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a non-physical thing
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That's a desperate cop-out.
Its the truth and its that way for a reason. You shouldn't have to rely on anyone else for this. This is your responsibility for your self and for your life just like it is for mine. I can't control your intentions or perceptions nor do I wish to. Those belong to you. In a world where it seems sometimes that there's very little you can control, those are two things that no one can provide for you or take away from you. God doesn't want you to take my word for anything. God wants you to experience it yourself and that depends entirely on you. God isn't after exploitation. God is after a relationship.
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Obviously, I am not simply taking your word for anything.
IF your god exists, it does not depend entirely on me. It mostly depends on the god who, up to now at least, evidently does not want me to experience it.
Obviously, I am not simply taking your word for anything.
IF your god exists, it does not depend entirely on me. It mostly depends on the god who, up to now at least, evidently does not want me to experience it.
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Obviously, I am not simply taking your word for anything.
IF your god exists, it does not depend entirely on me. It mostly depends on the god who, up to now at least, evidently does not want me to experience it.
From what I've experienced myself he doesn't come without a sincere invitation. Its consequential and I would encourage you to honestly consider those consequences.
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You might consider consequences of jumping to conclusions.
You might consider consequences of jumping to conclusions.
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You might consider consequences of jumping to conclusions.
I'm sorry. I'm not trying to do that. I'm not a perfect person and I don't know what's inside you. All I know is what I've been through and I'm trying to share. I do know that every time I've jumped to a conclusion, I've regretted it.
What I would like to know is what specific physical evidence of a spiritual thing would you suggest could be offered, particularly on a discussion forum?
I'm open to suggestions, but so far as I know, the only sure fire way to know beyond a doubt that god exists is to be god.
And I don't mean in the mamby-pamby new age way where we rub crystals together and declare ourselves god.
I mean in the create a few universes, alter space and time and really get a feel for it through a couple eternities sort of way. Really god doing what its claimed god really does.
The only physical evidence that I have of the spiritual is what its accomplished in me, my life and myself in the physical realm.
I'm actually glad you are happy about it, but sitting on this side its pretty weak stuff. So far none of it is even at the "gee whiz that was really odd" level of coincidence.
So the only physical thing I can offer is myself.
I'm willing to accept your existence, but you aren't proof of the god you are making claims of.
substantiated in scripture.
Killing my daughter because she slighted me is substantiated in scripture. Scripture is a pile of crap.
Have our senses evolved to notice non physical things?
There are lots of which our senses can't handle which we have means of detecting anyway.
The problem seems to be there aren't any non physical things to detect.
The only possible exception I can think of is gravity, which no one is really sure what it actually is. But even there it interacts directly with physical things.
I'm open to suggestions, but so far as I know, the only sure fire way to know beyond a doubt that god exists is to be god.
And I don't mean in the mamby-pamby new age way where we rub crystals together and declare ourselves god.
I mean in the create a few universes, alter space and time and really get a feel for it through a couple eternities sort of way. Really god doing what its claimed god really does.
I'm actually glad you are happy about it, but sitting on this side its pretty weak stuff. So far none of it is even at the "gee whiz that was really odd" level of coincidence.
I'm willing to accept your existence, but you aren't proof of the god you are making claims of.
Killing my daughter because she slighted me is substantiated in scripture. Scripture is a pile of crap.
I wasn't under the impression that we were talking about defining god. I'm talking about knowing him. Why do you need me for that?
Of course the catch 22 is that if I'm god, I'm not the one who had the question.
Is this an arbitrary curiosity?
There are lots of which our senses can't handle which we have means of detecting anyway.
The problem seems to be there aren't any non physical things to detect.
The only possible exception I can think of is gravity, which no one is really sure what it actually is. But even there it interacts directly with physical things.
I have sensed non physical beings. At times it seems like just a knowing, like implanted knowledge, and other times I've actually experienced physical sensations and even manifestations in my body from their presence around me or interacting with me somehow.
You want to know what most human beings would do with physical evidence of god? They would put it in a glass case and charge admission to see it. They would hook it up to probes and electrodes and wires and try to harness its energy so they could sell it or make a new bomb with it. They would analyze its composition so it could be mass produced for sale at a profit. Your own personal jesus for just 7 easy payments of...
Already done.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ag2H7R9F4ak
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ag2H7R9F4ak
There are lots of which our senses can't handle which we have means of detecting anyway.
The problem seems to be there aren't any non physical things to detect.
I agree that we find ways to sense non physical things. Because we can't sense the non physical without proper sensing equipment it gives the religious some hope. Surely if we sensed God's presence it would have to be physical. I would think that religion has already decided God is physical for if He isn't then they might as well toss all their religious paraphrenalia out the window, for they would have to admit they know nothing of God they can't sense.
I agree that we find ways to sense non physical things. Because we can't sense the non physical without proper sensing equipment it gives the religious some hope. Surely if we sensed God's presence it would have to be physical. I would think that religion has already decided God is physical for if He isn't then they might as well toss all their religious paraphrenalia out the window, for they would have to admit they know nothing of God they can't sense.
I've brought this up before and of course it was dissmissed as hogwash, but one of the major tenets of religion is that we are also spiritual beings and I don't think it would be illogical to propose that spirits can communicate with each other.
I've brought this up before and of course it was dissmissed as hogwash, but one of the major tenets of religion is that we are also spiritual beings and I don't think it would be illogical to propose that spirits can communicate with each other.
What I was getting at Lori was that no religion can claim a non physical God. For those that do make such a claim then I think it is back to the drawing board.
Conceding (for the sake of argument) that spirits do exist then it is logical that they can communicate with each other.I've brought this up before and of course it was dissmissed as hogwash, but one of the major tenets of religion is that we are also spiritual beings and I don't think it would be illogical to propose that spirits can communicate with each other.
But it remains illogical to suppose they could communicate with us (unless we also have scientific means of detecting them and proving their reality).
I wasn't under the impression that we were talking about defining god. I'm talking about knowing him. Why do you need me for that?
You seem to have missed a word or too.
You claim you know him, but you can offer nothing to substantiate that claim.
It makes it seem like you are lying.
I have an actual personal relationship with my sweety. I could introduce her. You could arrange to meet if needed. I can talk about he all day long. Real person, real relationship.
You seem to have an imaginary friend. I can't actually know him because he isn't real. I'm not willing to make an imaginary friend to pretend yours is real.
I'm sorry but you have given me nothing to work with here. You just seem to be whacked in the head and delusional. I hope you find your way free sometime. Life is quite something but your time to enjoy it is limited.