Have you used a gun?

Ahhhhh...... just sitting here in the garden of my brothers place , looking after his dog , while they are at a wedding ....... 30 degrees celsius .... roses, flowers, a water fountain, birds are singing, shadow , wine and good food.......... life is good .... but typing on this laptop is slow .....

PTSD creates neurological connections (tracks) to the limbic part of the brain - and especially to the corpus amygdalae ( you british probably just call it amygdala) .... so whenever you think of the things that happened ( sometimes not even voluntarily ) - then the amygdala will elicit bad emotions/feelings ...... the therapy combined with beta blocker seems to delete the direct tracks to the limbic system ....... it is still not known exactly how .... but my own theory is, that it happens through the thalamus ( the relay system of the brain ) ..... it is known that beta blockers can modify impulses in thalamus ..........

Anyway, it seems to work .........;)
 
my study has been on the effects of beta blockers on the heart and perfery blood vessels to limit high BP so your going to have to be a little more detailed as to how they work on the brain.

As far as i know (please forgive me if i have it wrong because the little study i have done on this was 2 years ago) beta blockers dont lower arousal they just block the bodies responce to adrenilin (which is really irritating when trying to treat a heart atack) so that the blood vessals cant contract and the heart doesnt contract as hard. As far as im aware there are no Beta receptors in the brain so i dont understand how it would have any effect unless what your doing is stoping the physical symptoms in the same way as diasapram is used for panic atacks. If this is the case wouldnt diasapram have a better effect because it supresses the whole sympathetic arousal rather than just the beta effects. For instance hyperventilation is caused by the alpha receptor which beta blockers dont touch

Now if im compleatly on the wrong track go easy on me:p
 
He,he ...... you are on the wrong track ......there are plenty of beta receptors in the brain .... and the function of beta blockers on PTSD happens in the brain .... and NOT outside in the rest of the body .... hydrophillic beta blockers ( which do not cross the blood brain barrier ) has no effect on PTSD and memory ....

http://www.jneurosci.org/cgi/reprint/19/15/6623.pdf

I guess you mean diazepam .... it affects the gaba-a receptors in formatio reticularis (sedation) and in the limbic system ( anti-anxiety) .... but as far as I know .... then it does not alter the " tracks " in the brain ..........no lasting effect on PTSD ...
 
i did a little resurch myself in relation to this last night and the artical i found seemed to suggest your wrong.

The researchers don't think the beta blocker erases or diminishes the memory.

"Our expectation is that we're reducing the hyperarousal associated with the memory -- we expect that the memory will still be there," explained lead researcher Dr. Margaret Altemus, an associate professor of psychiatry at the Weill College of Medicine at Cornell University, in New York City.

Used to Desensitize?

But this new approach to easing PTSD symptoms isn't without its critics, one of whom worries the drug might be misused to desensitize individuals, such as soldiers, to acts of atrocity.

At this point in the research, though, it's too early to tell how well beta blockers might work even as a therapeutic aid, Altemus said.

"There were two small studies that have already been done using propranolol for PTSD, where they treated people right when the accident happened -- they found people in the emergency room. One study was done in France, and one was done in Boston," she said. "They did find they were able to reduce the [emotional] intensity of traumatic memories by giving people propranolol for the first 10 days or so after an accident."


But Altemus also pointed out that PTSD is rather rare, with less than 10 percent of accident victims experiencing the recurrent flashbacks, isolation and avoidant behaviors that are hallmarks of the condition. So, it wouldn't make sense to hand out propranolol to everyone who'd suffered a traumatic event, she said.
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http://health.dailynewscentral.com/content/view/0001397/51/

This seems to suggest that the target IS the sympathetic nervious system rather than the brain itself. It sounds like they are treating it like panic disorder which is why im confused
 
I've shot many kinds of guns (pistols, revolvers, shotguns, small machine guns, machine guns, rifles, etc.) in army bases and forests with military personel, I also own two year 1911 guns as a part of a family inheritance, plan to buy a new revolver for myself for protection while hiking.
I've been in combat situations as a kid.
 
I hate guns. 2 weeks ago, I went to a friend's house, and he had a gun sitting on the table. I asked me if I saw his gun, and offered to go outside to play with it. I told him I don't want to touch it. I told him what a loser he was for having one. I have never fired a gun in my life. I hate those things. Guns are for losers.
 
lixluke said:
I hate guns. 2 weeks ago, I went to a friend's house, and he had a gun sitting on the table. I asked me if I saw his gun, and offered to go outside to play with it. I told him I don't want to touch it. I told him what a loser he was for having one. I have never fired a gun in my life. I hate those things. Guns are for losers.
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Stop lying.
You don't have friends.
 
lixluke said:
I hate guns. 2 weeks ago, I went to a friend's house, and he had a gun sitting on the table. I asked me if I saw his gun, and offered to go outside to play with it. I told him I don't want to touch it. I told him what a loser he was for having one. I have never fired a gun in my life. I hate those things. Guns are for losers.
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That's a very mature opinion. NOT!!!!

I suppose you think all cops are losers then. Be sure and tell that to the next one you see.
 
I cussed the idiot out. I told him what a jackass he was for having a gun. Especially when he has a baby. I told him playing socom all day or video games is one thing. It does not mean you have to follow along with all the media bullcrap, and go get a gun like a fool. Not to mention, unlike myself who is a weak and frail individual, he is a karate champion. He has no need for a bloody gun. He only has one because he's an idiot. He makes a ton of money in IT. Now he wants to start acting like one of those gun toting jokers.
 
Read-Only said:
That's a very mature opinion. NOT!!!!

I suppose you think all cops are losers then. Be sure and tell that to the next one you see.
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Cops are a bunch of brainless muscleheads who don't have the brains to get a real life. Any idiot can become a police offier. Let's see them try to be a doctor or engineer. Ya right. I have no respect for police officers. Most of them are unprofessional and corrupt anyway.
 
And I have no intentions of going up to a cop and letting him know. I've only been to jail once in my whole life. It was for 36hrs. A police officer was harassing my friends and I. He was going to let us go, but I was not going to let him get away with it, so I cussed him out. He wrote some fake charge on the paper which was a complete lie. He was just mad because I cussed him out. I wasn't breaking any laws. He tried to get me on being drunk or high, but I don't drink or smoke. Then I ended up in jail all night. The trial was supposed to be the next morning, but the stupid judge took the day off. I ended up staying an extra 24 hrs. Then when I plaid not guilty, the bailiff next to me told me I would be in jail for 2 more weeks waiting for trial. Thus, I plead no contest. I was found guilty adjudication withheld. I then had to pay a ton of money going through a really bad process of getting this expunged which inevitably lead to me ending up in jail again because of mix up in paperwork be these incompetents. Finally, there was a trial, and I was found not guilty.
 
Asguard said:
i did a little resurch myself in relation to this last night and the artical i found seemed to suggest your wrong.



http://health.dailynewscentral.com/content/view/0001397/51/

This seems to suggest that the target IS the sympathetic nervious system rather than the brain itself. It sounds like they are treating it like panic disorder which is why im confused
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Dear Asguard ,

I had to look it up :
Research done by Rickel et al, 1986 showed no significant effect on anxiety disorders in humans by a hydrophile beta blocker , which made scientists in those days to claim no effect by beta blockers on anxiety disorders (Lydiard et al 1988) .....however later research with lipophile beta blockers showed significant effect on anxiety disorders in humans - and research by Cooper at al, 1990 and also Tyrer et al 1991, concluded that the effect on anxiety were due to subtype beta-1 receptors in the brain.
Since hydrophile beta-blockers do not cross into the brain - and had no effect , while lipophile beta-blockers do cross into the brain - and had significant effect ; then there are strong evidence that it all happens inside the brain ......and at least 2 studies showed, that it is due to subtype beta-1 receptors in the brain ...........

In humans memory is not erased , patients will still remember what happened - but the link to bad emotions/feelings elicited by the amygdala is severely weakened .......or as this article says :
"it seems to disconnect emotions from memory " .......and " subjects remembered the story but without any emotional depth " .......

http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/neuro/memory_drugs_sd.html
 
so why do they still use diazapram (sorry i think it goes by the brand name valium in the US), or SSRI's to treat anxiaty?

I know this is the case because i HAVE anxiaty disorder and was perscribed SSRI's and dizampram until the SSRI's kicked in. I chose not to use the seditive but the script is still around somewhere:p
 
lixluke said:
And I have no intentions of going up to a cop and letting him know. I've only been to jail once in my whole life. It was for 36hrs. A police officer was harassing my friends and I. He was going to let us go, but I was not going to let him get away with it, so I cussed him out. He wrote some fake charge on the paper which was a complete lie. He was just mad because I cussed him out. I wasn't breaking any laws. He tried to get me on being drunk or high, but I don't drink or smoke. Then I ended up in jail all night. The trial was supposed to be the next morning, but the stupid judge took the day off. I ended up staying an extra 24 hrs. Then when I plaid not guilty, the bailiff next to me told me I would be in jail for 2 more weeks waiting for trial. Thus, I plead no contest. I was found guilty adjudication withheld. I then had to pay a ton of money going through a really bad process of getting this expunged which inevitably lead to me ending up in jail again because of mix up in paperwork be these incompetents. Finally, there was a trial, and I was found not guilty.
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i'll bet your friends loved you for that.
 
S.A.M. said:
How many of you have actually used a gun?

Under what circumstances?

I've never used one. I've seen one while I was working with the army and that was because the guy was cleaning it, not using it.

Apart from that soldier, I don't know anyone who owns a gun.

I've never been shot at either, although I twice was in situations [once riots in Mumbai, where cops had guns, second, a deranged guy in Saudi Arabia] when I was around people who were shooting.
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I've used firearms quite a bit as a competitive shooter and hunter. Why do you ask?
 
For a British civilian, I've shot a fair few things. I started with air rifles, and air pistols, and still own a few to this day.

We progressed to shotguns, and I've shot side by side, over under, and automatic shotguns. I've also shot a modified SLR barreled to accept .22 cartridges (cheaper way to train people to use it, and safer) a .22 semiautomatic pistol, a 9mm semiautomatic pistol, and a .38 revolver.

I like shooting, but like responsible, registered gun ownership more.
 
Don't own any, but in the army I had to learn M16s (called them C7s), the M249 (called the C9 :rolleyes:) and some bloody pistol. Oh, and coaxial MG.
 
Define "use".

Had to learn how to fire M-16 when in USAF.

Never owned one, but my first husband did have a rifle. Once, when I was alone with a month-old baby, someone started breaking into window. My ex had gone out less than 10 minutes earlier, so the jerk must have been waiting for "the man of the house" to leave. I pulled the bolt on the rifle (makes a VERY distinct sound), and said loudly and slowly (helps to keep tremor out of voice! :D): "Please open window all the way. I want all blood to splatter outward." He fled.

[Edit] About a year later I was VERY happy to move out of that neighborhood!
 
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