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The Soul
- Thread starter mis-t-highs
- Start date
(Q) said:So, the fact that something supernatural does not exist in the natural world can be accepted as existing simply because it is not understood?
You don't get my point. When we've understood the "supernatural" it's not supernatural anymore, it never was, except in our small minds. Supernatural things should only be accepted when they're understood.
absolutely, and I never going to know, am I, you dont know yourself.Yorda said:You have no idea why I believe in reincarnation, but I know why you don't believe in it.
I dont believe in fantasys as reality, so theres no doubt you know why, I dont believe in reincarnation.
so who's a clever person then.
thats the wrong answer, how are you going to convince anybody, with that kind of reply.Yorda said:You think you're so tough.
you just prove there point.
Yorda: You think you're so tough.
*************
M*W: That was an childish answer, Yorda. It's not about being tough, it's about being right.
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M*W: That was an childish answer, Yorda. It's not about being tough, it's about being right.
qwerasdfzxcv
Registered Senior Member
You can't prove anything, so you can't be right. It's all about what you believe.
mustafhakofi said:thats the wrong answer, how are you going to convince anybody, with that kind of reply.
There was no question, hence no answer, and I'm not trying to convince anyone about anything.
Medicine Woman said:M*W: That was an childish answer, Yorda. It's not about being tough, it's about being right.
You think you're so right. Do you remember me saying that to you before?
Yorda: You think you're so right. Do you remember me saying that to you before?
*************
M*W: Yorda, it doesn't matter what you said before. In being right, there is no contest. Whether I'm right, or whether I'm wrong is not the matter. It's who believes it. If you don't believe it, that's okay. So continue to believe the lies you believe. That doesn't change anything.
*************
M*W: Yorda, it doesn't matter what you said before. In being right, there is no contest. Whether I'm right, or whether I'm wrong is not the matter. It's who believes it. If you don't believe it, that's okay. So continue to believe the lies you believe. That doesn't change anything.
qwerasdfzxcv
Registered Senior Member
Medicine Woman how can you prove what he believes are lies?
Medicine Woman said:So continue to believe the lies you believe.
Why do you call my thoughts lies? I never call your beliefs or thoughts lies, even though I don't agree with them. We're all part of the same me, so why not treat others as yourself? If we hurt someone else, we hurt ourselves, because they're a part of "the self". How do you know that you are "right"? I know you are right, but only for yourself. My truth is not your truth. In the end, all thoughts will merge into one "absolute" truth. It's foolish to say that one knows the "absolute truth" when we're still so far away from it. But that's the way it is in the beginning, you are the way you are, and so is your future.
What we think of and what we are, are two different positions. We can't be what we think of. If we still think and speak of the truth, we are not the truth. If we really are the truth, we don't have to speak about it, since "we are what we are". There are many people who speak about the truth, but when people ask them what they have done in the name of truth, their true self is revealed, they are "the lie". Then there are those who never think about truth, nor speak of it, yet everything that happens through them comes from the truth.
Do not be proud of your knowledge
nor trust that you are one who knows
Consult with the ignorant as with the wise
for no limit can be set to skill
and no artist is equipped with perfection
Perfect speech is concealed, more than turquoise
yet it is found among the maids at millstones
Yorda: Why do you call my thoughts lies? I never call your beliefs or thoughts lies, even though I don't agree with them. We're all part of the same me, so why not treat others as yourself? If we hurt someone else, we hurt ourselves, because they're a part of "the self". How do you know that you are "right"? I know you are right, but only for yourself. My truth is not your truth. In the end, all thoughts will merge into one "absolute" truth. It's foolish to say that one knows the "absolute truth" when we're still so far away from it. But that's the way it is in the beginning, you are the way you are, and so is your future.
*************
M*W: You are on the lunatic fringe, Yorda, you don't know what the truth is.
*************
Yorda: What we think of and what we are, are two different positions. We can't be what we think of. If we still think and speak of the truth, we are not the truth. If we really are the truth, we don't have to speak about it, since "we are what we are". There are many people who speak about the truth, but when people ask them what they have done in the name of truth, their true self is revealed, they are "the lie". Then there are those who never think about truth, nor speak of it, yet everything that happens through them comes from the truth.
Do not be proud of your knowledge
nor trust that you are one who knows
Consult with the ignorant as with the wise
for no limit can be set to skill
and no artist is equipped with perfection
Perfect speech is concealed, more than turquoise
yet it is found among the maids at millstones
*************
M*W: Yorda, you are way off balance. Your concept of reality is worn. You are coming from a place of fantasy.
*************
M*W: You are on the lunatic fringe, Yorda, you don't know what the truth is.
*************
Yorda: What we think of and what we are, are two different positions. We can't be what we think of. If we still think and speak of the truth, we are not the truth. If we really are the truth, we don't have to speak about it, since "we are what we are". There are many people who speak about the truth, but when people ask them what they have done in the name of truth, their true self is revealed, they are "the lie". Then there are those who never think about truth, nor speak of it, yet everything that happens through them comes from the truth.
Do not be proud of your knowledge
nor trust that you are one who knows
Consult with the ignorant as with the wise
for no limit can be set to skill
and no artist is equipped with perfection
Perfect speech is concealed, more than turquoise
yet it is found among the maids at millstones
*************
M*W: Yorda, you are way off balance. Your concept of reality is worn. You are coming from a place of fantasy.
qwerasdfzxcv
Registered Senior Member
Why are his beliefs fantasy? Can you prove this?
because yorda asserts, that there is a soul.qwerasdfzxcv said:Why are his beliefs fantasy? Can you prove this?
Who has the Burden of Proof?
Using that phrase makes it sound like a person has to definitely prove, beyond a doubt, that something is true; that, however, is only rarely the case. A more accurate label would be a “burden of support” — the key is that a person must support what they are saying. This can involve empirical evidence, logical arguments, and even positive proof.
Which of those must be presented will depend very much upon the nature of the claim in question. Some claims are easier and simpler to support than others — but regardless, a claim without any support is not one which merits rational belief. Thus, anyone making a claim which they consider rational and which they expect others to accept must provide some support.
An even more basic principle to remember here is that some burden of proof always lies with the person who is making a claim, not the person who is hearing the claim and who may not initially believe it. In practice, then, this means that the initial burden of proof lies with the theist, not with the atheist. Both the atheist and the theist probably agree on a great many things, but it is the theist who asserts the further belief in the existence of a god or soul in this case.
This extra claim is what must be supported, and the requirement of rational, logical support for a claim is very important. The methodology of skepticism, critical thinking, and logical arguments is what allows us to separate sense from nonsense; when a person abandons that methodology, they abandon any pretense of trying to make sense or engage in a sensible discussion.
Proving Existence or Non-Existence.
The existence of a thing can be conclusively proved by producing one single instance of the thing.
To put that another way: -
When the existence of a thing is denied, This can be proven wrong by producing one single instance of the thing said not to exist
The non-existence of a thing can never be conclusively proved because there is always the theoretical assumption that the thing exists but has not been seen yet or it exists in a place that can not be visited. Unless all places in the universe have been visited and are being constantly observed, we can not be absolutely certain.
From this we can say that there are only two possible statements we can make about the existence of a thing:
The thing exists.
It is unknown if the thing exists or not.
It is not possible to prove that a thing "does not exist" without further qualifying criteria.
If a thing does NOT exist it can not leave any evidence of it's non-existence. Only things that DO exist can leave evidence. From this we can derive that conclusive proof can only come from the person that claims that a thing exists. It is nonsensical to demand proof of non-existence.
this is why, does that help you.
Whatever we can imagine can become true, otherwise we wouldn't be able to imagine it. If we don't believe in our self (ie. soul), what we see is no longer real, because all this comes from our self. It's not possible to be conscious of something outside our consciousness, outside our self. So it appears that the world and everything in it, is inside of one self.
The theory of reincarnation is not a mere theory, but an actual fact that is being now established beyond reasonable doubt. Many instances have now come to light where individuals were able to recollect their past lives through a process of regression or by other means. The theory still baffles many, while many others refuse to acknowledge it because of intense prejudice.
The theory of reincarnation is not a mere theory, but an actual fact that is being now established beyond reasonable doubt. Many instances have now come to light where individuals were able to recollect their past lives through a process of regression or by other means. The theory still baffles many, while many others refuse to acknowledge it because of intense prejudice.
some factual material would be handy, please thank you.
mis-t-highs said:some factual material would be handy, please thank you.
My mom remembers her former lives... and there are many others too. Especially small children.
Whatever we can imagine can become true, otherwise we wouldn't be able to imagine it.
Silly in the extreme. By your logic, invisible flying pink unicorns exist.
The theory of reincarnation is not a mere theory, but an actual fact that is being now established beyond reasonable doubt.
Complete hogwash. Your statement only confirms your lack of connexion with reality.
The theory still baffles many, while many others refuse to acknowledge it because of intense prejudice.
Fantasies are not theories.
Silly in the extreme. By your logic, invisible flying pink unicorns exist.
The theory of reincarnation is not a mere theory, but an actual fact that is being now established beyond reasonable doubt.
Complete hogwash. Your statement only confirms your lack of connexion with reality.
The theory still baffles many, while many others refuse to acknowledge it because of intense prejudice.
Fantasies are not theories.