stop for a moment....it's the right religion

[surenderer]

I agree that preaching shouldnt be done on this forum. For one thing the atheists in this forum arent open for dialogue or understanding between different ideas or religous philosophies all the are interested in is showing how blind or dumb all believers are. It's kinda funny actually because if someone was to search these boards they would see that the only people who dont flame each other are the Christians and the Muslims. Both are treated disrespectfully by non-believers. It's kinda funny also when science is brought up when discussing our differences. 200 years ago the average person thought he knew the answers to science and the universe and was probably making fun of the people 200 years before him whom he called idiotic and barbaric for not nowing what he knew then....but he was wrong wasnt he? To the atheists on theses boards wont be saying the same about you?If you were honest with yourself you would admit that you dont know now and you will be debunked later so if ya dont have the answers why talk about someone else who thinks they do? the facts are


1a. Have atrocites been committed in God's name?
1b. Have atrocites been committed by people who dont believe in God?


now the Christians and Muslims belong to group 1a and everyone knows that the answer is yes....but what about 1b? if you guys were honest with yourself then you would also admit your answer is yes also too right? So why talk bad about believers when there is no room for yourself too brag? These boards themselves show how unbelievers have little moral character to debate without disrespecting yet they say that if everyone was like them the world would be a better place

 

[Bells]

I agree that preaching shouldnt be done on this forum. For one thing the atheists in this forum arent open for dialogue or understanding between different ideas or religous philosophies all the are interested in is showing how blind or dumb all believers are.

On the contrary surender. There are many atheists on this board who know just as much, if not more, of the doctrines and philosophies of the many and varied religions that exist. But in discussing it, does not mean that they have to agree with what is being said. There are many religious individuals on here, just as there are atheists on here who will point the finger at the other party to tell them that it is they who are blind and ignorant for believing as they do.

It's kinda funny actually because if someone was to search these boards they would see that the only people who dont flame each other are the Christians and the Muslims. Both are treated disrespectfully by non-believers.

Just as believers and disbelievers are treated with disrespect by believers and non believers. I still remember PM calling Flores, a fellow Muslim, a whore for daring to post pictures of herself in a bathing suit.

If you were honest with yourself you would admit that you dont know now and you will be debunked later so if ya dont have the answers why talk about someone else who thinks they do?

Ah. But you may be debunked as well, and you think that you know, just as I think that I know. Lets look at Yorda for example. I disagree with his statement that he wasn't born and will never die. Why do I disagree with his statement? Because he is here, which to me means he was born. And because he was born, he, like everything else living on this planet, will ultimately die. He has stated that he wasn't born because he doesn't remember being born. That statement still makes me squint in wonder, but that's just me I guess. Maybe he is right and I am wrong, or vice versa. Does not mean that I should not talk about it. You think you have the answer, just like we atheists think we have the answer. One of us may be wrong, both of us may be wrong, or we may both be correct. We simply do not know. But that doesn't mean that we should not discuss or argue about it.

1a. Have atrocites been committed in God's name?
1b. Have atrocites been committed by people who dont believe in God?

Atrocities have been committed in God's name and they have been committed by people who do not believe in God. Reading the Bible, it seems that God committed a few of his/her own as well. The fact of the matter is, no party has a moral or righteous leg to stand on, because both parties have members who commit atrocities. None is better than the other. When I look at two human beings, I don't look at them to judge their value based on what they believe in or don't believe in. I know many very religious people who hide behind their Bible while treating others around them like animals. Should I look at them and think that they will go to heaven because they are such good Christians, regardless of what crimes they may have committed?

I know of one man in my family who is an ultra right Christian. He goes out and preaches to the faithless, helps the homeless, etc. But he comes home and abuses his wife and his children, to the point where these individuals do not have a personality of their own anymore. Yet he thinks he will go to heaven because he believes. To an atheist like me, I don't think he should, if a heaven exists. Why? Because he is essentially a bad person who does good things outside of his home for face value and for recognition of how good a Christian he is, but his children cower in front of him out of fear that they will be punished for laughing too loudly or accidently breaking a glass. His wife dares not say anything less he hits her so hard again that she pees blood. He calls me a heathen and has stated to me on many occasions that I will go to hell because 1) I am an atheist and 2) I live with my boyfriend of 3 years out of wedlock. Will I go to hell? Who knows. Will I just die and my body returning to the earth while what people call my soul just ceases to exist, again who knows. Frankly I don't care. I live my life in a way that does not harm others. I am there for my family and friends whenever they need me and I respect those around me for being who they are. What I don't like is when someone tells me that to be good I need to join this or that religion or believe in this or that God.

So why talk bad about believers when there is no room for yourself too brag?

No one has any point to brag. Because no one is better than the other.

These boards themselves show how unbelievers have little moral character to debate without disrespecting yet they say that if everyone was like them the world would be a better place

There are many religious individuals on here who deem themselves of high moral character and who still disrespect their fellow believers and non-believers. And I resent your last remark. I'm an atheist, and I don't want everyone to be just like me or to believe as I do. How boring would the world be then? If you find happiness in your belief, then that is good for you. If I, an atheist, find happiness in being an atheist, then good for me. I don't say that my belief in nothing is better than your belief in God. So why should you say that your belief in God is better than my belief in that there is no god? What puts you in the position to say that we disbelievers have little moral character to debate anything? Is it because we disbelieve, therefore we have little moral character or value? I point again to that man in my family who is highly religious and highly moral, yet he treats his wife and children like animals, would you deem him to be of high morals because he is a believer? As I said to you above Surenderer, no one is in a position to judge the morals of others, because all sides have their bad sides.

 

[surenderer]

Bells,
My post was in no way meant to generalize all atheists on this board especially you because me and you have always respectfully agreeded to disagree. However I do find it interesting that when I comment on Muslims and Christians not flaming each other on these boards you have to go back to something that PM said. PM hasnt posted (to the best of my knowledge) in close to if not over a year now. Why him? I tell you why because forget about anything a "moderate" muslim says (like me or cutie or whoever) lets go drag a "radical" up to represent all muslims. Its the same thing people on these boards do when talking about how violent Islam is.....they bring up OBL. How would you feel if everytime I wanted to represent Atheists for a topic I quoted or used Vincent2k as your representative? would that be fair? Take a look at past posts Bells.....Look at how disrespectful most atheists talk to religious people. How can there ever be constructive dialogue when people create topics such as "Why Islam is bad" or "The final proof against Christianity" etc.....any muslim or Christian would automatically go on the defensive when responding to such a post or they would just ignore it and thus no positive would come from that topic....anyways I wish we could debate this more but I am leaving town and probably wont be back for a few days but I await your response....peace :m:

 

[Bells]

My post was in no way meant to generalize all atheists on this board especially you because me and you have always respectfully agreeded to disagree. However I do find it interesting that when I comment on Muslims and Christians not flaming each other on these boards you have to go back to something that PM said. PM hasnt posted (to the best of my knowledge) in close to if not over a year now. Why him? I tell you why because forget about anything a "moderate" muslim says (like me or cutie or whoever) lets go drag a "radical" up to represent all muslims.

And my post was not to generalise that PM represents all the Muslims in here. I could have used Leo Volont as an example, just as I used PM. There are Muslims who believe like PM, those who don't, just as there are Christians who believe like Leo, and those who don't. Yes we do agree to disagree on many things surenderer, but in the past I have also agreed with you on many things also.

Its the same thing people on these boards do when talking about how violent Islam is.....they bring up OBL. How would you feel if everytime I wanted to represent Atheists for a topic I quoted or used Vincent2k as your representative?

I've never once stated that Islam is the violent religion. The way I see it, it is as violent as all other religions. Hence why I say no one should be in a position to brag that one is better than the other, because all are as bad as the other. All have their good points, just as all have their bad points. All have good people as members or worshipers, just as all have members who should not be part of the human race. As for vincent... I always pegged him as a neo-con. Shows how much attention I ever payed to all he said.

Look at how disrespectful most atheists talk to religious people. How can there ever be constructive dialogue when people create topics such as "Why Islam is bad" or "The final proof against Christianity" etc.....any muslim or Christian would automatically go on the defensive when responding to such a post or they would just ignore it and thus no positive would come from that topic....anyways I wish we could debate this more but I am leaving town and probably wont be back for a few days but I await your response....peace

It's not always the atheists who create those posts though. The war between Islam, Christianity and Judaism will I think destroy us all. Why? Because all think they have a higher claim to the same God and therefore a higher claim to being right and good. It's not just Atheists who disrespect the believers. Believers also disrespect the atheists and fellow believers of different or the same religion. Just as you as a believer go on the defensive at such threads, so do Atheists who are also attacked in similar ways. For example, I go on the defensive when I get phone calls at all hours of the night where people scream 'whore' down the phone at me, because that freak my cousin married told his religious congregation that I'm living with a man out of wedlock and must be saved. I went on the defensive by calling the police and having a trace put on the line and ultimately changing my number. Just as you go on the defensive when someone starts a post about the evils of Islam, atheists go on the defensive when someone starts a post about how atheists are wrong and evil. Do I think Islam as a religion is evil? No I do not and I have voiced that thought in many threads on this issue in this forum. The religion is not evil and the majority of its members are not evil. A few members are evil, but that does not represent the whole. The same applies to every religion. Catholicism for example. Its history is also plagued by wars, just like Islam's, but that does not mean it is evil. The priests who abuse children are evil, but not all priests are the same. Some of them do a lot of good in the communities they live in. It's not the religion that is to blame as such, but the few members in each religion who think theirs is superior to others, hence why I stated above that Christianity, Islam and Judaism may be the end of us all, because when you get insane individuals as members who have the power to destroy lives and they do so, then we have a problem. The religion is not to blame, but the few members who taint humanity by shedding the blood of others are the ones to blame, not the whole.

PS... Have a nice and safe trip.

 

[path]

Prince Charles tries to get followers of the right religion to renounce death for apostacy, how right can a faith that requires death for apostates be?

Here

 

[spidergoat]

And if you are in doubt about what We have revealed (the Quran) to Our worshiper (Muhammad ), then produce a chapter like it, and call your witnesses (supporters and helpers) besides God if you are truthful. And if you do not do it, and you can never do it, then fear the Fire (Hell) whose fuel is men and stones. It has been prepared for disbelievers. And give good news (O Muhammad) to those who believe and do good deeds, that for them are gardens (Paradise) in which rivers flow.... (Quran, 2:23-25)
Ever since the Quran was revealed, fourteen centuries ago, no one has been able to produce a single chapter like the chapters of the Quran in their beauty, eloquence, splendor, wise legislation, true information, true prophecy, and other perfect attributes. Also, note that the smallest chapter in the Quran (Chapter 108) is only ten words, yet no one has ever been able to meet this challenge, then or today

This text:
http://academic.brooklyn.cuny.edu/core9/phalsall/texts/taote-v3.html
is superior in beauty, eloquence, true information, and perfect attributes.

 

[Q25]

dozens in iraq r dying everyday .

and many many more died under Sadams regime,would you rather see that psycho still rule?
only reason the fighting continues is b/c the remaining Saddams sympatizers dont want to accept democratic system proposed by the US,
the religious fanatics want to keep all Iraqis under their control

.................millions don't have houses in palastine .

I agree its WRONG,and its Palestinians lands.
Israel should get the fuck out of there.
unfortunately it aint gonna happen as Jews have huge influence over US goverment.

 

[Q25]

i ask from everyone to try and put away his thoughts about islam and let ur mind work clearly without the interfering of what is happening in the world nowadays ......i confess that many peole is using islam in its wrong meaning ....

thats the problem with every religion,xianity or Islam its "holy"books can be interpreted to mean whatever you like
even killing those who dont believe same as you do,could be considered right then,
merciful religion?...dont make me laugh

.......if u try and read the holy quran u'll find that from the very small part of ur body to the the great stars in this universe is mentioned in this holy book....

ok,do tell,
what does quran says about the age of the Earth?
or how long did humans existed?
or what causes gravity?
or how much of our DNA is identical to other animals,apes for example,

btw you didnt answer my question:
who created the Creator?

..i've my proof .......it's the book itself......

and the bible is supposed to be PROOF that Jebus is the Savior,
either book means didly !!!!
they are just fantasy fairy tales invented by primitive people who tried to explain the unknown,before science told us the truth about the world/universe etc

...u'll find an answer to every little question in ur mind and more ,

ok,what does it say about computers?

tell me honestly cos maybe i'm wrong ..

yes you are!

www.examinethetruth.com/