Why is beleif in the son important.

S

Streamline

Registered Senior Member
The bible says the following,

Mark 16:16 The one who believes and is baptized will be saved, but the one who does not believe will be condemned.

John 3:18 The one who believes in him is not condemned. The one who does not believe has been condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the one and only Son of God

John 3:36 The one who believes in the Son has eternal life. The one who rejects the Son will not see life, but God's wrath remains on him.

Why is belief in Jesus important? Is this fair? If one has done good in this life all the time, however does not believe in Jesus, why is that punished?

Is this punishment an idea of Jesus? Is it an idea of God? Or is it simply a statement what is valid on itself somehow, just as one would state the laws of nature.

I have heard that Islam sends all non-belivers (no belif in Islam) to hell. Is this fair? Is it an idea of God? If so then if belief in Islam or Christianity is mutally exclusive (one cannot belive in both religions), then are we not all condemned with God's wrath? :confused:

I do not think these parts are so nice with existing world religions.
 
The bible says the following,

Mark 16:16 The one who believes and is baptized will be saved, but the one who does not believe will be condemned.

John 3:18 The one who believes in him is not condemned. The one who does not believe has been condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the one and only Son of God

John 3:36 The one who believes in the Son has eternal life. The one who rejects the Son will not see life, but God's wrath remains on him.

Why is belief in Jesus important? Is this fair? If one has done good in this life all the time, however does not believe in Jesus, why is that punished?
Click to expand...

It does not matter how much good we have done. What bars us from eternity with God is the bad we have done and thought. Most religions of this world think of the good deeds vs bad deeds score.. That as long as ones good deeds out point the bad deeds score then all will be well. That is not the Message of Christianity.

Belief in Jesus is belief in all the things Jesus said and belief in Him as Messiah.


Is this punishment an idea of Jesus? Is it an idea of God? Or is it simply a statement what is valid on itself somehow, just as one would state the laws of nature.
Click to expand...

Jesus is God in the flesh. Its Gods will for those who take pleasure in unrighteousness.

I have heard that Islam sends all non-belivers (no belif in Islam) to hell. Is this fair? Is it an idea of God? If so then if belief in Islam or Christianity is mutally exclusive (one cannot belive in both religions), then are we not all condemned with God's wrath?
Click to expand...

Islam rejects Jesus because they reject His word and who He is. Therefore they are the ones who are in danger of the eternal lake of fire. You are right you cannot believe in both beliefs because both cannot be correct. Either Jesus is as the Bible states or Jesus is as the koran states. Those who have been loyal to the truth of Jesus will not be condemned but those who are enticed away from the truth by deceivers are doomed.

All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
Streamline said:
I have heard that Islam sends all non-belivers (no belif in Islam) to hell. Is this fair? Is it an idea of God? If so then if belief in Islam or Christianity is mutally exclusive (one cannot belive in both religions), then are we not all condemned with God's wrath?
Click to expand...

Why does the idea that Christianity and Islam are mutually exclusive, bother you?
 
Why does the idea that Christianity and Islam are mutually exclusive, bother you?

Because it may suggest gods don't exist and are merely conjured from the imaginations of men - would that bother you?
 
(Q) said:
Why does the idea that Christianity and Islam are mutually exclusive, bother you?

Because it may suggest gods don't exist and are merely conjured from the imaginations of men - would that bother you?
Click to expand...

Just because people have opposing views on God does not mean God doesn't exist.
 
Then whose view of God is the right one? I want to meet that person(s).
 
(Q) said:
Then whose view of God is the right one? I want to meet that person(s).
Click to expand...

Do you not wish to rely on yourself and what is in your heart?
Do you want someone else to decide for you?


Reaching for something in the distance
So close you can almost taste it
Release your inner visions
Feel the rain on your skin
No one else can feel it for you
Only you can let it in
No one else, no one else
Can speak the words on your lips
Drench yourself in words unspoken
Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins

Feel the rain on your skin
No one else can feel it for you
Only you can let it in
No one else, no one else
Can speak the words on your lips
Drench yourself in words unspoken
Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins
The rest is still unwritten
The rest is still unwritten
The rest is still unwritten
 
water said:
Why does the idea that Christianity and Islam are mutually exclusive, bother you?
Click to expand...

Well if both religions are the true word of God, then since we cannot believe in both religions, those that belive in Islam will be sent to hell becuase they do not believe in Jesus, those that believe in Christianity will be sent to hell because they do not belive in Muhammed, and those that do not believe in either religion is sent to hell as well since they do not believe in Jeses and since they do not believe in Muhammed.

All are sent to hell.

Does this conclution not bother you?
 
However we are parting from the original question, which is,

Why is belief in Jesus important?

Why is it not enough to punish all the bad things a person has done, why must one punish non-beleif in another person?
 
Do you not wish to rely on yourself and what is in your heart?
Do you want someone else to decide for you?

Bullshit. Whose view of god is correct? Yours? If you can't answer a yes or no or tell me whose view of god is correct, we can only assume your view is from your imagination.
 
(Q) said:
Do you not wish to rely on yourself and what is in your heart?
Do you want someone else to decide for you?

Bullshit. Whose view of god is correct? Yours? If you can't answer a yes or no or tell me whose view of god is correct, we can only assume your view is from your imagination.
Click to expand...

Why do you want to know whose view of God is correct?
And what makes you assume that a person can indeed be in possession of such a view?
 
Streamline,


Well if both religions are the true word of God, then since we cannot believe in both religions, those that belive in Islam will be sent to hell becuase they do not believe in Jesus, those that believe in Christianity will be sent to hell because they do not belive in Muhammed, and those that do not believe in either religion is sent to hell as well since they do not believe in Jeses and since they do not believe in Muhammed.

All are sent to hell.

Does this conclution not bother you?
Click to expand...

As far as I know, both religions say that God sees into a person's heart, and judges by that. And they both also say that the judgment is up to God, humans having no saying in that.
I am confident God will do as God will see fit.


Why is belief in Jesus important?

Why is it not enough to punish all the bad things a person has done, why must one punish non-beleif in another person?
Click to expand...

First of all, Jesus is not just a person, mind you.
Secondly, non-belief in fact means 'not following a desired path, not being devoted'; non-belief doesn't refer to a lack of mental contents (about Jesus, in this case). The term "belief" tends to be a bit confusing.
A person may have mental contents about Jesus, but choose not to live accordingly to them.
 
Belief in Jesus has nothing to do with the teaching of Jesus. This dogma is designed to reinforce the authority of the orthodox church.

What it really means is that one should follow the path of Jesus. But, since this is an individual persuit, you are your own authority.
 
(Q) said:
Do you not wish to rely on yourself and what is in your heart?
Do you want someone else to decide for you?

Bullshit. Whose view of god is correct? Yours? If you can't answer a yes or no or tell me whose view of god is correct, we can only assume your view is from your imagination.
Click to expand...
Forming a "view" of God is not a spiritual pursuit. Accepting the views of others isn't either. Robbing the individual of the freedom to search with faith and be transformed by their own realization has been the business of the orthodox church from the very beginning.
 
Why is belief in the Son important?

since man had fallen he could not merit anything of himself; but the sufferings and death of Christ ATONE for their sins, through faith and repentance, and so forth; and that he breaketh the bands of death, that the grave shall have no victory, and that the sting of death should be swallowed up in the hopes of glory...

You're on borrowed time brother. We all are. Heaping a great debt upon our heads that no man can pay. Save jesus alone.
 
Why do you want to know whose view of God is correct?

Don't you?

And what makes you assume that a person can indeed be in possession of such a view?

Theists.

Now, answer the question.
 
Streamline said:
The bible says the following,

Mark 16:16 The one who believes and is baptized will be saved, but the one who does not believe will be condemned.

John 3:18 The one who believes in him is not condemned. The one who does not believe has been condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the one and only Son of God

John 3:36 The one who believes in the Son has eternal life. The one who rejects the Son will not see life, but God's wrath remains on him.

Why is belief in Jesus important? Is this fair? If one has done good in this life all the time, however does not believe in Jesus, why is that punished?

Is this punishment an idea of Jesus? Is it an idea of God? Or is it simply a statement what is valid on itself somehow, just as one would state the laws of nature.

I have heard that Islam sends all non-belivers (no belif in Islam) to hell. Is this fair? Is it an idea of God? If so then if belief in Islam or Christianity is mutally exclusive (one cannot belive in both religions), then are we not all condemned with God's wrath? :confused:

I do not think these parts are so nice with existing world religions.
Click to expand...
We have to take our faith seriously. Unless we do and take actions then it's like if we see a cliff and just walk straight out and fall, we thought of the cliff in our heads but we didn't really believe so we just walked straight on thinking the cliff is not really there but that the road just continues.

If you can't accept the Son of God, Gods beloved Son, why wouldn't you accept Him in your hearts?

Some of you don't believe He exists, first of all you should believe that He exist, thereafter let Him into your heart...or is it the other way around?

I guess it may be different for each person, some people may have to "get to know Him" through the Bible, reading about Him, and discovering what kind of person He is, thereafter that person might think of Him as more real. Since they actually see the person behind the words. You see, every person is different, has a different "taste" about them (and no, I'm no cannibal :) ), it's only natural, and fake persons just haven't got that sense of coherence about themselves.

Then we have the letters where He is mentioned, why would someone send a personal letter to his friends lying to them about a fake person? There would have to be a big conspiracy in order not to falsify his claims - since it was so short time since the meeting and since he claimed also that some of the witnessess were still alive at the time the letter was written. We should first of all believe that Jesus did in fact exist as a real person living in those days.

Then we can read what is written about Him in the books and letters and such and wonder if there isn't some truth in it.

I doubt someone actually sat there and thought for himself that "this would make a pretty good lie!", also it is such a profound story in which so many people are involved. Also we should think about the consequences for the ones that made up such a story, it would not have been a slight fault to do such a thing in those days, and who would have written it? The new testament clearly consists of many writers and even if there were only one to begin with then what kind of position would he have to make such a story and be believed? It couldn't have been a person of great power since they were the ones that persecuted christ and didn't believe Him to be the One.

I may be wrong in some of this since I haven't looked it up, but there has to be some truth to what I'm saying.
 
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Christianity has transformed a rather profound movement into a cult of personality, that's why it is characterized by "accepting Jesus".
 
I just thought I would quickly point out the hypocricy and ignorance shown within this thread:

Do you want someone else to decide for you?


Reaching for something in the distance
So close you can almost taste it
Release your inner visions
Feel the rain on your skin
No one else can feel it for you
Only you can let it in
No one else, no one else
Can speak the words on your lips
Drench yourself in words unspoken
Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins

Feel the rain on your skin
No one else can feel it for you
Only you can let it in
No one else, no one else
Can speak the words on your lips
Drench yourself in words unspoken
Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins
The rest is still unwritten
The rest is still unwritten
The rest is still unwritten
Click to expand...

You asked if he wants someone else to decide for him, and then supplied a biblical quote which has the express goal of making a decision for him.

You probably have no idea what I'm getting at, so nevermind.

Now on to Cyperium who seems to be struggling:

If you can't accept the Son of God, Gods beloved Son, why wouldn't you accept Him in your hearts?
Click to expand...

Some of you don't believe He exists, first of all you should believe that He exist,
Click to expand...

Can I ask you a personal question? Have you ever read the bible? Have you ever bothered to listen to the words of your god? It would seem you haven't, and I will - due to being a nice guy - help you out a little. You ready? K..

2 Corinthians 4:4
The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

There is your answer. It was staring you right in the face and yet through some strange bible blindness, you couldn't even see it. Your god has declared that the unbelievers mind has been blinded so we cannot see the light of the gospel of christ. It is meaningless, we are blind to it. You fools try to persuade us to believe, convince us of biblical reality without even noticing that god has already told you that's impossible. You can't - because we have been blinded by him.

Of course this has it's downside in that we are only non-believers because god made it that way, and wants it that way. We have absolutely no choice in the matter - and are doomed to hell because of it.

Now, shoo flea.. you're wasting your time and ours - so sayeth god.
 
Cyperium and water,

I have two questions for you both.

If Jesus was an ordinary man, not son of God, no connection with the divine whatsoever, would you follow his teachings? You would not be punished for not believing in him; Jesus was just as ordinary as any man on earth, so if you wanted to ignore him you could do so without punishment. Would Jesus still be an important part of you lifes? In otherwords, as a philosopher only.

Second question,

Do you realize that belief in someone gives power to that person. If you could freely give your vote to anyone who lives or has lived on earth, and that vote would give that person power to rule earth and the divine heavens' afterworld, who would that vote go to? Rembember you should not be forced by anyone saying, vote for me or you will be punished; your vote should be completely free, and all the Gods want you to freely cast your vote. Remember that whoever you give your vote to will have power over you for a long time forward, so your vote is important to you. You can also opt out and not choose a single person but rather a group of persons, or vote for a system without specifying any persons. What would you vote for?
 
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