Was it justified?
Bible contradictions
- Thread starter w1z4rd
- Start date
Was it justified?
steal /stil/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[steel] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation, verb, stole, sto·len, steal·ing, noun
–verb (used with object) 1. to take (the property of another or others) without permission or right
That's not the point.
Did he take it w/o asking?
-let me rephrase that: did the apostles ask the farmer for his permission to take it or did they TELL him that they were going to take it because 'the Lord hath needed it'?
Did the farmer give them permission to take the donkey?
Better yet, does the bible make any mention of them ever returning it?
If I run out of gas by your house in the middle of the night, and I siphon gas out of your car, is that stealing? Yes. Was it justified? Yes, because I ran out of gas and needed to get home.
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You have probably heard the expression, "do as I say, not as I do". Well, now you know where it came from!
Obviously, the donkey owner could see that Jesus was Lord, otherwise, he would have objected, right?
Doesn't matter, does it?
Does that mean you can break any of the commandments if you have justification?
Sounds like he did object, and he didn't see Jesus, because Jesus sent his followers to do it for him.
No you are wrong, justification equates to preventing a larger crime. So stealing gas if you run out is never justified unless it is needed to save a life or to deter bodily injury. Even then you may be expected to pay for it...but no real crime.
It was prophesied that He would ride into town on a donkey.
Sure that makes sense to this secular humanist, but the Word of the Lord isn't like that.
Uh huh, so they stole one.
I'm gonna try that, "I need this Lincoln Towncar in the name of the Lord!".
Uh huh, so they stole one.
I'm gonna try that, "I need this Lincoln Towncar in the name of the Lord!".
you do see that in the text you cited it does not mention the donkey owner's response?
you see what the implication is? NO STOLEN DONKEY...perhaps?
Bwwahhahaahaaa!
I've never put that together before. BRILLIANT!
Thank you, good sir. I am going to put this one to use frequently.
No No I'm telling you that the answers are from the Bible. Christians do understand the things of God but I don't know if a person is willing to accept the gift of faith. Are you willing to accept the gift of faith first before your presuppositions? If you can tell me you are then you can approach the Bible with understanding. It's not up to me to convince you of anything. I came into this forum to share ideas and hopefully give you some insight. So that is what I am doing--I am giving you insight but I'm telling you that I get that insight from the Bible, as can you if you choose to approach the text with an "investigative" approach. It is true that the Spirit of God can move and awaken the soul to the truths of the Bible when they read it. However my point to you is that you seem to doubt its credibility even before you attempt to have faith in it. I'm saying trying having faith then read it. Do you want to know where you came from, why we are here, and where we are heading? The Bible is the only book in the world that gives a clear explanation. (Muslims for example don't believe they can know if they are going to heaven or hell and life is a test.)
Do I have your permission to preach at you a little bit to see if you have the faith? It is a really simple test.
"It is true that man has used religion for political gain. Nazi Germany had "God with us" engraved in German on the belts of Nazi soldiers. America said, "Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition." The law may even allow you to start the Christian Nazi Party, if you so desire. You can become a "reverend" for a few dollars through the tabloid classifieds and then further your political agenda with the world’s blessing, no matter how much it smears the name of Christ.
Jesus tells us in John 16:2,3 that there will be some who, in their error, commit atrocities and murder in the name of God: "The time is coming that whosoever kills you will think that he does God service." However, He informs us that these are not true believers: "And these things will they do to you, because they have not known the Father, nor me." (See also 1 John 3:15.)
Jesus told His followers to love their enemies. So if a man puts a knife into someone’s back in the name of Christianity, something obviously isn’t right. If we human beings can detect it, how much more will God? He will deal with it on Judgment Day."
Yeah well find 39 other people who speak different languages and live on different continents from all different lifestyles and write a book with perfect agreement on hundreds of controversial subjects that will sell over 6,000,000,000 copies that tell of a man who will fulfill 300+ prophesies hundreds of years from now and answer every important aspect of life--and you might begin to have a case for yourself.
Man who hasn't been born again of the Spirit is natural. Those that are spiritually dead.
Yeah in the NASB they included the 1000 chariots with the 700 horseman, I don't see why that makes a difference read the contradictory verse in the NASB.
That or the translators really know a lot MORE than we give them credit for.
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M*W: No No, Jim, you are telling him he has to be in a state of mind control in order to believe what you believe!
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M*W: You are saying that the "soul can only awaken" after it is in a state of control! This is emphatically not true! In fact, this is a lie!
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M*W: You continue to want to control him to make your point!
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M*W: This is just another lie of christianity! Christianity has so many lies... it has a lie for every question. Why do you take pride in being a liar?
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M*W: No... it's a simple lie! The book you believe in is a lie. When will you people stop your lying???
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M*W: Jim, the translators were either stupid or they were liars. Which is it? Why do you believe lies?
Technically it wouldn't even be stealing if you have intention of giving it back.
There was a guy here that was in a rush to get to work and had no milk for breakfast, so he took his neighbours bottle, (milkmen in England leave milk on the doorstep). The neighbour wasn't actually in, and the man replaced the milk in the evening.
So he got taken to court over this bottle of milk. By replacing the milk he hadn't technically stolen anything, but the womans lawyers stated that what he gave back wasn't the exact same milk he'd taken - and thus her milk had been stolen.
The same would probably happen in the quoted scenario, yet I would consider it justifiable to 'borrow' that gas etc if you were in a predicament and needed it.
The question remains.. Did jesus return the donkey?
We don't have the same understanding of what hell is, Mike. That being the case I know I haven't told you you're going to hell. My point has always been that you're on the attack here. The very way you're choosing to hold the discussion shows obvious signs or "marks" that you're provoked.
My goal isn't to provoke. My goal is to answer your question.
These are yes/no questions.
(pretend that you're answering these questions as if you were a witness being cross-examined by a lawyer in court; meaning they want a yes or no answer, with no explanations following)
Did the apostles take the donkey w/o asking permission?
Was there ever any mention of the owner giving the apostles permission to take the donkey?
Was there any mention of ever returning the donkey?
Is taking something without asking permission stealing?
"Was it justified?"
That's a very subjective question. I'd say that if the farmer did not know who Jesus was/nor believed in him, then, no it wasn't justified. If I found two guys trying to 'take' my car in the 'name of the lord', they would probably get shot.
I think our understanding of hell is more similar than you think. I was raised Baptist. I've remembered quite a bit from going to church on Sunday's, Sunday nights and Wednesday nights. I've also been 'saved' and baptised.
Hell is where Christians believe you will go if you do not choose Jesus as your savior.
But, therein also lies another problem; I don't think any of us asked to be born. I know I didn't. And to know that I didn't ask to be born, yet I was, and was thrown into this world like the rest of us, and then be told that some supposedly 'benevolent' deity gives us only two choices, choose him or spend an eternity in a 'lake of fire' and 'gnashing of teeth', really doesn't sit well with me. A benevolent deity would not leave his 'greatest creation' (a creation that he ordered his angels to worship) with those two choices.
What would your opinion of the government be if they adopted something like that; either convert to <insert religion not yours here>, or go to jail/be executed?
I want to know what part of that Christians don't understand.
If you're goal is to answer my question, then answer:
Why would a deity, that is vehemently claimed to be all-merciful and benevolent, give his children two choices like that?
Would you send your child to hell (or someplace bad) if he/she chose not to speak to you ever again?