End of Ice Age

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Visitor:

I know you've read about this a lot, and believe it, but would you mind sharing some of your citations/references, so I could read it too?

Where does it talk about Goliath having four brothers? Where does it talk about Joshua destroying kingdoms of giants? So far as I can tell, the books of the Bible only speak of Goliath, whom I believed was simply an abberration of his tribe, not from a tribe of giants allied with others.

I am well aware that we have only spotty historical accounts of a vast period of history, and oftentimes they are folkloric in telling, often written years after the fact.
 
Sure, no problem.

As for the references, here's something worth looking at while I'm digging up some archives for you.
Maybe so.....maybe not.

This may not be to conclusive, but take a look at the body in this sarcophagus....it's all legs almost.

What's wrong with this picture?.....other than the fact it is shy a couple of hands and doesn't have a head!

This was found earlier today.....current events.

http://english.pravda.ru/news/science/01-12-2006/85741-skeleton-0
 
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Walter L. Wagner said:
Visitor:

-Where does it talk about Goliath having four brothers?

-Where does it talk about Joshua destroying kingdoms of giants?

So far as I can tell, the books of the Bible only speak of Goliath, whom I believed was simply an abberration of his tribe, not from a tribe of giants allied with others.
Click to expand...

The Anakims
JOSHUA 14:12
Now therefore give me this mountain, whereof the LORD spake in that day; for thou heardest in that day how the Anakims [were] there, and [that] the cities [were] great [and] fenced: if so be the LORD [will be] with me, then I shall be able to drive them out, as the LORD said.
JOSHUA 14:13
And Joshua blessed him, and gave unto Caleb the son of Jephunneh Hebron for an inheritance.
JOSHUA 14:14
Hebron therefore became the inheritance of Caleb the son of Jephunneh the Kenezite unto this day, because that he wholly followed the LORD God of Israel.
JOSHUA 14:15
And the name of Hebron before [was] Kirjatharba; [which Arba was] a great man among the Anakims. And the land had rest from war.
-Read all Joshuah chapter 12 for record of the 31 kingdoms the children of Israel overthrew to take the promised land in Joshua's lifetime.....

(Warning not to marry among them)
JOSHUA 23:11-13 ¶ Take good heed therefore unto yourselves, that ye love the LORD your God.
Else if ye do in any wise go back, and cleave unto the remnant of these nations, [even] these that remain among you, and shall make marriages with them, and go in unto them, and they to you:
Know for a certainty that the LORD your God will no more drive out [any of] these nations from before you; but they shall be snares and traps unto you, and scourges in your sides, and thorns in your eyes, until ye perish from off this good land which the LORD your God hath given you.

-JOSHUA 11:21-22 (Tells of the giant survivors that fled to the Gath area...1000 years before David.)

JOSHUA 11:21 And at that time came Joshua, and cut off the Anakims from the mountains, from Hebron, from Debir, from Anab, and from all the mountains of Judah, and from all the mountains of Israel: Joshua destroyed them utterly with their cities.
JOSHUA 11:22 There was none of the Anakims left in the land of the children of Israel: only in Gaza, in Gath, and in Ashdod, there remained.

As I said before, here is some of what Esau's people (Israel's brother) and their armies dispatched.....

DEUTERONOMY 2:8
8 ¶ And when we passed by from our brethren the children of Esau, which dwelt in Seir, through the way of the plain from Elath, and from Eziongaber, we turned and passed by the way of the wilderness of Moab.
DEUTERONOMY 2:9
9 And the LORD said unto me, Distress not the Moabites, neither contend with them in battle: for I will not give thee of their land [for] a possession; because I have given Ar unto the children of Lot [for] a possession.
DEUTERONOMY 2:10
10 The Emims dwelt therein in times past, a people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims;
DEUTERONOMY 2:11
11 Which also were accounted giants, as the Anakims; but the Moabites call them Emims.
DEUTERONOMY 2:12
12 The Horims also dwelt in Seir beforetime; but the children of Esau succeeded them, when they had destroyed them from before them, and dwelt in their stead; as Israel did unto the land of his possession, which the LORD gave unto them.
DEUTERONOMY 2:19
19 And [when] thou comest nigh over against the children of Ammon, distress them not, nor meddle with them: for I will not give thee of the land of the children of Ammon [any] possession; because I have given it unto the children of Lot [for] a possession.
DEUTERONOMY 2:20
20 (That also was accounted a land of giants: giants dwelt therein in old time; and the Ammonites call them Zamzummims;
DEUTERONOMY 2:21
21 A people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims; but the LORD destroyed them before them; and they succeeded them, and dwelt in their stead:
DEUTERONOMY 2:22
22 As he did to the children of Esau, which dwelt in Seir, when he destroyed the Horims from before them; and they succeeded them, and dwelt in their stead even unto this day:

Even before Joshua took over, Mose lead Israel against giants before they crossed the river Jordan
DEUTERONOMY 3:7
7 But all the cattle, and the spoil of the cities, we took for a prey to ourselves.
DEUTERONOMY 3:8
8 And we took at that time out of the hand of the two kings of the Amorites the land that [was] on this side Jordan, from the river of Arnon unto mount Hermon;
DEUTERONOMY 3:9
9 ([Which] Hermon the Sidonians call Sirion; and the Amorites call it Shenir;
DEUTERONOMY 3:10
All the cities of the plain, and all Gilead, and all Bashan, unto Salchah and Edrei, cities of the kingdom of Og in Bashan.
DEUTERONOMY 3:11
For only Og king of Bashan remained of the remnant of giants; behold, his bedstead [was] a bedstead of iron; [is] it not in Rabbath of the children of Ammon? nine cubits [was] the length thereof, and four cubits the breadth of it, after the cubit of a man.
DEUTERONOMY 3:12
And this land, [which] we possessed at that time, from Aroer, which [is] by the river Arnon, and half mount Gilead, and the cities thereof, gave I unto the Reubenites and to the Gadites.
DEUTERONOMY 3:13
And the rest of Gilead, and all Bashan, [being] the kingdom of Og, gave I unto the half tribe of Manasseh; all the region of Argob, with all Bashan, which was called the land of giants.

The trouble the 12 spies saw at the river with Moses, their lack of faith - the evil report

NUMBERS 13:27
And they told him, and said, We came unto the land whither thou sentest us, and surely it floweth with milk and honey; and this [is] the fruit of it.
NUMBERS 13:28
Nevertheless the people [be] strong that dwell in the land, and the cities [are] walled, [and] very great: and moreover we saw the children of Anak there.
NUMBERS 13:29
The Amalekites dwell in the land of the south: and the Hittites, and the Jebusites, and the Amorites, dwell in the mountains: and the Canaanites dwell by the sea, and by the coast of Jordan.
NUMBERS 13:30
And Caleb stilled the people before Moses, and said, Let us go up at once, and possess it; for we are well able to overcome it.
NUMBERS 13:31
But the men that went up with him said, We be not able to go up against the people; for they [are] stronger than we.
NUMBERS 13:32
And they brought up an evil report of the land which they had searched unto the children of Israel, saying, The land, through which we have gone to search it, [is] a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it [are] men of a great stature.
NUMBERS 13:33
And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, [which come] of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

There are more, the list of giant kingdoms and races in days of old is extensive.
Going back further - to Abraham's day......Some giants descended from Canaan, Noah's grandson through Ham

GENESIS 11:31-32
31 And Terah took Abram his son, and Lot the son of Haran his son's son, and Sarai his daughter in law, his son Abram's wife; and they went forth with them from Ur of the Chaldees, to go into the land of Canaan; and they came unto Haran, and dwelt there. And the days of Terah were two hundred and five years: and Terah died in Haran.

GENESIS CHAPTER 12-6
Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee:
And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:
And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed. So Abram departed, as the LORD had spoken unto him; and Lot went with him: and Abram [was] seventy and five years old when he departed out of Haran.
And Abram took Sarai his wife, and Lot his brother's son, and all their substance that they had gathered, and the souls that they had gotten in Haran; and they went forth to go into the land of Canaan; and into the land of Canaan they came.And Abram passed through the land unto the place of Sichem, unto the plain of Moreh. And the Canaanite [was] then in the land.

That was just some of the list from after the flood.....that sprung up from some of Noah's children.
 
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Walter,
My previous post focused on the history of Giants after the flood.

This post will focus on giants before the flood, and how they came to be.
By the time Noah boarded the Ark, The two linages of man had already mixed.

GENESIS 6:4
There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare [children] to them, the same [became] mighty men which [were] of old, men of renown.

Notice the wording....the giants were already in the Earth when the sons of God took wives of the daughters of men.

The giants were not the sons of God as mainstream religions teach....
The "sons of God" were the children of Adam, who was himself made in the image of God.
The "daughters of men"....were of the children of Cain, who was fathered by a giant......an animal called a serpent, just below human, a pre-human, sub-human race.

Notice the exact way the record of God sets forth the account of the births of Cain, Abel and Seth.
Genesis 4:1, "And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord. And she again bare his brother Abel."
Genesis 4:25, "And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth..."
There are THREE sons born from TWO acts of carnal knowledge by Adam.
Eve had in her womb TWO sons (twins) from SEPARATE impregnations.

She was carrying twins, with Cain's conception sometime previous to that of Abel's.

To those who think that this is not possible, let it be known that the medical records are replete with cases where women have carried twins who were of separate ova and separate insemination with the fertilization of the eggs being days apart, and NOT ONLY SO, but some of the records show that the twins were fathered by separate males.
Now why did this have to be so?
Why was it that the seed of the serpent must come this way?
Man was created for God. Man was to be the temple of God....(Adam)

Since Cain murdered Abel....the linage of Adam was passed on through Seth...i.e "the sons of God"

Satan is a spirit. He also wants to in-dwell man even as God so does.
But God has reserved to Himself that right. Satan cannot do that.
God alone appeared in human flesh.
Satan could not do that. He does not have creative powers.
The only way for Satan to accomplish what he wanted to do was to enter the serpent in Eden even as he entered by evil spirits into the swine at Gadara.
God does not enter animals; but Satan can and will to accomplish his ends. He could not have a child directly by Eve as did God by Mary, so he entered into the serpent and then beguiled Eve.
He (the serpent) seduced Eve and by her did Satan have a child vicariously...(Cain)
Cain bore the full spiritual characteristics of Satan and the animalistic (sensual, fleshly) characteristic of the serpent.
No wonder the bible said that Cain was of that wicked one. He was.

The linage of the giants came from the serpent, and was passed on through Cain..."the sons of men"

This exposes the dual linage of man.
The othodox explanation to the world does not.
It claims the "sons of God" were giant fallen angels, and the "daughters of men" were the children of Adam.
That is the error.

When the giant children of Cain mixed with the more spiritual children of Seth who possessed near 1000 year lifespans and near supernatural power of healing and prophetic sight.....it created a mixture of both.
Just before the world was destroyed.

There is were your legends of mighty men.....men of renoun came from.
Your greek gods....the stuff of lore.

It really happened.......the basis for the legends anyway.

That my friends is ............. History 101.
 
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Visitor:

Thanks for the references. Checked them out.

Joshua had his work cut out for him, going against 'armies' of men that were of great stature (very much taller than he), including exceptionally large ones, such that they had been deemed giants by the neighbors.

Too bad it doesn't give actual heights. I imagine that the men of 'great stature' would have been 6'6" to 7', and the giants of them would have been 8'-9'. Clearly, in smaller groups, large size has its advantage, and such giants would have been able to do as they pleased, without others trying to hold them back.

We know for a fact that humans have formed races of varying sizes; the Japanese of today are much shorter than the average; the Pygmys are very short (4'-5'); some races of Africans are 6'6" on average, whereas the 'average' man is about 5'10". Sorry this is not metric, I'm used to thinking in the English system for heights.

I can well imagine that humanity's earlier history had many other races of large stature people (giants). Certainly we know that gigantism was favored in some other hominids that predated modern humans, as we've found their fossil remains

As for the other assertions, particularly in Genesis, it appears that much exaggeration took place between the time of the events and the time of the recordation of the events, leaving the modern reader at a loss for a complete understanding. Unlike many who therefore refuse to read because of the inaccuracies, I read such literature, but with an eye to suggestions and possibilities that might be verifiable by other means. For example, I believe the flood occurred, but that the flood was of the Black Sea when the Ice Age meltdown finally broke through the Dardanelles, creating a huge waterfall that likely lasted for decades, flooding that immense area. People in that area would have taken to the hills, only to have the hills become flooded too. Noah likely was amongst those, and saved his family and his farm animals by taking to a boat. Upon landing on new shores, he began anew, and his story was passed down through the generations, embellished upon over the centuries. We find that story not only in Genesis, but in other literature from that region, replete with the part about releasing a dove that came back with an olive twig.

Back to the giant skeletons you say have been found in N. America. Any literature references to them (newspaper accounts currently on-line?)? I'm intrigued with the possiblity that there might be a giant hominid ape species still extant in N. America
 
Walter L. Wagner said:
Visitor:

-Joshua had his work cut out for him, going against 'armies' of men that were of great stature (very much taller than he), including exceptionally large ones, such that they had been deemed giants by the neighbors.
Too bad it doesn't give actual heights. I imagine that the men of 'great stature' would have been 6'6" to 7', and the giants of them would have been 8'-9'.

-Back to the giant skeletons you say have been found in N. America. Any literature references to them (newspaper accounts currently on-line?)? I'm intrigued with the possiblity that there might be a giant hominid ape species still extant in N. America
Click to expand...


You're right about the actual sizes being scarce.

From what I can gather the size of the giants that were genetic throw-backs like Goliath, and the average of most races after the flood were in the 9 foot range.
The conversion from cubits put Goliath at 9 foot 3 inches and he was just a remnant left 1000 years after their kingdoms were destroyed.

Some were as you stated giants among giants.....the "Anakim" seem to stand out from the other races after the flood.
I believe they were about 12 feet in height.
Reference in my post to King Og of Bashan.
His bed was 14 feet long..... there are other references to a group of notariety in scripture called the "bulls of Bashan".

The true giants from before the flood may have been along this 12 foot order, or greater in size.

What appears after the flood is a result of Noahs son Ham and his wife.
She may have carried over the gene, and Ham may have had it too.....
His son Canaan was cursed, after Ham displayed the personality disorder common to their race....similar to Cain's murder of his brother and disrespect of God to his face......

What I found interesting is the way Native Americans describe these North American giants they fought in old times.
They describe them exactly as the giants from the biblical accounts.
These giants are not just in biblical accounts, there is also a reference in the Koran to a race of giants that lived in the days of their prophet Hud, and were destroyed by God for their wickedness.

Demonic ferocity, possessed of evil spirits and the mortal enemies of the Native American.
They describe them as desperatly wicked, with near superhuman streghth and inteligence....

The Native American saw something like this and called them the Si-Te-Cahs.

Not the description of some North American "great ape"....
This was not an animal, it was a hybrid.

The original species that was used to father Cain, the "serpent" may be closer to your Sasquatch, or Yeti type animal.....but the hybrid mixed with human blood is lethal.
Ever hear of what they call "crazy strength"?
When a person becomes capable of superhuman feats out of fear, injury, or insanity.
It's real.
Imagine a 12 foot giant trained as a warrior possessed with evil spirits.
Thats what we are talking about.
Being twice as tall, he would weigh in at four times as much.
Thats about a thousand pounds....and with "crazy strength" on top of that.

I'll get you're links to the North American giants......a simple google of Si-Te-Cah won't do it anymore......http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1027699/posts
Most of the information has been removed or blocked.
Imagine that.

What comes up now, even on Wilkipedia is just one Paiute Indian battle in Lovelock, Nevada that ended with the Indians burning up a small group of red haired giants in a cave.
That's not the whole story.

TheVisitor
 
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There are a few interesting topics that have come up here. Lets put the cat among the pigeons.

At the same time the Ice Age was in full flow there were mammoths wandering around northern Siberia. The Ice Age came to a sudden end and the mammoths were deep frozen so suddenly that they are still coming out of the ice and being eaten by wolves. The only explanations for this are that either the earths axis shifted by about 2000 miles or the crust slipped over the surface of the mantle by the same amount.

In 17,000 b.c. the pole was in the Hudson Bay. The ancient monuments in America are aligned to this pole.

If you take an equilateral triangle of side 25 cubits it has a height of 10 metres. ALMOST exactly. The French made the metre one millionth of the distance from the pole to the equator. They were out by about 80 metres. Using the triangle I mentioned we can say the Egyptians were only out by about 40 metres. Not bad for a ‘bunch of amateurs’.

There are over 400 optically perfect lenses in the world’s museums. Many have holes drilled through them and all are classed as ‘jewellery’. The oldest one comes from the ruins of Mesopotamia. So Galileo invented the telescope did he?

Many small glass spheres have been found in Egypt and are classed as ‘make-up jars. This despite the fact that the entrance hole is so small that you can only get water in, and indeed you need a pin to encourage the water out. Some make-up jar!! When they are full of water they can be used to focus the suns rays and start a fire fairly promptly.

There is a tribe in Mali which, in about 1920, let a Frenchman into their inner secrets. They great secret was that Sirius is a double star with a period of rotation of (I think) about 49 years. They were right!! The companion of Sirius is a white dwarf and until recently we could only infer its presence by a wobble in the position of Sirius.

Somebody in those days knew a hell of a lot more than they are given credit for.

I could go on and on but I think that’s enough for now. Happy searching
 
Itseemstome:

Interesting post.

I've always wondered if it were possible that lenses were discovered millenia ago when glass-making was known to exist, instead of not until Galileo's times. Can you give any references/cites/photos for such lenses? Did subsequent peoples forget their uses, and drill holes in them to make them into jewelery, or was the hole on the edge, and a convenient method for carrying them around (like a necklace). As you know, great claims require great authentication.

You need to read back through my posts in Science/Astronomy regarding the Royal Cubit and the Great Pyramid. Turns out the ancient Egyptians had the size of the Earth accurate to one part per thousand. However, it was not necessary to have a telescope to achieve that.

Had a telescope been invented back then, its military use would have been so fantastic that it would not have been forgotten about, but rather the knowledge shared and spread within that group, eventually escaping to other groups. However, the magnifying lens effect of a water filled bottle might well have been something of interest and use, without necessarily leading to a telescope. After all, 'modern' lenses, used for reading glasses, etc., had been around for many decades before a Dutchman, I believe, made the first telescope. Thereafter, Galileo improved on his design, made a 30X telescope, and then did the very unusual thing of looking at the night sky, rather than the daytime surroundings as was the customary habit of those who'd been using the few novelty-telescopes then already in existence, and amazed himself. As they say, the rest is history.

As to the Mammoths, it's been known for a century or more that many met a sudden demise, even with food still being chewed and undigested in their stomachs, only to be buried with snow. However, there are other explanations other than the 'pole shift' one that people read about in some pseudosciene explanations given. That is essentially impossible, considering the great angular momentum inertia of the Earth.

Rather, it appears that certain ice-free regions where cold-climate Mammoths were wandering underwent a rapid change in weather conditions, leading to ice-packs in that region. That could have been in conjunction with the Melt Down, which resulted in many changes in Oceans Currents, some of which happen in a matter of hours/days, and which could have resulted in a sudden broad change in climate patterns. This certainly bears further research, however. Even a gradual change in the magnetic poles might have had a sudden weather effect onset.
 
skeleton_giant_human.jpg
 
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The book Forbidden Land by Robert Lyman (1971) recounts the following finds:

Giants of North America;

A decayed human skeleton claimed by eyewitnesses to measure around 3.28 metres (10 feet 9 inches tall), was unearthed by laborers while ploughing a vineyard in November 1856 in East Wheeling, now in West Virginia.

A human skeleton measuring 3.6 metres (12 foot) tall was unearthed at Lompock Rancho, California, in 1833 by soldiers digging in a pit for a powder magazine. The specimen had a double row of teeth and was surrounded by numerous stone axes, carved shells and porphyry blocks with abstruse symbols associated with it.

Several mummified remains of red haired humans ranging from 2-2.5 metres (6.5 feet to over 8 feet) tall were dug up at Lovelock Cave, (70 miles) north-east of Reno, Nevada, by a guano mining operation. These bones substantiated legends by the local Paiute Indians regarding giants which they called Si-Te-Cahs. For some reason scientists did not seem to want to investigate these finds further so many of the bones were lost. Fortunately one of the giant Lovelock skulls is still preserved today. It measures almost 30cm (1 foot) tall and resides along with other various Lovelock artifact's in the Humboldt Museum in Winnemucca, Nevada. Some of these artifact's can also be found in the Nevada State Historical Society's museum at Reno.

Aside from in Forbidden Land, we can find other historical information on the remains of giants.

A 9' 8" skeleton was excavated from a mound near Brewersville, Indiana (Indianapolis News, Nov 10, 1975).

In Clearwater Minnesota, the skeletons of seven giants were found in mounds. These had receding foreheads and complete double dentition (Childress 1992, p. 468).

A mound near Toledo, Ohio, held 20 skeletons, seated and facing east with jaws and teeth "twice as large as those of present day people," and besides each was a large bowl with "curiously wrought hieroglyphic figures." (Chicago Record, Oct. 24, 1895; cited by Ron G. Dobbins, NEARA Journal, v13, fall 1978).

9.Skeletons.pers.jpg



A.
Present day modern man which averages about 6-feet tall + or - several inches or more.

B.
15-foot human skeleton found in southeast Turkey in late 1950's in the Euphrates valley during road construction. Many tombs containing giants were uncovered here.

C.
Maximinus Thrax Ceaser of Rome 235-238 A.D. This was an 8' 6" skeleton.

D. Goliath was about 9 feet + or - a few inches. I Samuel 17:4 late 11th century.

E. King Og spoken of in Deuteronomy 3:11 whose iron bedstead was approximately 14-feet by 6-feet wide. King Og was at least 12-feet tall, yet some claim up to 18.

F. A 19'6" human skeleton found in 1577 A.D. under an overturned oak tree in the Canton of Lucerne.

G. 23-foot tall skeleton found in 1456 A.D. beside a river in Valence, France.

H. A 25' 6 " skeleton found in 1613 A.D. near the castle of Chaumont in France. This was claimed to be a nearly complete find.

I. Almost beyond comprehension or believability was the find of the two separate 36-foot human remains uncovered by Carthaginians somewhere between 200-600 B.C.


Source for the above information:
Joe Taylor, Mt. Blanco Fossil Museum
124 West Main St., P.O. Box 550, Crosbyton, TX 79322
(805) 675-7777 (office) and (806) 675-2421 (fax)
http://www.mtblanco.com

..................................:p .....................................

Take it or leave it.
I don't rely on any of this to support my claims.
I rely on the study of scripture, history, and prophetic insight.

The first picture "the dig" is a photoshop contest winner from 2002.
But I provided it to show a representation of about what a 36 foot giant may look like compared to modern man.

"Historical societies" have done everything humanly possible to hide, destroy or re-bury every piece of giant human skeletal remains ever found so they can say there's never been any evidence, and; "not one single bone exists".

So I apologize for the deceptive method....but turn about is fair play.

TheVisitor
 
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The Visitor:

I'd have you provide archaeological proof and/or positively peer reviewed journals in an anthropological or other journal of these "giants". Noting that those who have grown to 8 feet tall have shown signs of extreme stress on their bodies.
 
IceAgeCivilizations said:
With submerged megalithic constructions now confirmed on the shallow seafloor off southwestern Japan, off northwestern and southeastern India, off Lebanon, Egypt, Greece, Malta, southern Spain, and Morocco, no doubt among others, and as these structures are often of a construction style of the cyclopean megalithic types which are often found nearby onshore, generally considered to be from circa 2500 B.C., does this not call into question the conventional time for the end of the Ice Age at circa 10000 B.C.?
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Confirmed by whom? The problem with the internet and other new media is that scientists--or even people who merely call themselves scientists--can bypass the peer review process and present their research directly to laymen. In America, at least, retro-religion has become highly fashionable so citizens are deliberately maintaining an abysmal ignorance of science and feigning skepticism of the scientific principles that heralded the Enlightenment. To that end, anyone who contradicts "conventional" science while affecting a scientific demeanor is hailed as a hero.

Beware of this phenomenon, as we all wonder why Americans are losing ground to Chinese and Indian university graduates.

One of the cornerstones of the scientific method is "extraordinary assertions require extraordinary substantiation." The "conventional" time of the end of the last major Ice Age has been corroborated by a dozen different disciplines. The assertion that this is wrong is indeed "extraordinary" and requires more proof than third-hand reports of megaliths that are alleged to be unnatural. This is the kind of stuff that the tele-tabloids love because it boosts their ratings. Why isn't Geraldo down there showing us live real-time footage of these wondrous erections? Why doesn't one of the Fundie Christian universities have a crew down there beaming the pictures out via satellite? If we're all wrong about the Ice Age then maybe we're all wrong about evolution, right?

This isn't the Dark Ages; iconoclasts aren't executed or thrown in dungeons. They get their own talk shows. If we scientists are the Church and these believers in lost civilizations are the new Galileos, they should have no trouble getting enormous publicity.
 
Prince:

Unfortunately, the claim is also that the evidence has been hidden. One would think that there would be at least of few such giant skeletons around, and I would hope that further research might reveal such in some dusty archival section of some museum somewhere. I'm not holding my breath, however.

It is to be noted, though, that many species can have a wide range of extant sizes. Horses can be up to 8 feet at the shoulder, or as short as 3 feet. The weight is accordingly a much greater range.

Likewise, elephants have been diminutive (the size of horses) on some islands, while twice as tall in other forms (including the Mammoth/Mastodon relatives). Bears too exhibit a huge range (from giant Kodiak to puny blacks). Thus, I can accept that earlier stages of our humanity might easily have allowed for gigantism to upwards of 12 feet or more in some clans. The 36 foot claim does seem a bit much, however, due to problems of locomotion, etc.
 
Visitor:

Thanks, though, for posting the references. I'll try to keep my eye out for more information that might be somewhat more substantiatable.
 
Walter L. Wagner:

Whilst I will freely allow for very tall people in the genetic record, there has been noted problems with the skeletal integrity of extremely tall people. Moreover, the sheer caloric and protein intake would be ANORMOUS daily, far more than a normal human being could secure for himself in primitive times.

I'd place a maximum of 10 feet for human beings. Anything larger and they'd likely die before reproduction.

Also: Any theory which rests on "evidence has been hidden or destroyed" is tremendously suspect. Isn't it curious that EVERY conspiracy demands such?
 
Prince_James said:
Whilst I will freely allow for very tall people in the genetic record, there has been noted problems with the skeletal integrity of extremely tall people.
Moreover, the sheer caloric and protein intake would be ENORMOUS daily, far more than a normal human being could secure for himself in primitive times.
Also: Any theory which rests on "evidence has been hidden or destroyed" is tremendously suspect. Isn't it curious that EVERY conspiracy demands such?
Click to expand...

Prince James
I know a real prince personally, and he believes as I do.......what I am about to tell you.
You must have missed my "rather lengthy" posts earlier in this thread, in which I was accused of putting the general population to sleep in their attempt to read them....and the ones in "Is History all Bull****"

Your "primitive times" comment shows you are missing my point entirely.
Or intentionally trying to dismiss it.
No mater, this late in the game.

They weren't "primitive times" of the stone age a few millinia ago, from which we have just risen into a glorious new age of scientific enlightenment.

We had science in the days of old.......science so advanced it was hoary with age.

The science was welded in the hands of the faithless into an oppressive war machine enslaving and committing genocide upon true humanity, the children of God.
Over and over again.
Man's lust for knowledge in his denial of God is the very instument of his destruction.
For without the moral character that comes from God, man has no ability to contain the power it unleashes.

We didn't crawl out of the stone age.
We were bombed back into it.....the victims of our own doomsday weapons.

And the ones who did the deed, are the ancestors of the ones who scurry around in the shadows today hiding all evidence....and heralding the cry to blind worship of the "new" god of the faithless with their harlot consort on their arm, rubbing out the good name of the Lord of heaven with her false religions in bed with the kings of every nation on Earth.

Science.....the "not so new" tree of knowledge.
And they dare ask our allegiance once again?
No one in their right mind, who had knowledge of our world's true history would agree to it.
Thats why they are so desperate to destroy all evidence.

Oppenheimer realized too late the pawns they had become....when he quoted the now famous line; "I am become death, the destroyer of worlds"
That quote is from an ancient Hindu text that records the Earth's previous destruction in a nuclear war.
When asked if the trinty test was the first atom bomb ever, he replied; "why yes, in modern times."

These giants you would have us dismiss, are the very ancestors of this faithless "modern" generation today.
The spirits who ride the "whispering winds" tickled their ears then as they do ours now, and we swallow down the seeds of destruction as we wipe our mouths after eating of the tree.

Can you see it now?....it's like a nightmare version of "Groundhog Day".
And when humanity wakes up the next round....we will never have had this conversation.

This is a battleground in an ancient war that's way, way, over your head.
 
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