Sorry not really
Most of my reading is from my book collection library (real books)
And chatting with those in the field for the latest info
My books are well out of date
Genetic Memory
- Thread starter The God
- Start date
Most of my reading is from my book collection library (real books)
And chatting with those in the field for the latest info
My books are well out of date
Genetic information as we know it is not as sophisticated as our interpretation of "memory" -- if evidence existed contrary to this it would be a valid question but this is pseudoscience. Let's not make judgments upon what we haven't observed.
Ummmm I haven't observed 10 quadrillion things
Will you just give me one to make judgements on?
On second thoughts lets not do such for even one
I did a bit of digging and came up with
Medical Epigenetics by
T O Tollefsbol
With about 60 contributors
By Academic Press 2016
It's a PDF format book of 901 pages of which I have only read page 3
But I would not put this book in the woo section of a book shop
More in the Academic Medical Reference section
Hope this helps
exchemist
Valued Senior Member
Golly I don't think I'm going to pay for a 900pp tome on this! But thanks for looking.I did a bit of digging and came up with
Medical Epigenetics by
T O Tollefsbol
With about 60 contributors
By Academic Press 2016
It's a PDF format book of 901 pages of which I have only read page 3
But I would not put this book in the woo section of a book shop
More in the Academic Medical Reference section
Hope this helps
Not sure where you are but here the library had a budget for requested books
Some they might get on loan from another library
Others they might buy if they thought it might upgrade the collection or be a suitable addition
Mine I found on line
It looks very very technical and well above my casual interest
However if I do happen to come across any aspects I will post them
The chapter arrangement should make it easy to check anything which might crop up in this thread
If I sniff woo I might be able to check how much is ligit and how deep it has been buried in Cowpat
Cheers
There is some evidence. I think thats why epigenetics. In fact more research on epigenetics could lead to custom memory species without altering the original genetic traits.
Well it is certainly not woo, but pseudo yes it could be, till some more conclusive stuff surfaces.
If you can find this book I think you would find it a very technical educational academic read which is far from woo
My dismissal of much earlier post has to do with the wild leaps of speculation (which is full to the brim of woo covered in Cowpat) and which I still stand by
It is the over the top hype which is woo
There is some evidence. I think thats why epigenetics. In fact more research on epigenetics could lead to custom memory species without altering the original genetic traits.
This is woo
Not going to happen
Well it is certainly not woo, but pseudo yes it could be, till some more conclusive stuff surfaces
Read the book I have referenced and I think you will find it is not pseudo and it details quite extensive research going on
Again it is the hype which is the woo
Michael 345
Where is the hype? And why are you cluttering this thread with extensive use of woo, bunkum and cowpat and what not.
If you have read that book which you referred, then you are free to share the extensive research. It may be of use to others. Do not repeat this woo soo thingie, best for you in such cases is to declare a thread or topic woo and stay away.
Where is the hype? And why are you cluttering this thread with extensive use of woo, bunkum and cowpat and what not.
If you have read that book which you referred, then you are free to share the extensive research. It may be of use to others. Do not repeat this woo soo thingie, best for you in such cases is to declare a thread or topic woo and stay away.
If you are unable to detect hype I am sorry for you
I call it as I see it
If you are following the thread you should have noted that the book is in a 901 PDF format of which I stated I have only read page 3
I will read more in any spare time I have but I will also use the book and quote from the book if I think hype is being used to exaggerate the abilities of Epigenetics
Yourself before epigenetics came up
First mention of epigenetics
Questioning if epigenetics can be a mechanism for memory transfer
Reference to a article which I read at the time
and my reply was
Again there are two aspects here which are not linked epigenetics and learnt memory
a system which works on the expression of a gene (epigenetics)
is being asked to absorb a learnt memory
(learnt memory)
and use the absorbed memory to modify a gene
NOT to modify gene expression which is its job
but change the gene structure which is not its job
PLUS instill into the gene a learnt memory which is an impossibility
NOT GOING TO HAPPEN
There is no evidence supporting the notion that acquired knowledge can be transmitted genetically.
Some Posters have mentioned the migratory behavior of birds as a counter example to the above claim.
Some Posters have mentioned various savants as evidence of the inheritance of acquired knowledge.
Mozart’s family were musicians.
When Mozart he was circa 3 years old, he was an observer of his sister’s music lessons & experimented with her keyboard instrument (I do not think it was a modern piano). He noticed that certain combinations sounded pleasing while others did not.
It does not take much musical ability to notice that CEG is more pleasing than EFG.
By age 5, Mozart composed some original music. While he surely had an unusual aptitude for music, his early experiences observing his sister’s lessons & his experimentation with a keyboard supports the notion that he learned rather than inheriting musical abilities.
The mathematical savants I remember reading about went through a learning phase rather than showing the abilities suddenly as would be expected of genetic inheritance.
BTW: Infants do show evidence of inherited knowledge of dangerous situations. The most well known has been shown by experiments on a checker board arrangement of transparent & opaque squares. Infants avoid the transparent squares indicating an inherited fear of falling from a potentially dangerous height.
The above seems to be a worthwhile fear with evolutionary survival value.
I wonder about investigations of identical twins raised by different families. I have read about such individuals showing a lot of similar characteristics which would be expected to be inherited.
I have never read about the inheritance of some special ability which was learned by a birth parent.
An unusual aptitude for mathematics seems inheritable. The knowledge of how to do cube roots via successive approximations does not seem inheritable.
Some Posters have mentioned the migratory behavior of birds as a counter example to the above claim.
Birds were contemporaries of dinosaurs & have been in existence for circa 150 million years. That is more than enough time for the evolution of their migratory behavior, which is a useful & not complex behavior.
Some Posters have mentioned various savants as evidence of the inheritance of acquired knowledge.
Mozart’s musical ability & the mathematical abilities of some so called idiot savants are sometimes mentioned in this context.
Mozart’s family were musicians.
When Mozart he was circa 3 years old, he was an observer of his sister’s music lessons & experimented with her keyboard instrument (I do not think it was a modern piano). He noticed that certain combinations sounded pleasing while others did not.
It does not take much musical ability to notice that CEG is more pleasing than EFG.
By age 5, Mozart composed some original music. While he surely had an unusual aptitude for music, his early experiences observing his sister’s lessons & his experimentation with a keyboard supports the notion that he learned rather than inheriting musical abilities.
The mathematical savants I remember reading about went through a learning phase rather than showing the abilities suddenly as would be expected of genetic inheritance.
BTW: Infants do show evidence of inherited knowledge of dangerous situations. The most well known has been shown by experiments on a checker board arrangement of transparent & opaque squares. Infants avoid the transparent squares indicating an inherited fear of falling from a potentially dangerous height.
The above seems to be a worthwhile fear with evolutionary survival value.
I wonder about investigations of identical twins raised by different families. I have read about such individuals showing a lot of similar characteristics which would be expected to be inherited.
I have never read about the inheritance of some special ability which was learned by a birth parent.
An unusual aptitude for mathematics seems inheritable. The knowledge of how to do cube roots via successive approximations does not seem inheritable.
Not sure if any scientific studies have been made (and to lazy to search)
I do recall a device being peddled which played classical music (? other types of inputs) though speakers attached to a pregnant abdomen
From memory the idea was to give the child a application of classical music
Can't recall any claims of it working
I suspect even after Say after brain/baby is sufficiently developed there is no awareness or context
Both of which I would contend would be critical to learning anything
I did a bit of digging and came up with
Medical Epigenetics by
T O Tollefsbol
With about 60 contributors
By Academic Press 2016
It's a PDF format book of 901 pages of which I have only read page 3
But I would not put this book in the woo section of a book shop
More in the Academic Medical Reference section
Hope this helps
You would not put this book in the " woo " section ?
How informed of you . Out 901 pgs. You read three and have the opinion of a " woo " section ?
Really ?
No I would not put it in the woo section
You read three and have the opinion of a " woo " section ?
This part seems to indicate I would???
I wouldn't
I have read up to 3 pages
Have also sampled others
The general tone of the book seems to be research on epigenetics which (my post observation of another post which the poster seem to think it supports genetic memory transfer (which I consider it does not))
*
epigenetics is an annotation or editing of the genome that defines which genes will be silenced in order to streamline protein production or squelch unnecessary redundancy.
That annotation, they say, does not and cannot permanently change the original manuscript (i.e., DNA), but merely access to the manuscript
So the book of DNA remains intact but some pages are unavailable
It also appears those pages can be accessed in offspring and may be other pages locked out
This is in line with how genes are expressed
*
I think the book appears to have academic credentials but it might just be 60+ crack pots venting
Sorry I don't have time to critique 900 pages but unscientificly I will go with my gut
Your welcome to read the 900 pages and say it belongs with the woo section and I will accept your finding
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Short answer
More to come
epigenetics
ˌɛpɪdʒəˈnɛtɪks/
noun
BIOLOGY
- the study of changes in organisms caused by modification of gene expression rather than alteration of the genetic code itself.
Stand by for more
Uncertain when
Nyepi day here in Bali and hotel WiFi dodgy and I am missing a code password for my local pocket WiFi