Why does the government hide UFO's?

origin said:
The poster who called himself John title made many claims that turned out to be false, end of story.
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It is not completely false. obviously you didnt research about john titor's claims you just read some forums he said that we live in a multi universe. that coukd explain why some his predictions didnt came true if u look enough you will see the world is shaping in a way JT described it but not exactly the same because were not from the same universe this guy made a impact on scientist all john titors claim on time travel his explanaition on how it works makes sense to scientist and scientist around the world is trying to achieve what john titor said. if your talking about his claims that end up false its not false he warned people and the future events changed the goverment wouldnt say to u oh we do this we dothat to avoid what jt said ofcourse the goverment is already aware of this stuff and the world is in a current silentwar like coldwar but not with nuclear weapons but developing this machine that will enable humans to visit other world lines. for example area 51, CERN etc..
the public is not aware ofcourse as always.
 
And just an example of JT's predicitons i dont wanna copy paste whathe said cause im lazy im just gonna say it in my own words. JT said that inthe near future people would be having wireless internet and people's entertainment will be in their hands and soon people will create their own entertainment andthats whats gonna be the new way of entertaining people. something like that in 2000 you wont be even predict this stuff inthis accuracy the internet is still connected to computers and were still using pagers and stuff and people are Lways watching tv... its not just this how close his predicitions was he also saib athing about the US will suffer from a depression and civil war and that leads to ww3 this is already happening this 2016 may the us dollar suffered inflation nd depression but the us dollar is still hanging there with all their debts. how could JT predict this at 2000? and oanother thing he said the middle east will be ingulf with war increasing more tension between the west and russia and china will be the next sending man to space and few years later china did send man into space HOW could this be predicted by JT? the only claim that he made that didnt cometrue is that civil war will happen in america in 2005-2008 idk the exact year and he said that russia will nuke america in 2015 obviously didnt happen but JT said in 2000 that we can change our world lines Future if we really wanted too not all dimension have the same events and i think because of JT'swarnings the goverment that of course obviously aware of this made moves to avoid this events but u see were still heading inthe direction of WW3 i hope it doesnt happen if you do more research u will see all the debunkers that is trying to proove JT is wrong cant cement that JT is a hoax most hoax just say negative things from jt like what u said without saying what i just explained here. the goverment is obviously trying to do this because they dont want this to spread tothe public and they want this to remain a legend. the goverment is good at misleading people just like whatthey did on UFO's spreading it could be intelligent life coming from distant planets but in reality this UFO' are really Travelers from other world line or dimensions.
 
Steins_222 said:
And just an example of JT's predicitons i dont wanna copy paste whathe said cause im lazy im just gonna say it in my own words. JT said that inthe near future people would be having wireless internet and people's entertainment will be in their hands and soon people will create their own entertainment andthats whats gonna be the new way of entertaining people. something like that in 2000 you wont be even predict this stuff inthis accuracy the internet is still connected to computers and were still using pagers and stuff and people are Lways watching tv... its not just this how close his predicitions was he also saib athing about the US will suffer from a depression and civil war and that leads to ww3 this is already happening this 2016 may the us dollar suffered inflation nd depression but the us dollar is still hanging there with all their debts. how could JT predict this at 2000? and oanother thing he said the middle east will be ingulf with war increasing more tension between the west and russia and china will be the next sending man to space and few years later china did send man into space HOW could this be predicted by JT? the only claim that he made that didnt cometrue is that civil war will happen in america in 2005-2008 idk the exact year and he said that russia will nuke america in 2015 obviously didnt happen but JT said in 2000 that we can change our world lines Future if we really wanted too not all dimension have the same events and i think because of JT'swarnings the goverment that of course obviously aware of this made moves to avoid this events but u see were still heading inthe direction of WW3 i hope it doesnt happen if you do more research u will see all the debunkers that is trying to proove JT is wrong cant cement that JT is a hoax most hoax just say negative things from jt like what u said without saying what i just explained here. the goverment is obviously trying to do this because they dont want this to spread tothe public and they want this to remain a legend. the goverment is good at misleading people just like whatthey did on UFO's spreading it could be intelligent life coming from distant planets but in reality this UFO' are really Travelers from other world line or dimensions.
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You are very gullible.
 
Steins_222 said:
... and he said that russia will nuke america in 2015 obviously didnt happen but JT said in 2000 that we can change our world lines Future if we really wanted too not all dimension have the same events ...
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Wait, so, if he makes a prediction and it comes true, that's compelling evidence that he's from the future - but if it doesn't come true it's not because he's a fraud - it's because he's from a slightly different world line?

How perfectly unfalsifiable!


I too am from the future. I predict that monkeys will fly out Donald Trump's butt. If they don't, it's because I came from an alternate future. Worship me.
 
Its ok if you dont believe guys im not telling u too, im just spreading the word for those who is interested on knowing the truth do your own research and judge for yourself and i wont reply to people who judge base on their Bias. and not with an open mind just reminds me of people who didnt believe earth was round but it is normal because people dont know things its normal to think the world is not round if you live in a world that seems flat
 
I told u i keep an open mind i dont believe it at first but i did my own research and found more things about the guy that made me think myself this might be true it is just commonsense its quite obvious i dont want to go into detaiks what convince me if your not really interested and judge with your bias theres no sense telling it to you for those people who want to see for themselves if this guy is real or not look him up and related things that connect to his story this will be my last reply.
 
Do you have an open mind too?
Have you considered the consequences of believing in a claim that is unfalsifiable?
 
Steins_222 said:
And just an example of JT's predicitons i dont wanna copy paste whathe said cause im lazy im just gonna say it in my own words. JT said that inthe near future people would be having wireless internet and people's entertainment will be in their hands and soon people will create their own entertainment andthats whats gonna be the new way of entertaining people. something like that in 2000 you wont be even predict this stuff inthis accuracy the internet is still connected to computers and were still using pagers and stuff and people are Lways watching tv... its not just this how close his predicitions was he also saib athing about the US will suffer from a depression and civil war and that leads to ww3 this is already happening this 2016 may the us dollar suffered inflation nd depression but the us dollar is still hanging there with all their debts. how could JT predict this at 2000? and oanother thing he said the middle east will be ingulf with war increasing more tension between the west and russia and china will be the next sending man to space and few years later china did send man into space HOW could this be predicted by JT? the only claim that he made that didnt cometrue is that civil war will happen in america in 2005-2008 idk the exact year and he said that russia will nuke america in 2015 obviously didnt happen but JT said in 2000 that we can change our world lines Future if we really wanted too not all dimension have the same events and i think because of JT'swarnings the goverment that of course obviously aware of this made moves to avoid this events but u see were still heading inthe direction of WW3 i hope it doesnt happen if you do more research u will see all the debunkers that is trying to proove JT is wrong cant cement that JT is a hoax most hoax just say negative things from jt like what u said without saying what i just explained here. the goverment is obviously trying to do this because they dont want this to spread tothe public and they want this to remain a legend. the goverment is good at misleading people just like whatthey did on UFO's spreading it could be intelligent life coming from distant planets but in reality this UFO' are really Travelers from other world line or dimensions.
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Magical Realist said:
Isn't unfalsifiable the definition of a true claim?
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No. You should know this. It's Popper.

The claims that God exists, or that unicorns exist or that there's an invisible dragon in my garage are all unfalsifiable. There is no possible way that the claim could be subjected to a test whereby it might be shown to be false.

Because of this, the claim is scientifically meaningless.

"The concern with falsifiability gained attention by way of philosopher of scienceKarl Popper's scientific epistemology "falsificationism". Popper stresses the problem of demarcation—distinguishing the scientific from the unscientific—and makes falsifiability the demarcation criterion, such that what is unfalsifiable is classified as unscientific, and the practice of declaring an unfalsifiable theory to be scientifically true is pseudoscience."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability
 
Sagan's Invisible Dragon is particularly applicable to see the folly of JT's claims. It's a form of moving the goalposts - a claim continually changes as objections are raised.

Similarities:
JT: "It didn't come true? Did I mention my timeline is different?"
Dragon: "You're using IR goggles. Did I mention it doesn't emit heat?"


"A fire-breathing dragon lives in my garage"
Suppose (I'm following a group therapy approach by the psychologist Richard Franklin[4]) I seriously make such an assertion to you. Surely you'd want to check it out, see for yourself. There have been innumerable stories of dragons over the centuries, but no real evidence. What an opportunity!

"Show me," you say. I lead you to my garage. You look inside and see a ladder, empty paint cans, an old tricycle--but no dragon.

"Where's the dragon?" you ask.

"Oh, she's right here," I reply, waving vaguely. "I neglected to mention that she's an invisible dragon."

You propose spreading flour on the floor of the garage to capture the dragon's footprints.

"Good idea," I say, "but this dragon floats in the air."

Then you'll use an infrared sensor to detect the invisible fire.

"Good idea, but the invisible fire is also heatless."

You'll spray-paint the dragon and make her visible.

"Good idea, but she's an incorporeal dragon and the paint won't stick." And so on. I counter every physical test you propose with a special explanation of why it won't work.

Now, what's the difference between an invisible, incorporeal, floating dragon who spits heatless fire and no dragon at all? If there's no way to disprove my contention, no conceivable experiment that would count against it, what does it mean to say that my dragon exists? Your inability to invalidate my hypothesis is not at all the same thing as proving it true. Claims that cannot be tested, assertions immune to disproof are veridically worthless, whatever value they may have in inspiring us or in exciting our sense of wonder. What I'm asking you to do comes down to believing, in the absence of evidence, on my say-so."
 
I think the best evidence for supernatural events of any kind could be found in horror movies. And sci-fi movies.
 
DaveC426913 said:
Do you have an open mind too?
Have you considered the consequences of believing in a claim that is unfalsifiable?
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Why is the discussion about John Titor? I thought that nonsense died out a decade ago.

But to the point: Do you believe your wife or child when they say they love you? Are you claiming that you don't believe in anything that is unfalsifiable?

Do you believe in math? I was trying to remember the scope of Gödel but I believe mathematics is based on assumptions that cannot be falsified. I know we cannot show math is complete but I'm not sure about how far that extends any more... In either case, at the deepest level math is taken on faith to be true.
 
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Magical Realist said:
But a true claim SHOULD be unfalsifiable. That's what it means to be true.
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No, a claim can be true but also falsifiable, meaning there is a way to test the claim to be false. Whether it is false or true is irrelevant to whether it is falsifiable.

If I say my car can go 100 mph, it can be tested, which means the claim is falsifiable. But it may or may not be true. If I say I had orange juice for breakfast, there is no way to falsify [test] that claim but it could be false or true.

Dave, do you dismiss my claims of having orange juice for breakfast, or any claim that can't be falsified? In fact you can't function in life that way.
 
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Ivan Seeking said:
No, a claim can be true but also falsifiable, meaning there is a way to test the claim to be false or true. Whether it is false or true is irrelevant to whether it is falsifiable.
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Falsifiable means it can proven to be false. A true claim by definition cannot be proven to be false. Therefore a true claim is unfalsifiable.

"Falsifiability or refutability of a statement, hypothesis, or theory is the inherent possibility that it can be proved false. A statement is called falsifiable if it is possible to conceive of an observation or an argument which negates the statement in question. In this sense,falsify is synonymous with nullify, meaning to invalidate or "show to be false"."===
 
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Magical Realist said:
Falsifiable means it can proven to be false. A true claim by definition cannot be proven to be false. Therefore a true claim is unfalsifiable.

"Falsifiability or refutability of a statement, hypothesis, or theory is the inherent possibility that it can be proved false. A statement is called falsifiable if it is possible to conceive of an observation or an argument which negates the statement in question. In this sense,falsify is synonymous with nullify, meaning to invalidate or "show to be false"."===
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Read your own definition: It is the possibility that it can be proven false. It has nothing to do with the truth or falsity of a claim. The issue is, can the claim be tested and shown to be false IF it is false?

Just use the word "tested" instead of falsified. Essentially we are talking about the same thing.
 
Ivan Seeking said:
Read your own definition: It is the possibility that it can be proven false. It has nothing to do with the truth or falsity of a claim. The issue is, can the claim be tested and shown to be false IF it is false?

Just use the word "tested" instead of falsified. Essentially we are talking about the same thing.
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I'm using the word "refuted" as a synonym as per the article. Only false statements have the possibility of being falsified or refuted. That's why they're false. If Popper had meant tested, he should have said so. I don't really buy his theories anyway. He was behind trying to make science the ultimate tool for all truth. I disagree with that sort of positivism.

Note...every true statement is unfalsifiable. But not every unfalsifiable statement is true.

Question: given all we now know about evolution, how would you falsify it?
 
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Magical Realist said:
I'm using the word "refuted" as a synonym as per the article. Only false statements have the possibility of being falsified or refuted. That's why they're false. If Popper had meant tested, he should have said so. I don't really buy his theories anyway. He was behind trying to make science the ultimate tool for all truth. I disagree with that sort of positivism.

Note...every true statement is unfalsifiable. But not every unfalsifiable statement is true.

Question: given all we now know about evolution, how would you falsify it?
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Look, you failing to understand the obvious or just jerking people around. I told you how it works. The best word for someone like you to use is "tested". If you just want to play mental masturbation games, go play alone.

There are plenty of serious people interested in the subject of UFOs and you make us all want to hide.
 
Ivan Seeking said:
Look, you failing to understand the obvious or just jerking people around. I told you how it works. The best word for someone like you to use is "tested". If you just want to play mental masturbation games, go play alone.

There are plenty of serious people interested in the subject of UFOs and you make us all want to hide.
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So because I question your holy positivist philosopher, I have no credibility? That doesn't follow at all..But then I'm used to ad hom attacks from people who can't debate their position. I'm just surprised to see you join those ranks. I didn't take you for a crowd follower like these other dweebs.
 
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