour of futility. It is worth a try, though.

 

[Lady]

Originally posted by Voodoo Child
I see. So how do you explain the correlation between physical and genetic attributes and homosexuality? It seems people with shorter index fingers are targeted by Satan to a greater extent. Beelzebub also likes to check the Xq28 region of the X chromosome of the person he is about to tempt.
If you think that a spiritual explanation of these things fits the data better, then you must have a convincing explanation for the concordance between homosexuality, physical traits and the aforementioned region of the X chromosome. I'd really like to hear it. I've shown a good deal of evidence that suggests homosexuality is indeed the result of biological factors, however, there isn't any evidence at all to suggest that it has spiritual causes. There isn't any evidence at all to even suggest that:

a) There are spirits

b) They like to(and are capable of) messing with people's sexual orientation.

Voodoo Child BTW, is after the Jimi Hendrix song.

edited to fix whacky [] bracket

Genetic attributes science hasn't discovered...the physical attributes manifested(spiritual realm-possesion) Futhermore, if homosexual behavior is biological that's in the realm of science, and I don't recall any biologist announcing such a find world wide. And what about incest, pedafilian,and those who desire animals.......if homosexuality is biological these must be as well which means creation is the origin for such desires.(False) Now I don't know if you believe in the existence of anything ele's beyond humans or how we came to be.....but there is evidence of spirits.........for example, We like to think we're intelligent human beings and advancing, but let's look at (spirits- physical realm) Smoking, ciggaretts in particular, science has proven it's detrimental to the biological
make up of humans, causing many kinds of fatal cancer's (three dimensional) which not only inflict pain&suffering but shorten our lives dramatically. Scientist have proven this information to be true, but yet ciggaretts are massed marketed and improved with more addictive,deadly posions to kill us faster.......who are what is so sinister to create a product specifically formulated to destroy the biological make up of humans? And why does the Government allow it...........as far as human evolution(BACKWARDS) It is said that ciggaretts kill more people yearly than does all other drugs and alochol combined.......(but yet pot will get you thrown in the slammer-where you can then smoke cigarretts) I know this is not a religious or spiritual forum so I'll stop here.

 

[Lady]

Originally posted by Tyler
Now, now Xev; anyone who believes it's more likely we evolved from snakes than monkeys can't be all bad!

Why didn't the rest of the monkey's evolve into human's?