Christians and Christmas

Pakman

Registered Senior Member
Greetings folks. The holiday season is among us and I have been pondering over this question lately.

Why do Christians celebrate Christmas?

First of all, the Bible does not say anything about Christmas. The only thing close to it is the decorating of a tree. I'm not sure what it is referring to, but it criticizes it.

The customs of the people are worthless, they cut a tree out of the forest, and a craftsman shapes it with his chisel, they adore it with silver and gold, they fasten it with hammer and nails so it will not totter." (Jeremiah 10:3,4).

Neither Jesus(pbuh) nor his companions celebrated it. Christmas was not created until the 2nd or the 4th century. The people of the north Europeon countries, modern Scandivania, had their own pagan gods. One was Odin. People used to say that when the winter clouds scudded across the sky, it was Odin flying across the sky on his white horse, and he used to come to earth dressed in a long, hooded cloak, with a bag of coins, bread, to give to people who were poor, in his winter guise.

The Church believed it needed to relace the "the misguided ways of the indigenous peoples." So Pope Julius set the official date of Jesus's birth at the height of the pagan mid-winter festivals. The date of Jesus's birth is not known whether it is true or not, since there is no evidence. But on Dec. 25, we see it is the birthday of Hercules, the son of Zeus (Greeks), Bacchus, god of wind, (Romans), Adenis god of Greeks, and Freyr the Greek-Roman god. There was another one. Mithra. But I forgot who she was the godness of.

Anyway, can I get a Christian's perspective about does? Can you tell me what your local priest or church says about this. Thanks.
 
This is part of the inscription I put in my greeting cards I’m sending to friends and family this year.

December 25, by the Julian calendar, was the winter solstice. This day was originally regarded by the pagans as the day of the nativity of the sun, the shortest day of the year -- when the light began its conquering battle against darkness – and was celebrated universally in all the ages of man.

Taken over by the Christians as the birthday of their mythological Christ, this ancient holiday, set by motions of the celestial bodies, survives as a day of rejoicing that good will and love will have a perpetual rebirth in the minds of men -- even as the sun has a symbolic rebirth yearly.

Have a happy Winter Solstice.
 
I am not christian, so I cannot answer your question PakMan, but I have also wondered about this. Enough people know that December 25th was not Jesus' bday to continue on pretending it is. And i personally think, the extent to which the holiday has been commercialized is absolutely appalling and ridiculuos.
Who celebrates a prophet's birth date with santa claus, the north pole, and drop-til=u-die shopping? Its all a lot of fun, but where has the essence of the holiday gone to????

btw--- this is my first post eVER on this site!! :)
 
Hey Miss Khan... welcome to the zoo that is sciforums.. just joking peoples so no getting uppity and having said that... mooo

And you are correct. Being born and brought up in a Catholic household I was always confused at the notion of Christmas and often asked the nuns in religious class as a child why we have it. And I was always told to hush and that it was Jesus' birthday. So I used to then ask... if it's his b/day, how come WE get the presents. And no matter how much I asked, I was never given an answer and was called disruptive (yet another reason why my parents were kindly told by the nuns that religious studies was not for me:rolleyes: ).. and they wonder why I became an agnostic. I was told the usual crap of it's the day of giving and blah blah blah.. as a child I just saw it as a day my parents bought me stuff and wrapped it up and put it under a tree and made it all "spesh".

I guess that the way Christianity see it, they designated December 25 as his b/day and that was that, this I guess proved the arrogance of the church. The fact that many of the Christian holidays fall on days of significance to pagan rituals of the past (and to some present) was a factor that the church chose to ignore in religious studies. Oh well, I guess for many of us Christmas is the day when we give and get "stuff" and then spend the following days counting the dollars that we have ermm spent. Personally for me Christmas day is probably the one day in the year that the people I'm closest to all sit around and eat a meal together at the same time and it's a chance to catch up with everyone (geography and work and study commitments ensure that this family reunion is usually a once a year affair). So it's not so much a religious holiday for me in the way that Christians see it but a day when I get to see everyone in the same room at the same time and I get to ermmm enjoy their company as they get to enjoy mine:D.




:eek:
 
Taken over by the Christians as the birthday of their mythological Christ...
Mythological??? Who does that write thik he is?? :mad:

Well Christmas is supposed to be Christ's birthday, but it was my understanding that the pagans changed their calendar to cover up Christs's actual birthday. I don't know true this is, but the pagans alwas seem to come into this equation. :)
 
Originally posted by Cris
This is part of the inscription I put in my greeting cards I’m sending to friends and family this year.

December 25, by the Julian calendar, was the winter solstice. This day was originally regarded by the pagans as the day of the nativity of the sun, the shortest day of the year -- when the light began its conquering battle against darkness – and was celebrated universally in all the ages of man.

Taken over by the Christians as the birthday of their mythological Christ, this ancient holiday, set by motions of the celestial bodies, survives as a day of rejoicing that good will and love will have a perpetual rebirth in the minds of men -- even as the sun has a symbolic rebirth yearly.

Have a happy Winter Solstice.
----------
M*W: This is great! Do you write this in or did you have them printed up? I am looking for something similar already printed up. Do you have any ideas what type of store would carry this type of card?
 
Originally posted by Mucker
Mythological??? Who does that write thik he is?? :mad:

Well Christmas is supposed to be Christ's birthday, but it was my understanding that the pagans changed their calendar to cover up Christs's actual birthday. I don't know true this is, but the pagans alwas seem to come into this equation. :)
----------
M*W: I believe you have backwards. It was the Christians who created their calendar to cover-up pagan days of worship just as Christians built their shrines over pagan sites.
 
Originally posted by Mucker
it was my understanding that the pagans changed their calendar to cover up Christs's actual birthday.

What brought you to this understanding?
What makes you think this is the case?
 
Christmas is a pagan festival.

http://www.ucg.org/gn/gn49/christmas.htm

Extract -

The church adopted Dec. 25—the date of the Roman Brumalia, immediately after Saturnalia—as the date of Christ's birth (even though biblical evidence shows this cannot be the right time of this event).

This date also marked a great festival in Mithraism, the Persian religion of the sun god. In A.D. 274 Emperor Aurelian of Rome declared Dec. 25 to be the "birthday of the invincible sun." In time the Son of God, Jesus Christ, became indistinguishable from the pagan sun god in the minds of hundreds of thousands of converts throughout the Roman Empire.

Instead of standing as Christ's force for change in the world, nominal Christianity was changed by the pagan world it was supposed to transform!
 
Originally posted by Cris
Taken over by the Christians as the birthday of their mythological Christ, this ancient holiday, set by motions of the celestial bodies, survives as a day of rejoicing that good will and love will have a perpetual rebirth in the minds of men -- even as the sun has a symbolic rebirth yearly.

The Christmas season is not just a remembering of the birth of Jesuc. We’ll sing about that him this season, and honor his arrival, for he brought a new TELLING of a great truth – and a true LIVING of it – to the world. And these truly were tidings of comfort, and joy. But this is also a celebration of the birth of the Christed one in all of us.”
The message of this season is not about one blessed one, but about all beings, being blessed. Not about someone ELSE, but about US.
 
M*W,

M*W: This is great! Do you write this in or did you have them printed up? I am looking for something similar already printed up. Do you have any ideas what type of store would carry this type of card?
I print my own. Blank high quality greeting card stationery is easy to obtain and if you have a good quality printer then making cards is very easy.

But I took the text this year, with some minor alterations from –

https://lightning.he.net/~atheists/catalogue/shop/cat006.php

I didn’t like their card designs so I designed my own.

But there are other online stores on the web that sell Winter Solstice cards.

Have fun
Cris
 
Hevene,

The Christmas season is not just a remembering of the birth of Jesus.
Isn’t the reality that very few actually think of Jesus at Christmas? The concerns of most ordinary people in the western world is about buying gifts for their family and friends and organizing large meals. And for many businesses it is a time for maximizing profits and a period of maximum revenue.

We’ll sing about that him this season, and honor his arrival,
A few will I am sure.

for he brought a new TELLING of a great truth – and a true LIVING of it – to the world.
What truth? What did the myth introduce that we didn’t already know? But Christianity also introduced the fear of hell – terror and blackmail is the true legacy of Christianity.

And these truly were tidings of comfort, and joy.
But this was a pagan concept, not Christian. The bible has nothing on this.

But this is also a celebration of the birth of the Christed one in all of us.”
I can only guess what that statement might mean.

The message of this season is not about one blessed one, but about all beings, being blessed. Not about someone ELSE, but about US.
That is essentially the pagan message – as I said – this ancient holiday, set by motions of the celestial bodies, survives as a day of rejoicing that good will and love will have a perpetual rebirth in the minds of men -- even as the sun has a symbolic rebirth yearly.
 
May I also add another question:
Why do we decorate the christmas tree?
 
Originally posted by whitewolf
May I also add another question:
Why do we decorate the christmas tree?

It came from ancient druidic tree worship. The pagan people worshipped the evergreen tree since it symbolized eternal life and adorned it with all manner of decorations.
 
Reading through these posts I find that atheists celebrate 25th December by paying tribute to the solstice, just like pagans - primitive. I know lots of muslims that celebrate Christmas - odd!
Why don't you all fuck off and leave Christians to celebrate Christs birthday in peace. Instead you knock it, scorn it and insult it, in short your all fucking jealous that you haven't got anything in your life which is as fine as Christmas.
 
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