"Book of Mormon" plagiarism?

Einstuck said:
Tell me about the war between J.S. and the Freemasons.

That has to be the most interesting story of any cult in North America.

How the masons were angry that Smith stole their secret handshakes and satanic rituals.
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First of all, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not a cult, it's a respectable Christian religion.

Second, there is no satanism incorporated in the temple rituals.

Third, here is are some web sites containing info on freemasonry and Mormonism (I haven't read them and know nothing about the subject, but FAIR tends to have great responses and links to questions about the LDS religion):

Ask the Apologist: Similarities between Masonic and LDS Temple rites

Freemasonry and the Temple (LDSFAQ)

Masonry and the Mormon Temple (Griffith)

Are Mormon Temples and Masonry Linked? (Lindsay)
 
Marlin said:
No there isn't.

Joseph Smith was martyred by a mob before he could finish the JST. We Mormons still use the JST in the footnotes and appendix of our official KJV Bibles, but as the JST was not completed and to maintain compatibility with other religions, the KJV remains the official version.
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Yes you do. Though not finished you can buy the JST with king James in between his changes at any bookstore. The reason you don't actually use it in your church is obvious given that the sections in the BOM are the KJV not the JST.
 
Its not satanic rituals. Thats propaganda. I'll argue against the Mormon religion as soon as anyone, but you shouldn't use hearsay in order to do it. Yes Jo Smith stole masonic rituals from the masons in creation of his temple rituals. Yes they involve secret handshakes and bizzare ritual. No they are not satanic.
 
Marlin said:
First of all, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not a cult, it's a respectable Christian religion.
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Since all Christian religions are a Jesus cult you are contradicting yourself. Mormonism along with any Christian religion is a cult.
 
The fascinating thing here is proponents of one cult arguing that another is "just a cult." All the while, the second cult defends itself with the evidence of "spirituality" or "I know it in my heart." The very same argument of the first cult.

But I agree with Randolfo that BoM is a smack in the face to the very rich history of the Mexican peoples. The Teotihuacan Valley alone is evidence of a complex, high civilization that rivaled other civilizations of pre-bronze antiquity. The Temple of the Sun is a pyramid with more mass than the Great Pyramid in Giza and may have been as grandiose in its day.
 
Its not satanic rituals. Thats propaganda. I'll argue against the Mormon religion as soon as anyone, but you shouldn't use hearsay in order to do it. Yes Jo Smith stole masonic rituals from the masons in creation of his temple rituals. Yes they involve secret handshakes and bizzare ritual. No they are not satanic.
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This is needless apologetic.

Most Christians, once they hear the details of secret Masonic practices and their philosophy, are almost unanimous in their appraisal of Masonry (and all its derivatives, like the Golden Dawn, the OTO, & the Satanic Church) as essentially a persistent underground Satanic cult, in opposition to and corrupting basic Christian belief and practice wherever it spreads.

Masonry & Satanism

Masonic Ritual Exposed

Christian Opinions

Masonic Symbology
Questions for Christian Masons

Advice for Satanists

Personally, however, I don't really care about Masonry. Its one of the milder forms of stupidity on this planet. I would prefer to battle drug dealing and prostitution.
 
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Trilairian, Joseph Smith apparently used the KJV when he was translating those passages of the Book of Mormon that quoted Isaiah, preferring to use the same language of the KJV of his day. It's obvious why he did this--people would be much more likely to accept the Book of Mormon if it was compatible with biblical language. Even so, there are some changes, as the Book of Mormon "plates of brass" (the plates Nephi took from Laban) were an earlier, more reliable record than the King James translation used, and thus more likely to be faithful to the words of the prophets they quoted.

And no, the LDS church is not a cult, unless you are using the word "cult" to simply mean "a religious system of worship," which every religion is.
 
Marlin said:
Trilairian, Joseph Smith apparently used the KJV when he was translating those passages of the Book of Mormon that quoted Isaiah, preferring to use the same language of the KJV of his day. It's obvious why he did this--people would be much more likely to accept the Book of Mormon if it was compatible with biblical language. Even so, there are some changes, as the Book of Mormon "plates of brass" (the plates Nephi took from Laban) were an earlier, more reliable record than the King James translation used, and thus more likely to be faithful to the words of the prophets they quoted.

And no, the LDS church is not a cult, unless you are using the word "cult" to simply mean "a religious system of worship," which every religion is.
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Of course he used it, which disproves that he did it by a scying stone instead, and yes I am fine with that definition. You are a cult.
 
Trilairian said:
Of course he used it, which disproves that he did it by a scying stone instead
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No it doesn't. He used every means available to him in the translation process. This included the Urim and Thummim as well as the KJV Bible and his own learning.
 
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Trilairian said:
and yes I am fine with that definition. You are a cult.
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Just so people understand how you define your terms, and that you believe that all religions are "cults." Otherwise someone might think that Mormons are sacrificing virgins to the Moon Goddess every other Sunday because you call us a "cult." The word is a subjective one unless it is applied equally to all religious systems of worship.
 
Marlin said:
Just so people understand how you define your terms, and that you believe that all religions are "cults." Otherwise someone might think that Mormons are sacrificing virgins to the Moon Goddess every other Sunday because you call us a "cult." The word is a subjective one unless it is applied equally to all religious systems of worship.
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I do, so whats your point? You are a cult.
 
Marlin said:
No it doesn't. He used every means available to him in the translation process. This included the Urim and Thummim as well as the KJV Bible and his own learning.
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Yes it does. He didn't translate. He copied.
 
Trilairian said:
Yes it does. He didn't translate. He copied.
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And what did he copy the Book of Mormon from? Other than the Isaiah passages, there are only a few of the other Old Testament prophetic quotes. Where did the vast majority of the Book of Mormon come from, if he copied it?
 
Trilairian said:
I do, so whats your point? You are a cult.
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Why don't you just call us a "religious system of worship" then? Surely you know the meaning most people take from the word "cult" whenever they hear it. Come on, you KNOW that the word has negative connotations. Otherwise you'd just point your finger at us and say, "You are religious!"
 
Marlin said:
And what did he copy the Book of Mormon from? Other than the Isaiah passages, there are only a few of the other Old Testament prophetic quotes. Where did the vast majority of the Book of Mormon come from, if he copied it?
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Right, he copied those sections, not translated them, and the rest came from his imagination.
 
Marlin said:
Why don't you just call us a "religious system of worship" then? Surely you know the meaning most people take from the word "cult" whenever they hear it. Come on, you KNOW that the word has negative connotations. Otherwise you'd just point your finger at us and say, "You are religious!"
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All religions carry a negative connotation. You are religios. Thats not a compliment. You are a cult. That is equivalent.
 
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