Chem-Trials over Las Vegas
- Thread starter LVPhysics
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snake river rufus
Registered Senior Member
Exactly what chemicals do you think are up there?
duendy said:
Toxicity has nothing to do with it, Duendy. As far as "harmful chemicals" goes, it's nothing more than a mixture of plain ammonium nitrate and diesel fuel oil. It's also used as THE explosive in quarries throughout the world. A very common chemical combination, very safe to handle, and highly explosive when detonated properly. Quite effective.
Mogul said:
I don't know what his motives were for saying that, assuming the letters I've seen on various (conspiracy oriented) web sites are real. Maybe he sympathises with the Militia McVeigh was associated with, and didn't want them tarnished?
Either way, a low velocity explosive could have caused such damage, quite easily. A recreation of Guy Fawkes attempt on the Houses of Parliament was performed recently, using gunpowder (a low velocity explosive) and the experiment showed Fawkes would have been successful.
So, a truck load of Ammonium Nitrate to just damage a building? Easy.
I don't why some people in the USA can't just accept that people are diven to do such things, and that it doesn't require a conspiracy.
Well, here's where I am left at:
Contrails are incredibly normal, and are a by-product of today's modern life.
I see contrails quite normally here in Vegas, but what does freak me out is that most of them just dissapear quickly, but some planes...the ones that cut the sky ina criss-cross pattern...those contrails <b>don't dissapear as quickly</b>. In fact their shit lingers in the air for hours and hours, spreading out slowly and creating just a hazy mass of something up there in the sky.
So yes, contrails are normal shit. But why though does an organized group of planes have a contrail that lingers? I don't know if its chemical, or whatever. I honestly have no way of knowing either by myself. All I am saying is that it is really suspicious, and wreaks of some sort of deception. Who knows that it is....I am not paranoid enough to think its the bird flu, haha, but I am a little alarmed at why it happens at all up there.
Anyways, I have seen it a few more times since my last post, and after christmas when I get my bad-ass digital camera, I will have photos up when I see them and its fishy. I'll let you guys be the judge.
But you guys keep forgetting that yes, normal contrail is very <b> normal</b>. Yes, I get that. But why do these groups of planes come over our skies and cirss-cross them leaving a grid pattern that lasts? Why doesn't their contrail just dissapate quickly like every other damn plane up above me? Thats what I am interested in.
Contrails are incredibly normal, and are a by-product of today's modern life.
I see contrails quite normally here in Vegas, but what does freak me out is that most of them just dissapear quickly, but some planes...the ones that cut the sky ina criss-cross pattern...those contrails <b>don't dissapear as quickly</b>. In fact their shit lingers in the air for hours and hours, spreading out slowly and creating just a hazy mass of something up there in the sky.
So yes, contrails are normal shit. But why though does an organized group of planes have a contrail that lingers? I don't know if its chemical, or whatever. I honestly have no way of knowing either by myself. All I am saying is that it is really suspicious, and wreaks of some sort of deception. Who knows that it is....I am not paranoid enough to think its the bird flu, haha, but I am a little alarmed at why it happens at all up there.
Anyways, I have seen it a few more times since my last post, and after christmas when I get my bad-ass digital camera, I will have photos up when I see them and its fishy. I'll let you guys be the judge.
But you guys keep forgetting that yes, normal contrail is very <b> normal</b>. Yes, I get that. But why do these groups of planes come over our skies and cirss-cross them leaving a grid pattern that lasts? Why doesn't their contrail just dissapate quickly like every other damn plane up above me? Thats what I am interested in.
I don't think is the type of plane that has contrails that linger longer. I think its the conditions that create the effect that they seem to linger longer. More than likely, the criss-cross pattern is normal for the conditions as well. Planes routinely change approaches and take-off directions with atmospheric conditions such as wind direction and humidity to maximize their lift.
I suspect that you are looking at the result of two airports (though I'm only speculating about this) that change approach/take-off directions because of humidity or air temperature. One set is the approach for one airport, the other set is the take-off of another. Thus giving the impression of a criss-cross pattern. But, again, I'm speculating on this. It could also be that the patters represent two different altitudes and, from the ground, appear to criss-cross.
I suspect that you are looking at the result of two airports (though I'm only speculating about this) that change approach/take-off directions because of humidity or air temperature. One set is the approach for one airport, the other set is the take-off of another. Thus giving the impression of a criss-cross pattern. But, again, I'm speculating on this. It could also be that the patters represent two different altitudes and, from the ground, appear to criss-cross.
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Well, we have two airports here in Vegas, this is true. One is McCarren Airport, which does all the commerical flight, as well as another one, which I forget the name, which mainly is for people who have their own aircraft, like sesnas, and shit like that. (Occasional helicoprters...ect.). The only other place would be Nellis Air Force base, where jets take off.
I am fairly acquianted with the patterns of flight from McCarren. (I live pretty close.) Now, I have been paying pretty good attention, and the McCarren planes are not the ones leaving the suspicious contrail. Everything appears normal with the commercial side of things. Now, the criss-cross pattern is only suspicious becuase it all gets laid down in the matter of three hours. (not over the course of the day). It wouldn't be suspicious if the pattern appeared slowly, but all at once the planes hit the skies and start the pattern. You can watch one plane fly one way, and watch two other planes criss-cutting his lines. They do it all in one go.
Now, I have no way of measuring their altitudes myself. The conditions would have to be right for their contrail to "linger", and from what I can see, planes with comparable altitudes do not leave contrail which lasts as long as the jets I have been noticing. (The ones that come in together and lay the grid formation down). I am trying to gather more information, but it is kind of hard gathering solid information about these activities.
the local news thinks its suspicious too, but there is no evidence to say that it is harmful, so they are not going with anything. (a wise choice). I just wonder why it happens, its baffeling.
I am fairly acquianted with the patterns of flight from McCarren. (I live pretty close.) Now, I have been paying pretty good attention, and the McCarren planes are not the ones leaving the suspicious contrail. Everything appears normal with the commercial side of things. Now, the criss-cross pattern is only suspicious becuase it all gets laid down in the matter of three hours. (not over the course of the day). It wouldn't be suspicious if the pattern appeared slowly, but all at once the planes hit the skies and start the pattern. You can watch one plane fly one way, and watch two other planes criss-cutting his lines. They do it all in one go.
Now, I have no way of measuring their altitudes myself. The conditions would have to be right for their contrail to "linger", and from what I can see, planes with comparable altitudes do not leave contrail which lasts as long as the jets I have been noticing. (The ones that come in together and lay the grid formation down). I am trying to gather more information, but it is kind of hard gathering solid information about these activities.
the local news thinks its suspicious too, but there is no evidence to say that it is harmful, so they are not going with anything. (a wise choice). I just wonder why it happens, its baffeling.
The chequer pattern is because the air is busy. The airport I live near, as well as being a passenger airport, also brings in freight, and is I think the UK's busiest freight terminal.
So the regular pattern you see, is to keep some safe distance between the aircraft. And the cross pattern is at a different altitude, but that is really hard to judge from the ground. Believe me, I used to launch model rockets, and sometimes those suckers would find a cloud real quick (and probably get lost, therefore) or other times, the clouds were a lot further away. It's really hard to judge, until you can trace something moving directly upwards at a known velocity.
The pattern gets formed all of a sudden, because it forms as soon as the conditions are right. Put it this way, I often don't see contrails, but at night, I'll always be able to see the running lights of half a dozen aircraft. During the day, without contrails, you wouldn't see them that easily. It's busy up there, why do you think environmentalists are really worried? We don't have to try to mess up the atmosphere with secret plans, we're doing quite well as it is!
So the regular pattern you see, is to keep some safe distance between the aircraft. And the cross pattern is at a different altitude, but that is really hard to judge from the ground. Believe me, I used to launch model rockets, and sometimes those suckers would find a cloud real quick (and probably get lost, therefore) or other times, the clouds were a lot further away. It's really hard to judge, until you can trace something moving directly upwards at a known velocity.
The pattern gets formed all of a sudden, because it forms as soon as the conditions are right. Put it this way, I often don't see contrails, but at night, I'll always be able to see the running lights of half a dozen aircraft. During the day, without contrails, you wouldn't see them that easily. It's busy up there, why do you think environmentalists are really worried? We don't have to try to mess up the atmosphere with secret plans, we're doing quite well as it is!
Here's an interesting article on jet contrails: http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20020511/fob1.asp
It links to this one: http://ams.confex.com/ams/13ac10av/10ARAM/abstracts/39365.htm
Finally, I'd suggest this article: http://www.mpimet.mpg.de/en/depts/dep2/blp/index.b.php
It links to this one: http://ams.confex.com/ams/13ac10av/10ARAM/abstracts/39365.htm
Finally, I'd suggest this article: http://www.mpimet.mpg.de/en/depts/dep2/blp/index.b.php
snake river rufus
Registered Senior Member
No. As I stated earlier I work at an aircraft modifaction site. I have looked in the engine nacelles of most types of overnment jets. There is absolutly nothing there that is not needed for normal engine operation.duendy said:
edited for typo/srr
LVPhysics said:
I believe I've solved your mystery for you.
I have a friend that's an ATC (Air Traffic Controller) - the regional type, not the kind that works at the local airports - and I talked with him last night. I finally got around to this particular question and about your particular location. Here's what he said.All of the continental U.S. is mapped out into air traffic corridors - highways, if you will. There are several places in the U.S. where these corridors cross and your location is one of them. Other major cross-overs are near Atlanta, Kansas City, Detroit, Chicago, Omaha, and several others.
Separation is maintained in three dimensions for all flights: lead/lag; horizontal; vertical. Cross-hatch patterns are very common in those areas but depends on weather conditions, namely winds, temperature and humidity. And of course those will vary daily but at the moment we are in one of the more stable annual conditions. Another period occurs during the summer across the U.S. Both spring and fall are very active, meterologically speaking, at the altitudes used for the cross-over areas so the contrails will tend to be more visible and last longer during this time of year.
Hope that helps settle all the questions.
This has all been very useful info folks. Thank you very much. I am going to look further into this. Skinwalker, that does help explain why they happen all at once. And light, thanks, I am going to look into that too. I am not scared about them or anything really, I just was really curious. Thanks guys
If it was something bad, wouldn't the government be more interested in doing it to other countries? Like high-atmospheric release of that product?
Why would you want to engage in population control for societies that are being swamped by immigrants from other countries?
I mean seriously, can anyone suggest a reasonable motive? Duendy?
Why would you want to engage in population control for societies that are being swamped by immigrants from other countries?
I mean seriously, can anyone suggest a reasonable motive? Duendy?
LVPhysics said:
You're very welcome.
My friend is very much of a just-the-facts kind of guy and I did fail to mention one thing he said. Those cross-hatch patterns have almost nothing to do with local flights - they're made by by planes traveling high overhead that are headed for airports far away from you. (And also came from distant airports.)
Light said:
My partner and I play a game with that, sitting in our back garden in summer, quaffing a few glasses of wine, we try and work out where various aircraft are coming from/going to. Many are far too high to be landing at the local airport, but anything from the London airports, bound for the USA should be coming overhead, pretty much.
Light said:
Stansted and kinda Luton, although Luton is not really London, just gets lumped in with them.
Luton is good for me, as it offers lots of destinations, and is quite easy to get to. Flying from London airports can be a pain in the arse, esp if you have to drag luggage round the Tube at rush hour to get there.
Mind you, my local Airport (Nottingham East Midlands) is now offering quite a few destinations, at very reasonable prices. I should travel more!
Ahh, yes - thanks! I've heard of Stansted though I've not been there. The other two names are new to me. I've only been through London a few times flying USA to Ireland. Direct Atlanta to London is best, though I've been routed through Brussels and Amsterdam a few times.phlogistician said:
I don't even know if there are direct flights between Atlanta and Shannon or Dublin because I've never had one - all my travel arrangements were handled by another department. That's neither here nor there though, you answered my question nicely.
Well, as promised, here are some photos from about a week ago over the skies here in Las Vegas. These pictures where taken from the Regional Justice Center on 3rd Street and Lewis. This gives you an idea of what I am talking about, although it gets even worse than this. You can clearly see the checkerboard pattern.
