davewhite04
Valued Senior Member
Did Nothing Create Everything?
- Thread starter SetiAlpha6
- Start date
For me...
It is the simple most straight line conclusion, to conclude that Hebrew names represent Hebrew people. Your point introduces a possibility of some unknowable numeric error not a certainty of error in total.
Or, I guess, if I use your method, I could take all of the other none Hebrew names on the slave list and conclude that many more of those people, why not half of them, were actually also Hebrews without any direct evidence for doing so.
Perhaps the slave list represents more Hebrews than I thought!
If I use your method would that fit the evidence better for you?
Yes.
Why would non Hebrew people, living in Egypt, give there own children Hebrew names?
Especially if there were no Hebrews living in Egypt around them?
Where did they get the Hebrew culture influence from?
Hebrews perhaps?
Hmmm... perhaps Hebrews were their heroes, and that is why they did it? I mean people don’t normally name their children with the names of the people they dispise, right?
Or, maybe not?
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I trust the Bible in general as historical writing, but I also have no problems with it having imperfections and errors.
There are other views on this as well.
I suppose, that perhaps there are almost as many views on this as there are people on the Earth,
To quote from your reference:
"While the current scholarly consensus asserts that there is no definitive evidence for Hebrews living in Egypt prior to the Exodus..."
Which is what I said.
"... an Egyptian list of domestic servants written in the Second Intermediate Period, perhaps in the 17th century BC, contains not only Semitic names, but several specifically Hebrew names."
Note the word "servants" and note the word "several". "Several servants" is not evidence for thousands of slaves.
Same reason that non-Jewish people here, living in non-Jewish San Diego, name their kids Sam sometimes. (Short for Samuel, a Jewish name.)
Almost certainly. Perhaps a Hebrew trader came through their area as part of a caravan. Perhaps a trader from the area went to a Jewish area and came back with stories about their people. Lots of potential reasons that people know things, and learn about other cultures.
Maybe. Or maybe they just liked the name.
I trust the Bible as a somewhat-accurate rendition of an oral tradition passed down over thousands of years. That oral tradition, though, isn't notably accurate. Doesn't mean it's "bad" or anything, just that it's not a science or history book.
That is all possible!
It is also possible, using your method, that 70-80% were Hebrews but they changed their names to blend into the herd, to disappear.
Thanks!
I agree, this is not conclusive evidence for thousands of slaves.
But it is very real evidence that some number of Hebrew slaves were living in Egypt during the timeframe of the Exodus.
Please also note that the people with Semitic names could also be Hebrews, just less clear to claim that.
It is possible that by using unbounded extrapolation like scientists sometimes do, that a single list, such as this, could be multiplied to represent thousands of such lists, which would likely also have Hebrew and Semitic names on them as evidence to create a very large population of Hebrews living in Egypt in the past.
Kind of like a scientist might hypothetically use a single tooth to create an entirely imaginary creature and vast populations of them. And then even mislead children with them for decades.
Anyway, if I use billvon’s method, perhaps 70-80% or more were actually Hebrews in reality.
It is possible if not likely that the group of slaves who departed from Egypt during the Exodus were made up of not only Hebrews and Semites, but also of most of the other people groups who were living in Egypt in slavery at the time.
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Of course. It is also possible that they were American Indians. It is, however, unlikely.
Good scientists do not do that, actually.
Or that.
Nope. Not my method or conclusion. Are you making things up again?
Although there may be others (like Noah's Ark) it is the story of Exodus that is an undeniable proof of God?
That's something that fiction writers are more likely to do.
Not according to the Bible.
Here are some of the parallel points of agreement between the Ipuwer Papyrus and the Exodus...
Ipuwer Papyrus: Behold, Egypt is fallen to pouring of water, and he who poured water on the ground has carried off the strong man in misery.
Exodus Account: (Moses poured water on the ground which turned all of the drinking water to blood, including the river. Moses defeated Pharaoh in misery with the 10 Plagues.)
Ipuwer Papyrus: Indeed, the children of princes are dashed against walls, and the children of the neck are laid out on the high ground.
Exodus Account: (In the story of the Exodus, the Angel of Death visited all the first born of the land.)
Ipuwer Papyrus: Indeed, public offices are opened and their inventories are taken away;
Exodus Account: (Pharaoh gave everything to the departing Israelites that they needed or wanted.)
Ipuwer Papyrus: Indeed, the river is blood, yet men drink of it.
Exodus Account: (Moses turned the river to blood and men thirst, but have nothing else to drink.)
Ipuwer Papyrus: Behold, men tread [the water] like fishes, and the frightened man cannot distinguish it because of terror.
Exodus Account: (The Egyptian Army followed the Israelites into the great depths of the sea and were drowned by the water.)
Ipuwer Papyrus: the tribes of the desert have become Egyptians everywhere.
Exodus Account: (The initial immigration of the Israelites and others into Egypt.)
Ipuwer Papyrus: I have separated him and his household slaves
Exodus Account: (The slaves of Pharaoh left the households of their Egyptian Masters.)
There are a few more...
You can certainly research it more if you wish to and decide for yourself.
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Sadly, a few Scientists have used unethical practices to deceive people in the past. I could give you examples, but that is not our focus at the moment.
Really?
I don't know everything, and could certainly be wrong!
Where is that in the Bible?
I can only say that the evidence on the ground for the Exodus is enough for me to be convinced of God.
I don't know if it would be enough evidence for you?
We are all beautiful, amazing, and different people.
You would have to decide that for yourself.
There is also a Site in Turkey that people have claimed represents the remains of Noah's Ark. There is even a Visitor Center there.
But I have not yet had the time to investigate it for myself. So I have no opinion on whether it is true or false at this time. I can only say that others make claims that it is the real thing and I leave it there.
I could probably come up with the Google Earth Coordinates for it if someone wanted to go there and see it for themselves. Just let me know.
Found it... 39°26'26.62"N, 44°14'5.48"E
Mount Ararat is just to the North.
Yes, I know there have been many competing claims made all over the area.
I don't know if this is the real thing or not.
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We're not even talking about scientists here. We're talking about historians and Biblical scholars.
I said it isn't in the Bible. Your idea of multi-ethnic slaves escaping from Egypt is not in the Bible - or in history or in archaeology either.