why we need ghosts

Magical Realist said:
I posted the link. I did not post anything from Twitter. Try again?
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Who is making the claim here and is required to provide evidence that can be tested by and with science. There is no other standard, other than *belief* which only pose the question if local or even general anecdotal tales may be taken as truth.
That must have been the reason for Holland to grant the title of *religion* to FSM. But, as a Holander, that sounds crazy to me.

My test for truth lies in the mathematics we know and not some new laws of nature instead of the old *proven* methods which are firmly established and verified? The proposition requires an underlying principle for the mathematical ability and conditional *necessity* for even a probability and formula (a model) of a natural appearance of a ghost (such as a mirage) and if this cannot provided a ghost will forever remain a *ghost*, a theology.

Even if this could possibly be a *frozen* instant in time and somehow preserved when conditions are right, it certainly could not be sentient and least of all have *physical abilities*.

You need to answer these questions, not I.
Just ONE testable example is necessary.
Marconi proved his *belief* in his back yard. Now we use wireless communicatiom world wide.

Actually you can call a *selfie* a mirror ghost of yourself. Sometimes it can take minutes for your ghost to be observable half way around the world.
 
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My test for truth lies in the mathematics we know and not some new laws of nature instead of the old *proven* methods which are firmly established and verified?
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Do you really? To find out what happened in the world yesterday you have only to consult the news, a compilation of videos and anecdotal reports. I highly doubt that you confirm the truth of that news with mathematical equations.

You need to answer these questions, not I.
Just ONE testable example is necessary.
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Noone needs a "testable example" to know when something happens. We accept the reality of events happening beyond our perception every day. The day we have to submit this basic readily accepted happening of reality to scientific testing let me know. lol!
 
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Exactly. Its like saying there is no proof of moon landing since i wasnt there and pictures can be faked.

The context of paranormal phenomena itself makes it hard to verify or prove - yet.
 
birch said:
Exactly. Its like saying there is no proof of moon landing since i wasnt there and pictures can be faked.

The context of paranormal phenomena itself makes it hard to verify or prove - yet.
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The lack of quality in paranormal evidence is more than made up by its preponderance. Hundreds, perhaps thousands, of accounts of this phenomenon from all over the world, photos and videos, and even audio recordings of voices and footsteps in empty buildings. To believe all this is made up is to posit such a huge and unverifiable conspiracy to deceive the public that it borders on paranoid delusion. It's far easier just to believe the paranormal is real than to believe everybody is always lying about it.
 
Well there are plenty of people who know something is up and can only wonder but since they know it is hard to prove as well, they are in the same boat as skeptics who havent experienced it.

So this is why it just remains speculation for now though many people do know there are more possibilities to reality but they are left wondering and with just as many questions just the same.
 
birch said:
Well there are plenty of people who know something is up and can only wonder but since they know it is hard to prove as well, they are in the same boat as skeptics who havent experienced it.

So this is why it just remains speculation for now though many people do know there are more possibilities to reality but they are left wondering and with just as many questions just the same.
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I've had to come to grips with how science can be true and how the paranormal can be real at the same time. Short of becoming cognitively dissonant, I just acknowledge that there's more to reality than we know of. I suspect that time and space may be ephemeral properties of some deeper medium, something along the lines of tensor networks. What we see with the paranormal are manifestations of this quantum entangled substrate.

"There are two ways to live your life: one is as though nothing is a miracle, the other is as though everything is a miracle." -- Albert Einstein
 
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Magical Realist said:
I've had to come to grips with how science can be true and how the paranormal can be real at the same time. Short of becoming cognitively dissonant, I just acknowledge that there's more to reality than we know of. I suspect that time and space may be ephemeral properties of some deeper medium, something along the lines of tensor networks. What we see with the paranormal are manifestations of this quantum entangled substrate.
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Yes, and those answers can be arrived at troughh mathematics.
"There are two ways to live your life: one is as though nothing is a miracle, the other is as though everything is a miracle." -- Albert Einstein
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Correct, he merely summarized the difference between people who believe in Science and those that believe in Woo. That sentence speaks about people, and is not intended to prove anything about universal properties and functions.
Although the evidence for ghosts is largely anecdotal, the belief in ghosts throughout history has remained widespread and persistent.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paranormal#Ghosts_and_other_spiritual_entities.

You need to read the definition of *paranormal*, to understand what it is you are actually saying.
 
Correct, he merely summarized the difference between people who believe in Science and those that believe in Woo. That sentence speaks about people, and is not intended to prove anything about universal properties and functions.
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You don't even get that Einstein was supporting the miracle-believers here, not the unmiracle-believers. You need to rediscover the spirit of true science.

You need to read the definition of *paranormal*, to understand what it is you are actually saying.
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I don't derive my definition of paranormal from Wikipedia. I derive it from the photos and eyewitness evidence of those who have encountered it.
 
Magical Realist said:
You don't even get that Einstein was supporting the miracle-believers here, not the unmiracle-believers. You need to rediscover the spirit of true science.
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Ah, yes, the spiritual side of science. We used to have that condition, it was called the "Dark Ages".

The Universe is full of wonders and I stand in awe of the potential inherent in the fabric of spacetime.
But there are NO miracles, it's all mathematics. Even if ghosts did in fact exist, they must follow the rules of universal mathematical functions or else they cannot exist, other than in the imagination.
 
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Write4U said:
Ah, yes, the spiritual side of science. We used to have that condition, it was called the "Dark Ages".

The Universe is full of wonders and I stand in awe of the potential inherent in the fabric of spacetime.
But there are NO miracles, it's all mathematics. Even if ghosts did in fact exist, they must follow the rules of universal mathematical functions or else they cannot exist, other than in the imagination.
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Mathematics doesn't determine what is real. It only determines the laws thru which the real manifests. Reality transcends whatever man can calculate in his quaint equations.
 
Magical Realist said:
I don't derive my definition of paranormal from Wikipedia. I derive it from the photos and eyewitness evidence of those who have encountered it.
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Would you care to share this *new* definition of *paranormal*.

Make sure you also address this:
Psychology[edit]
Main article: Anomalistic psychology
In anomalistic psychology, paranormal phenomena have naturalistic explanations resulting from psychological and physical factors which have sometimes given the impression of paranormal activity to some people, in fact, where there have been none.[37] The psychologist David Marks wrote that paranormal phenomena can be explained by magical thinking, mental imagery, subjective validation, coincidence, hidden causes, and fraud.[31] According to studies some people tend to hold paranormal beliefs because they possess psychology attributes that make them more likely to misattribute paranormal causation to normal experiences.[38][39] Research has also discovered that cognitive bias is a factor underlying paranormal belief
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paranormal#Psychology
 
Magical Realist said:
Mathematics doesn't determine what is real. It only determines the laws thru which the real manifests. Reality transcends whatever man can calculate in his quaint equations.
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And ghosts fall outside man's quaint equations and are therefore real?
 
Write4U said:
And ghosts fall outside man's quaint equations and are therefore real?
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Lot's of things fall outside of mathematical equations. Consciousness. And life. And love. And the struggle to be content in one's life. Why should the paranormal be any exception?
 
Magical Realist said:
Mathematics doesn't determine what is real. It only determines the laws thru which the real manifests. Reality transcends whatever man can calculate in his quaint equations.
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Well, we agree on one thing; Mathematics determine the manifestation of reality. Do ghosts satisfy or defy the laws of universal mathematics?
 
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