Developing Telepathy

Happeh said:
Yes it would be fraud if someone who did not have a medical degree set up a medical practice and charged money to patients. I agree.



To a point. I find it is more that lemmings view credibility as more important. That is why politicians and con men can do what they do. Simple people like yourself accept their lies. They bamboozle you with their authority and credibility. Doesn't matter they are liars, they convince you that they are credible.

That kind of attitude leads to cults. The people who worshipped Jim Jones thought he was a credible leader. If they were independent, like me, they would have checked up on the details of Jim Jones instead of accepting his lies and ability to fool people into thinking he was credible.

Ahh! But the point is you TEST the credibility - just as I did yours. And you were found severly wanting. You have NO credibility with me any longer and I suspect it may be the same for some others here as well.



There is a difference between being credible in the eyes of others, and being credible in the.....laws of the universe or the truth of reality. I don't care about popularity contests. Never did. I only care about the truth.

Popycock. Credible is all about truth! And you've shown yourself not to be truthful. It has nothing to do with popularity. Truth is truth and anything else is NOT.
 
Wow. You can copy/paste. Nice skill, even though its a practice that is in violation of the site rules. http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=20340

But aside from that, there are some flaws with Dean Radin's The Conscious Universe, and not just with the parts you posted, but I'll stick to your rule-breaking post.

ellion said:
In a 1995 book saturated with piercing skepticism, the late Carl Sagan of Cornell University [...] Then, in one paragraph amongst 450 pages, we find an astonishing admission:

At the time of writing there are three claims in the ESP field which, in my opinion, deserve serious study: (1) that by thought alone humans can (barely) affect random number generators in computers; (2) that people under mild sensory deprivation can receive thoughts or images "projected" at them; and (3) that young children sometimes report the details of a previous life, which upon checking turn out to be accurate and which they could not have known about in any other way than reincarnation.

Sagan did indeed say the above (1996, p. 302). But Radin conveniently leaves out the very next line: "I pick these claims not because I think they're likely to be valid (I don't), but as examples of contentions that might be true. The last three have at least some, although still dubious, experimental support. Of course I could be wrong."

ellion said:
Other signs of shifting opinions are cropping up with increasing frequency in the scientific literature. Starting in the 1980s, well-known scientific journals like Foundations of Physics, American Psychologist, and Statistical Science published articles favorably reviewing the scientific evidence for psychic phenomena. The Proceedings of the IEEE, the flagship journal of the Institute for Electronic and Electrical Engineers, has published major debates on psi research. Invited articles have appeared in the prestigious journal, Brain and Behavioral Sciences. A favorable article on telepathy research appeared in 1994 in Psychological Bulletin, one of the top-ranked journals in academic psychology. And an article presenting a theoretical model for precognition appeared in 1994 in Physical Review, a prominent physics journal.

Radin's list above reads like the bibliography for the infamous Does Psi Exist? meta-analysis published in Psychological Bulletin (Bem & Honorton 1994). Except he got the journal "Brain and Behavioral Sciences" wrong. It should have read, Behavioral and Brain Sciences. Indeed, Milton and Wiseman (1999) "present a meta-analysis of 30 ganzfeld ESP studies from 7 independent laboratories adhering to the same stringent methodological guidelines that Bem and Honorton followed. The studies failed to confirm his main effect of participants scoring above chance on the ESP task..." Milton and Wiseman concluded that the "ganzfeld technique does not at present offer a replicable method for producing ESP in the laboratory." In short, it was shown to be bunk at worst, inconclusive at best.

There is nothing in science that shows empirically that "psi" exists. Nor is there any sort of theory as to what would cause "psi" to work if it did exist. By theory, I am not talking in the colloquial sense where a "speculation" equals a "theory." I'm referring to a set of one or more hypotheses that have been tested.

ellion said:
Surprisingly, the other principal reviewer, skeptic Ray Hyman, agreed: "The statistical departures from chance appear to be too large and consistent to attribute to statistical flukes of any sort…. I tend to agree with Professor Utts that real effects are occurring in these experiments. Something other than chance departures from the null hypothesis has occurred in these experiments."

When you read quote like this and their is an ellipsis, the three dots in red above, it means the quoting author left something out. What Radin left out was this, "Although I cannot dismiss the possibility that these rejections of the null hypothesis might reflect limitations in the statistical model as an approximation of the experimental situation (Hyman, 1996)."

Radin does a good job of quote-mining where he takes bits and pieces of what people say out of context and presents them the way he'd like fellow believers in the 'psi' silliness to read them. I only picked apart the few quotes that I recognized from other sources I know. Radin's apparently full of it and, like others who promote the 'psi' silliness, he appears desparate to find an appeal to whatever authorities he can cite.

References:

Bem, Daryl J., Honorton, Charles (1994). Does Psi Exist? Replicable Evidence for an Anomalous Process of Information Transfer. Psychological Bulletin, 115(1).

Hyman, R. (1996) Evaluation of Program on Anomalous Mental Phenomena. Journal of Parapsychology, 59(4), 321-352.

Milton, J. and R.Wiseman (1999). Does psi exist? Lack of replication of an anomalous process of information transfer. Psychological Bulletin, 125(4), 387-391.

Sagan, Carl (1996). A Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark. New York: Ballatine Books.
 
i seen a video where a mothers son died
300 miles away the mother knew when it happened
this has been confirmed
but not telepathy

humans in general can pick the correct answer from a set of answers 75% of the time by guessing. random chance can only explain 50%
but still not telepathy

i am positive the pentagon is interested but that in no way says telepathy is a reality.

nobody wants to admit it but god has not been ruled out of the equation
i say god and someone will think religion
i say god for lack of a better word
it is quite possible that when and if you explain telpathy you will also explain god
 
the B-1 bomber can be flown virtually hands off
meaning all the pilot has to do is sit there and move his head
to the untrained that would seem to be impossible or in some cases telepathy.
 
Light said:
Ahh! But the point is you TEST the credibility - just as I did yours. And you were found severly wanting. You have NO credibility with me any longer and I suspect it may be the same for some others here as well.

You haven't tested anything with me that I recall.

Light said:
Popycock. Credible is all about truth! And you've shown yourself not to be truthful. It has nothing to do with popularity. Truth is truth and anything else is NOT.

That is my point. Truth has nothing to do with popularity. So all of your popular scientific studies saying there is no telepathy are bunk. The reality is that there is telepathy.
 
Happeh said:
So all of your popular scientific studies saying there is no telepathy are bunk. The reality is that there is telepathy.

You truly don't see the problem with what you've just stated, do you? The "scientific studies" aren't "popular," they're empirical. Science doesn't vote on what is true and what is not, it evaluates evidence. Moreover, the reality of "telepathy" exists only in the minds of those that believe. It isn't objectively real... it has not been demonstrated to exist.

But at this point, you -who made the wild claim that you are "a scientist" that "understands how to employ the scientific method of observation and deduction," are apparently just trying to perpetuate the argument or standing on the principle of not giving in because you already took a stand on the side that is contrary to science and reason. For, if you were truly to use the scientific method of observation and deduction, you would not make the wild claim that 'telepathy' is a reality without citing a primary source.
 
Happeh said:
I think I have heard psychologists call this effect "entering someone's personal space". I don't know about you, but personal space is not a scientific term I ever heard. That is like describing some compound as purple instead of giving the chemical formula.

What is personal space? Personal space is a phrase people who refuse to use the word energy invented, so they could talk about energy and it's effects without admitting it is energy.
Point 1: A minor issue, but if you have never heard the term 'personal space' (used by psychologists, a form of scientist, to describe, well, personal space) how are you able to tell us about it? There is no need to confirm your stupidity.
Point 2: Conduct this experiment. Take a meal at a good restaurant with a friend, but not one with whom you have had or are likely to have intimate relations. Sit opposite your friend. During the course of the meal move items from your side of the table onto their side of the table: napkin ring, unused cutlery, salt shaker, etc. Notice how your friend becomes increasingly uncomfortable, even though you are not invading their personal space for more than a fraction of a second. EXplain how these results are explicable in terms of an energy field.
Point 3: I am truly impressed by the consistency and firmness of your delusion.
 
from wiki

To date there has not yet been any satisfactory experimental protocol designed to distinguish telepathy from other forms of ESP such as clairvoyance.

also this

As of 2004, scientists have demonstrated that neuroimaging can be successfully used to recognise distinct thought patterns, and tell, for example, whether experimental monkeys thought about juice or water, and whether a human participant thought about a rotating cube or moving his paralyzed arm. Both implanted electrodes recording neurons' activity and outside electrodes recording electromagnetic activity of the brain can be used.

and finally this

Schizophrenia can produce delusions that the sufferer is in telepathic communication with others; such delusions include thought broadcasting and thought extraction.
 
skin said:
Wow. You can copy/paste. Nice skill, even though its a practice that is in violation of the site rules.
i did not know that.
as to the rest of your post i will take you on your word to the integrity of dean radin as i was not at ease with the article myself.

none of this however changes my position here, first hand experience to me is worth much more than any number of scientistific arguements.
 
It reminds me of the "Argument Sketch:"

M: Ah, Is this the right room for an argument?
A: I told you once.
M: No you haven't.
A: Yes I have.
M: When?
A: Just now.
M: No you didn't.
A: Yes I did.
M: You didn't
A: I did!
M: You didn't!
A: I'm telling you I did!
M: You did not!!
A: Oh, I'm sorry, just one moment. Is this a five minute argument or the full half hour?
M: Oh, just the five minutes.
A: Ah, thank you. Anyway, I did.
M: You most certainly did not.
A: Look, let's get this thing clear; I quite definitely told you.
M: No you did not.
A: Yes I did.
M: No you didn't.
A: Yes I did.
M: No you didn't.
A: Yes I did.
M: No you didn't.
A: Yes I did.
M: You didn't.
A: Did.
M: Oh look, this isn't an argument.
A: Yes it is.
M: No it isn't. It's just contradiction.
A: No it isn't.
M: It is!
A: It is not.
M: Look, you just contradicted me.
A: I did not.
M: Oh you did!!
A: No, no, no.
M: You did just then.
A: Nonsense!
M: Oh, this is futile!
A: No it isn't.
M: I came here for a good argument.
A: No you didn't; no, you came here for an argument.
M: An argument isn't just contradiction.
A: It can be.
M: No it can't. An argument is a connected series of statements intended to establish a proposition.
A: No it isn't.
M: Yes it is! It's not just contradiction.
A: Look, if I argue with you, I must take up a contrary position.
M: Yes, but that's not just saying 'No it isn't.'
A: Yes it is!
M: No it isn't!

A: Yes it is!
M: Argument is an intellectual process. Contradiction is just the automatic gainsaying of any statement the other person makes.
 
Now, hands up everyone who knew, through telepathy, that SkinWalker was going to post that.
Leopold, get your hand down. You know perfectly well you were using clairvoyance, not telepathy.
 
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