What makes you think that there was a priory of anything? Is there any tangible –not imaginary non-existent beings such as Allah, eternity, infinity- evidence or example in given nature that shows or hints any a priory existence.
Yes there is! It seems you haven’t been paying attention to my posts, or you would have seen your answer already.
I said (on more than one occasion):
“Everything temporal and finite seems to have a cause in this universe, based on all empirical evidences so far.”
Just because it is considered as “fallacy” by human logic, it doesn’t mean that a creator, first cause, a priory beings must exist.
It doesn’t mean that a priory
must exist for anything
unless... it is temporal and finite. Otherwise, you are talking about an existent that is truly a-temporal (eternal) and infinite, which means that this existent could never have been caused. That’s if you can accept and grasp the meaning of
infinites?
Logic is not something that was carved into the deepest origins of universe, it is a human way to analyse things, and it exist in mind level, there is no particle for logic, or no tree out there that produces natural “logic” fruit. Human logic itself is evolving, what you find as logical today could not be found logical two thousands of years ago.
Then you might as well omit the logic of all the great thinkers of the past and the progress in Human thought to this stage, which by the way, finds its foundations from those great thinkers (from thousands of years ago!) even to this day?
And what you find as logical today is nothing but a thought exercise. Of course, if you are not using divine logic, such as Qur’anic verses or Cosmological Argument without checking out what is really going in Cosmos…
Oh but we do check “what is really going on in Cosmos...” and science seems to agree with what the “divine logic” in the Qur’an has said all along. Funny that science hasn’t refuted any of that, which is even more damning to your case.
About astronomic knowledge we get from Qur’an:
-from Globes on Ancient Coins-
Pythagoras (who died ca. 497 B.C.) who defined his era with geometrical perspective must have applied his theories on any shape I assume.
Before them, even previous ancient civilizations like Egyptian or Indian had vast amount of knowledge about “heavenly bodies” –not your imaginary dream-like heaven. Because they were “measuring” and “observing” and illuminating themselves, they were not waiting for divine revelations.
How do you know “they were not waiting for (or derived their thoughts from) divine revelations.”? Do you think they were all “atheists” back then? Do you think “divine logic” wasn’t passed down through prophet’s way back then either? How on Earth could you possibly know this for sure?
Furthermore, where do you get the idea that these great thinkers were “illuminating themselves”? Don’t you think their own foundations of thought and logic weren’t passed down from prior great thinkers from their past? Do you think they just happened to think up all their new laws and foundations of their logical premises and axioms without any prior understanding or learning? Please!
Stealing this knowledge and selling thousands of year old human knowledge as Allah’s words are nothing but plagiarism.
Then everything we have learned and advanced from the past to this stage is “plagiarism”? The mind boggles!
When Christians were trying to promote their God, they tried to cut off this information from their people; yet early Islamic civilization translated this and many other ancient –particularly Greek- knowledge into Arabic and they also observed skies. That’s why there has never been a serious “flat earth” theory among Muslim scholars when Europeans believed that earth was flat, and Bible even doesn't teach this kind of things, it was a political attempt by some Christians. Yet Muslims didn’t get this knowledge a priori from Qur’an; no, actually even Qur’an took this knowledge from ancients.
So Muslim’s never advanced from the teachings of this past knowledge then? Why would the West even approach and want to learn from the Muslims back then, travelling vast distances to learn, when they could have easily translated the knowledge of those ancient’s and enhanced from them all by their selves?
Around five to six centuries ago from today, Muslim scholars also joined the club and stopped their curiosity due to some social historic reasons.
LOL! Besides totally omitting what happened before this period, what is this “club” you speak of? And they didn’t stop their curiosity because they simply joined some “club”, but was indeed from outside influences stemming from “some social historic reasons”. It had nothing to do with their lack of curiosity, I assure you.
You didn't get the Big Bang, at least not the same way modern science got it. It took science hundreds of years and numerous observation to claim that everything in this universe originates (not "created", definitely not this disgusting word) from Big Bang. Science needed to measure the background radiation and related calculations in order to make this claim.
And it took science hundreds of years to come to the same conclusion which was already mentioned in a book written 1400 years ago? Wow!
Yet no one claims that Big Bang , or anything else for that matter, came from nothing.
Exactly! And no one here said it came from nothing either. Quite the contrary, science (and I) agree that something cannot come from nothing! That was my whole contention from the start. Remember? And bear in mind the terms finite and temporal to ascribe to existents in the premise?
Big Bang must be originated from something else if everything else originates from something. I repeat: creation, art, philosophy, Qur'an, eternal, infinity, Allah, heaven are all the products of human imagination. They have nothing to do with real physical universe.
Amazing! So now you just agreed with everything I’ve just said all along!
Nonetheless, all these “products” come from our deductive abilities of what we observe and perceive in this physical universe (from empirical evidences). That’s why we have Philosophy, Metaphysics and Theism. All of which by the way, are a product of Human thought and that word you don’t seem to like very much now... “logic”. Another word you seem to have an allergic reaction to!
Now you are trying to sell us Qur'anic astronomy lessons which belonged to humanity long before Qur'an. Night and Day, orbits were all observed, categorized and they built pyramids on this knowledge. Since this thread is about Qur'an, why don't you come with other scientific revelations of Qur'an such as how did it guess the DNA or Atom. Bring the verses and hadiths...
First, the Qur’an doesn’t guess. Secondly, the Qur’an is not a book of science, rather, it’s a book of signs, laws and an inspiration for us to think for ourselves and ponder on the things we otherwise take for granted. I have provided enough information so far. If you want many other verses and Hadith’s, then I‘d suggest you ask Sheikh Google!
