Free speech, personal responsibility, respect for others, and general conduct

Much like Adam, I learned a lot in the military. Both what I thought I was capable of and what I really was capable of. That I was good at what I did. Too damn good. I also learned I could be anywhere in the world, at an time, within in 24 hours. No, the plane doesn't stop to let you out. (I will not go into rough spots encountered. Nor when or where.)

I learned just how easy and just how quick you can make a mess of someone's life, an area, or a country. Blowing things up is rather easy, so is killing. You can never go back and say, "Wished it didn't have to be this way." You do what you have to do to stay alive. It isn't pretty.

Now if you want to talk emotion that is the final answer. No one comes back to talk to you except in your dreams. Those dreams stay with you the rest of your life. You learn there is a veneer, a skin over reality that can change in an instant. A way of looking at things that is not naturally what you are born with. It has to be developed. The military does that; that too you remember the rest of your life. Somewhere always, there is that corner, that recess, in the back of your mind that is looking, independent of you and your consciousness that is guardedly looking at things from the survival mode.

Where is this going? Simple. Emotions charge things. Emotions make you respond without thinking. After all, where did we get the coined phrase of "Going Postal"? Some nut took it personal and responded in person. Too many are the examples that arise when emotions get involved. Seems pretty far out for the topic doesn't it? After all you're just a personality behind a computer.

To respect someone, doesn't mean you have the ability to rule over their lives. Each person deserves a modicum of respect, be it wary or be it familiar. To be one to toss out common degradations as we have seen, only fans the fires. In many cases that is not smart. I have also seen too many bottles broken up on someone's head when they forgot that. Too many knives and too many guns. As you do here, so will you do in life. The real one. Consider carefully how you respond, one day you may well face what you have sown. There will not be a computer screen to filter the response then…

It is so easy to just be nice. Doesn't cost anything, doesn't tax you. I have been occasionally noted to be "thin skinned". As I said there is always that recess that looks...
 
I second that. Words on a computer screen can hurt as much as words in the real world, and they can also bring joy and love.
What do you chose to bring to others?
 
What do you chose to bring to others?
Click to expand...
anything that brings some good to me.....
I'm in a deep mess and have enough of problems...
...so the answer from me is - whatever as long as it doesn't bring me into a deeper shit...
ciao...
 
Yes, I guess most people want good things to happen to them. So remember that in your posts too, that what you give is what you will get back in return. :)
And also, that what is gained with violence, must be kept with violence. So if you are trying to get respect by acting abusively, you must be more and more abusive all the time, to keep that respect, which isn't actually respect, but fear. No real friendship or real communication will ever derive from that. Just threats and defence or submission to those threats.
 
And also, that what is gained with violence, must be kept with violence
Click to expand...
Not if I kill the ones from which I gained;):D MUHAHAHAAA


Anywayz all what I want is that I could run away in my dreamworld....need peace...or weed.....

don't mind me- temporary psyhological problems
 
Avatar, we adore you - temporary psychological problems or not.

Or at least people had better PRETEND to.

And - holy shit - did I write a psychoanalytical post gibbering about my childhood and Fredrich Nietzsche?

*Squinches eyes shut and tries to remember how much she had drank*

It is so easy to just be nice. Doesn't cost anything, doesn't tax you.
Click to expand...

It's boring as all hell.

I said it before, I say it again:

It's the bloody internet, people, get a fucking life.
 
I agree with basically everyone here in some way or another:

1. You don't have to be nice in what you say.
...although...
2. An insult should not try to replace or augment intelectual content.
 
This is a copy of a post I placed in the RELIGION forum. My apologies for multiple postings but I think this is relevant.

Words are just words they can’t hurt. Perhaps this is true, but words portray ideas and intent and these can hurt but can also create pleasure.

The wrong words can cause wars.

People have murdered because they were insulted by mere words.

Three short words can communicate love and the result can be extraordinary.

Words of hate can cause deep emotional stress.

Words can mobilize a nation into action.

Words can cause many emotions and make you cry or laugh, but these are only mere words, right?

Words can create friction – kinda sounds like parts of sciforums.

Repeated often enough words can cause indoctrination of dangerous ideas.

Words can convince others of your point of view.

The right words can create credibility and respect where your ideas will last and be used.

The wrong words repeated often enough will mean you can become an outcast and be ignored.

Words are the most powerful weapon and influential force ever developed by the human race.

Not everything you think needs to be expressed. If you dislike someone then do you need to let him or her know? Who would benefit? If you gain pleasure from upsetting someone else then is that questionable ability really something you want to pursue? Why not simply remain silent?

The idea “if you can’t say anything good then don’t say anything at all”, has enormous power to prevent destructive actions.

Profanities are words that portray virtually no meaning and are specifically used to offend and harm others. I cannot imagine any valid argument that can support such a strategy in an arena intended to share ideas and to discuss ideas.

It is true that many here have very deeply held beliefs and ideas that reflect the wonderful diversity of the human race. If we cannot tolerate the ideas of others in this tiny microcosm of a debating forum then what hope is there for the human race?

Sciforums has attracted many members here because it is more civilized than many other websites. I value that condition and would very much like that to continue. I will strongly support others here who share that ideal and will certainly support the other moderators in an effort to enforce such ideals.

I would rather support Bebelina who might have a more narrow view on acceptable behavior rather than have to read mindless torrents of irrelevant profanities and abuse of others. Note that this is not me being overly sensitive but rather an expression of having seen this tiresome behavior so often that I’m moved to help prevent its damaging effects. And that is purely selfish on my part because I have enjoyed many valuable exchanges of real ideas here and I intend to help ensure that that continues.

Is that 2 or 10 cents?

Cris

PS. Please choose your next words carefully.
 
Cris:

That may be, but we are online. Are we going to start beating the crap out of each other over a flamewar?

We cannot, physically.

If we cannot tolerate the ideas of others in this tiny microcosm of a debating forum then what hope is there for the human race?
Click to expand...

Exactly. Why can't some of us tolerate the fact that different people have different modes of expression?

Instead of recognizing the fact that different people communicate in different ways, the weak-minded amoung us scream "MORE MODERATION! MORE MODERATION! BANNINGS! BANNINGS!"

It is an unfortunate facet of human nature that the first response to disagreement is often intolerence. Throughout history, those in power and those not in power reacted to dissention - whether political or religious - by killing the dissenter.

A sign of true weakness. As is the new call for moderation.

We should be able to deal with incivility. The problem, as Congratulations pointed out, is when incivility is simply a way of hiding a weak argument.

But even so, how does moderation or banning such a member help? Except in the case of outright trolling, such as that of Ralph Nader, Mallory Knox and the various toostupids, banning an acerbic member will result in a climate of fear, in which every member is walking on broken glass to avoid such a fate.

So banning more often is unproductive. Okay. What about extra moderation?

The problem is that the more moderators, the more moderation. And again, we have the climate of evaluation - "Is this topic offensive? Will I harm somone's delicate feelings?"

Self-criticism is a good thing, but can often stifle a good thought. What if Riemann had discarded his work when he realized exactly how fucking bizzare non-euclidian geometry can be?

Cris, you have shown orthodox Christianity to be baseless in the Religion forum. Is this not offensive? Would you like to delete such offensive material?

I'm wagering that you would not.

So why don't we just make the attempt to show a little tolerence for other veiws, and other modes of expression?

In the words of Rodney King:

Why can't we just get along?
 
"Why can't we just get along?" Remind yourself of that phrase every time you are about to post anything. Because you certainly don't seem interested in gettin along with anybody.
It makes no difference wether the words are on the internet or spoken out loud in the real world, they are still there, with the same meaning, with the same intention and they cause the same reactions. Maybe if you can grasp that, then there is a possibility of getting along.
 
Originally posted by Cris
Profanities are words that portray virtually no meaning and are specifically used to offend and harm others. I cannot imagine any valid argument that can support such a strategy in an arena intended to share ideas and to discuss ideas.
Click to expand...

Hmm...I totally agree with you on this Cris...except errr...on one little part...:D

Profanity is ok for sexual talk and conversations.

But...I just advise a language filter (the DJ site has it for the reason of forum etiquette), you can't expect everyone to listen and not use profanity, for some it is a part of their lives...it's their view.

We all have our convictions in life, it is erroneous to say your conviction is right over another. This is where conflicts arise. So it's best to keep an open-mind. I agree with you most on the idea that profanity is used most of the time for abusive purposes. And I advise against it...:)
 
Xev,

sciforums.com Rules

Registration to this forum is free! We do insist that you abide by the rules and policies detailed below. If you agree to the terms, please press the Agree button at the end of the page.

Although the administrators and moderators of sciforums.com will attempt to keep all objectionable messages off this forum, it is impossible for us to review all messages. All messages express the views of the author, and neither the owners of sciforums.com or Jelsoft Enterprises Limited (developers of vBulletin) will be held responsible for the content of any message.

By clicking the Agree button, you warrant that you will not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar, sexually-orientated, hateful, threatening, or otherwise violative of any laws.

The owners of sciforums.com have the right to remove, edit, move or close any thread for any reason. Your membership at sciforums.com may be revoked without prior warning for any reason.

My Position.

The highlighted text is the only rule here.

I believe the only truly just method for reaching a decision is by consensus (i.e. UNANIMITY).

Everyone here agreed to this rule – that is consensus.

You are highly intelligent and must know exactly what this means as well as understanding the spirit of the rule.

I think the rule is clear and very simple and very valuable.

I have enormous respect for you and Bebelina, and GB. Your mind is very sharp, certainly sharper than mine, but I’d love to see it used in more productive discussions so I can continue to learn from you. Obey the rule that you agreed to and put the childish profanity gibberish behind you, it is a foolish distraction to your intellectual growth – move on, fast. There are many far more important things to consider than this nonsense.

With the very best regards.
Cris
 
Xev,

Why can't some of us tolerate the fact that different people have different modes of expression?
Click to expand...
A murderer also has an interesting mode of expression. As with most things that are concerned with reality there are shades of gray. Some forms of expression are more appropriate in different arenas.

I believe Dave’s idea for sciforums was more along the lines of scientific style debate and not one where school playground vulgarities have a role. The only rule at sciforums seems to me to emphasize that position.

Cris
 
That may be, but we are online.
Click to expand...

There seems to be the conception that because we are just typing the words and not talking face to face that near anything goes or should be permissable. I say that is not the case.

Would you use this type of behaviour and words to talk to someone you know on the phone? After all you are not face to face there, either. I dare say things are a little different and that you would act different as opposed to how we see others displaying their actions and reactions here.

This apparent selective belief that words can not hurt is a crock. You have only to look at history to see just how effective words can be and are. Yes, they have the power to hurt. Not only that, they have the power to inspire others to perform acts both good and bad.

Sciforums has always enjoyed the atmosphere to say what you have to say in a reasonably civil way and recieve a reasonably civilized responce. Many are the comments I have read of others finding sciforums and of what a breath of fresh air it was after having experienced places like AOL. This is not AOL. Should you feel that you need that type of atmosphere to be yourself then by all means visit it and be at home. It was never what sciforums was about.
 
Wet1:
There seems to be the conception that because we are just typing the words and not talking face to face that near anything goes or should be permissable. I say that is not the case.
Click to expand...

That is an extremely poor straw man of my argument. I expected better of you.

Cris:

A murderer also has an interesting mode of expression. As with most things that are concerned with reality there are shades of gray. Some forms of expression are more appropriate in different arenas.
Click to expand...

Given. Yet I do not think that the sky will fall because of a few profanities.

I'd advise you that condescention is a sure way to lose my respect, which you now posess in abundance.
 
Unfortunately, it goes straight to the heart of the matter. The belief that anyone can act contrary to the good of the whole or the rules that apply. That those rules, whether implied or stated should be ignored. That in essence is why society lives by laws. It can be no different here as we are a reflection of society.

To say that it is a strawman arguement in no way removes it's validity.
 
*Smiles indulgently*

Strawmen, Wet1, are by definition invalid arguments.

As for this:

Unfortunately, it goes straight to the heart of the matter. The belief that anyone can act contrary to the good of the whole or the rules that apply. That those rules, whether implied or stated should be ignored. That in essence is why society lives by laws. It can be no different here as we are a reflection of society.
Click to expand...

Unfortunatly, you have not shown this.

And unfortunatly, that is not why law exists. Law exists because most are too weak to restrain their more nasty tendencies as humans.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top