Who do you believe Paul or Jesus?

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^^ Ouch.

 

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Yo SouthStar,

Originally Posted by 786
Hello,

I have some questions about Christianity. Please anwer if you can.
When you answer please provide as many quotes as possible, from the Bible.
When answering please tell me the number of the question so I know what you are answering. Or repeat the question when answering.

streched, it would be really easy for me if you could simply use the QUOTE tags so that I could know where one thing begins and ends..

Trinity?

1. If Jesus was a God then why could people see him?

"No man hath seen God at any time," John 1:18

Quote SouthStar:
“No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.”

http://www.christiancourier.com/questions/seeGodQuestion.htm

I decided not to reinvent the wheel so simply read the article and ask any questions you may have. Otherwise I would have to type all that..

“This distinguishes the Trinity, showing the relationship between the Father and the Son, which are furthermore described as One, in the sentence: "I and the Father are one". After all, before Jesus time, no one had seen God the Father but, if you actually took the time to read it, Jesus tells us that He came to BEAR witness of the Father, thus if you knew Jesus, you knew the Father.”

Here Jesus is one with God, they are “one”.

Quote SouthStar:
“That proves His divinity all the more, for if He chose to have His own way and the Father also to have His own way then there would be discord”

Here we have “two” distinct god personas. “He” and the “Father”, with “two” distinct potential opinions which could create discord.

Where did you get the idea that the Son and the Father have "distinct" opinions? Show me the Scripture that says this.

Quote SouthStar:
“The theological term Trinity does not refer to three Gods. I was hoping even you would know that. So please stop arguing otherwise because it is common knowledge to even the atheists on this forum.”

Here we are back to a Trinity that reflects “one” god.

Some Texts reflecting two distinct personas:

"but of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father." (Mark 13:32)

This, I must admit is a very peculiar saying of Christ. I would like any Christian reading this to submit my input.

It is obvious that as God, Jesus cannot be "less omniscient" than His Father. Many theologians have speculated that he referred to His human side. I disagree with this view.
____________________
Matthew Henry notes:

but is there any thing which the Son is ignorant of? We read indeed of a book which was sealed, till the Lamb opened the seals; but did not he know what was in it, before the seals were opened? Was not he privy to the writing of it? There were those in the primitive times, who taught from this text, that there were some things that Christ, as man, was ignorant of; and from these were called Agnoetae; they said, "It was no more absurd to say so, than to say that his human soul suffered grief and fear;’’ and many of the orthodox fathers approved of this. Some would evade it, by saying that Christ spoke this in a way of prudential economy, to divert the disciples from further enquiry: but to this one of the ancients answers, It is not fit to speak too nicely in this matter — ou dei pany akribologein , so Leontius in Dr. Hammond, "It is certain (says Archbishop Tillotson) that Christ, as God, could not be ignorant of any thing; but the divine wisdom which dwelt in our Saviour, did communicate itself to his human soul, according to the divine pleasure, so that his human nature might sometimes not know some things; therefore Christ is said to grow in wisdom (Lu. 2:52), which he could not be said to do, if the human nature of Christ did necessarily know all things by virtue of its union with the divinity.’’ Dr. Lightfoot explains it thus; Christ calls himself the Son, as Messiah. Now the Messiah, as such, was the father’s servant (Isa. 42:1), sent and deputed by him, and as such a one he refers himself often to his Father’s will and command, and owns he did nothing of himself (Jn. 5:19); in like manner he might be said to know nothing of himself. The revelation of Jesus Christ was what God gave unto him, Rev. 1:1. He thinks, therefore, that we are to distinguish between those excellencies and perfections of his, which resulted from the personal union between the divine and human nature, and those which flowed from the anointing of the Spirit; from the former flowed the infinite dignity of his perfect freedom from all sin; but from the latter flowed his power of working miracles, and his foreknowledge of things to come. What therefore (saith he) was to be revealed by him to his church, he was pleased to take, not from the union of the human nature with the divine, but from the revelation of the Spirit, by which he yet knew not this, but the Father only knows it; that is, God only, the Deity; for (as Archbishop Tillotson explains it) it is not used here personally, in distinction from the Son and the Holy Ghost, but as the Father is, Fons et Principium Deitatis — The Fountain of Deity.
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I am personally at a loss to any concrete answer, not wishing to submit my own speculation. I reject the speculations of these theologians as that, mere speculation.

I assure you however, I will do my homework. Forward this question to any other Jew on the board and see what they think.

"for my Father is greater than I." (John 14:38)

Hebrews 2
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, now crowned with glory and honor because he suffered death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone.

Being made a little lower than the angels, that He might become human, you can see that his human element because it was finite, could not compare with the infinite Father.

"and this is life eternal, that they may know thee, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." (John 17:3)

That is now what the verse says. You missed the part in between about "the one True God". I am sure when you read the verse correctly it will make sense.

"The Son can do nothing of himself." (John 3:19)

That's not what John 3:19 says.

"Why callest thou me good? There is none good, but one, that is God." (Mark 10:18)

This verse has been taken out of context many times. Jesus was testing the young ruler because he wanted to know how to inherit life. Now obviously you have to believe in Jesus to inherit eternal life. Jesus wanted to know if he would get a hint and recognize who he was talking to.

"Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name that is above every name." (Philippians 2:9)

See the Chapter that you asked me about in John 17 for more on glofirying Christ.

I think these verses speak for themselves reflecting “two” distinct personas.
So, if Jesus is God and therefore “one” how do we resolve the texts above?

Apart from the one about Christ knowing the future, I answered pretty much everything. There was one which did not say what you quoted it to say and another which you misquoted thereby altering it's message.

From SouthStars link: http://www.christiancourier.com/questions/inspirationQuestion.htm
First, “inspiration” of the Bible means that it had a divine origin. The term “inspiration” is found in the New Testament one time (2 Tim. 3:16).
“Every scripture inspired of God is also profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for instruction which is in righteousness.”
I am still asking, with or without inspiration:
“How do we resolve the duality indicated in the verses above. For example: "but of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father." (Mark 13:32)

I don't understand the question here.

If the Son and the Father are “one”, how come only the Father knows the day and the hour?
Allcare.

I suspect the discrepancy is in the interpretation of the verb "know", as we saw earlier with "no one has seen the Father". I'll do my research.