Sex is Dirty

[Dr Lou Natic]

Sex is dirty compared to dirt. When people say "sex is a beautifull act" that just makes them more gross, like when people take a stinky shit and then say "what? it's a natural bodily function" yeah, great, now I'm throwing up. I was just opening windows before. Thanks alot.

 

[Leo Volont]

Oh, but we are. Homo sapiens sapiens (sneers @ sapiens). We are primates.
Any person who has studied basic biology (or lived in a farm) knows that.

It sounds like in all justice you should be stripped bare and relegated to some Zoo's Monkey Island.

The primary basis of every Higher Religion is that Human Beings have an Immortal and Spiritual Reality that penetrates and transcends our biological limitations.

Spiritualists prefer to think such a Spiritual Hypothesis is indeed true, but even the Moral Pragmatist would acknowledge that no Higher Civilization is possible unless people can be persuaded to behave better than animals.

But I am not simply a Moral Pragmatist. It is the documented Miracles of the Saints that convince me that Spirituality is indeed a relevant Dimension for us.

 

[Leo Volont]

Sex is dirty compared to dirt. When people say "sex is a beautifull act" that just makes them more gross, like when people take a stinky shit and then say "what? it's a natural bodily function" yeah, great, now I'm throwing up. I was just opening windows before. Thanks alot.

Well, good... you understand what I'm talking about.

I suppose it takes some spiritual intuition to realize that not everything smells like roses.

 

[cole grey]

Humanity cannot both look upward and down at the same time... that focus must either be on sexuality or Spirituality.

Most of humanity doesn't have time to even pretend their focus is only on spirituality. Sometimes they have to focus on paying their bills, or whatev.
You are not trying to describe the best way all people can live, just your idea for the best way to focus in on God.
Why don't you just say that it helps one to focus on spirituality when one isn't focused on something else, and sex can be especially distracting because it tends to demand a lot of one's conscious and physical attention.
A poster might respond that sometimes backing off, not trying to "think" too hard about something, often results in the greatest revelations, or whatever. You could say that this often happens only after someone has spent much time focused on the subject.
Then a reasonable discussion could ensue...
And I could skip the blind smiley

 

[cole grey]

A person might also respond that sex, like artistic inspiration, can be something that creates an experience of a deeper sense of feeling than the physical, causing their belief in nonvisible God to increase and a feeling of gratitude to develop.
You could respond that what they experience is just a psuedo-religious feeling and go from there...
Raising contradictions most people think do not apply however, just causes pages to fill with responses to those parts of the discussion, "focusing" us away from the truly thoughtful material.

 

[Leo Volont]

Is sex dirty? Only if it's done right. (Woody Allen)

I suppose Mr. Allen would indeed suppose the dirtier the better.

Is he not the Jewish Celebrity that brought a little 11 year old girl around the world so that he could adopt her and then commense sexually abusing her. What was the adoption routine all about but in order to establish a strong incest fantacy.

But does the Legal System attack him. Is he left bankrupt? Well, no. He is not the Catholic Church. Jewish Celebrities can take all such corruption in their stride... it is quite expected from them and if anybody would dare to complain it would come off as antisemitic. We live in a moral atmosphere in which only the Catholic Church is considered capable of Sin.

Indeed, I suppose people can't wait to catch Catholic's falling short of the high expectations everyone seems to expect from them, simply so they can finally blow off some of the pent up frustrations that go along with trying to appear non-judgmental in such a morally sick world. Take the Aids Thing as a for instance. It is a disease that can only be sexually transmitted through anal intercourse, and so we know that only the most filthy perverts of either sex can contract it... who else would lay on their bellies and take it up the old fudgedoor. So we have Africa and all the urban centers complaining of catastrophic rates of HIV infection, which we must all find shocking and disgusting, except that we are not allowed to think so because it would appear racist. So even when caught in the most outrageous behavior we have no choice but to have concerts and programs to raise money so that they may continue to bugger each other to death. and we wait for the Catholics to get caught doing something so that we can finally allow ourselves to be scandalized.

I can't wait until it becomes politically correct to insist that Catholics also be allowed any degradation, any moral abuse, any filth. Why should Blacks and Jews get to have all the fun.

 

[Leo Volont]

Most of humanity doesn't have time to even pretend their focus is only on spirituality. Sometimes they have to focus on paying their bills, or whatev.

Yeah... Christ had this one Parable in which He spoke of the Farmer sowing seed. The seed goes all over the place, and many of the seeds will come to nothing. But some hit paydirt. The World has over 7 Billion People and most have as much as they can handle just staying fed. Then, of those who are fed, the majority go off buggering each other in order to contract Aids, or waste their lives in a haze of cigerette smoke getting drunk. It is the rare combination of people who have the means and opportunity and then the inclination to pursue spirituality.

Also, we should keep in mind that God probably does not need 7 Billion Angels. If God can harvest just a few good Spiritual Souls out of this whole slew of Humanity, then that would probably make Him happy enough, and then He could be free to simply through the rest of everybody out with the trash.

 

[Leo Volont]

A person might also respond that sex, like artistic inspiration, can be something that creates an experience of a deeper sense of feeling than the physical, causing their belief in nonvisible God to increase and a feeling of gratitude to develop.

Yuck!

You're beginning to sound like that old middleaged krone that keeps writing in about the glories of finally getting laid. I can't wait until she finally gets the change of life and comes out of her sexfogged stupor of irrationality.

But much is attributed to Sex that is really not much more than the result of two people being close and intimate... where the closeness and the intimacy could have been in any activity... it did not have to be the sex act.

For instance, once when I was a semi-famous performing musician, I was tossed in with another semi-famous performing musician -- a Lady. We were to write a song for a Festival and sing a duet. So we thrashed out a song and performed it beautifully. In my youth I was no prude, but I have to say that this one creative partnership was better than any sex I had ever had. I knew every aspect of her voice and every subtlty of her guitar (she had insisted on having me partner with her in this project because she said she felt I was the only percussionist that ever 'really' listened to what the strings were doing) and when I would echo the slightest flourish in a chord I could catch the slightest smile of appreciation... even during the big performance when I would catch her ad libing a new rif and I'd follow her flawlessly through it.. as though our two minds were one. Yeap, better than sex.

 

[cole grey]

LEO says,
"If God can harvest just a few good Spiritual Souls out of this whole slew of Humanity, then that would probably make Him happy enough, and then He could be free to simply through the rest of everybody out with the trash. "

This phrase seems to demonstrate that YOU believe in a God who is benevolent towards only a tiny fraction of humanity. Not much of the "evil" that happens in the world should bother you then. This place is all just for the benefit of the .001 percent or so of humanity who see the light.


About my posts- I was just suggesting two ideas you might have the opportunity to mightily crush with your astoundingly pliable logical arguments, if you were to clear aside some of the hyperbole.

 

[Leo Volont]

LEO says,
"If God can harvest just a few good Spiritual Souls out of this whole slew of Humanity, then that would probably make Him happy enough, and then He could be free to simply through the rest of everybody out with the trash. "

This phrase seems to demonstrate that YOU believe in a God who is benevolent towards only a tiny fraction of humanity. Not much of the "evil" that happens in the world should bother you then. This place is all just for the benefit of the .001 percent or so of humanity who see the light.


About my posts- I was just suggesting two ideas you might have the opportunity to mightily crush with your astoundingly pliable logical arguments, if you were to clear aside some of the hyperbole.

I'm not even saying that God is 'benevolent' to .001 percent. God was not 'benevolent' to Job. God created us. His job is over. If we want to scale the Spiritual Mountain and attain to Heaven and Mystical Unity, then maybe we are lucky if God does not actively stop us.

I have heard of those who have received the Grace of God, through the Mother Goddess or various Saints, but such as that cannot ever be relied upon. I have not heard of any Sure Tricks for securing the Grace of God (which doesn't keep me from wearing a Miraculous Medal, a Brown Scapular, a Rosary, several Crucifixes, and a St. Benedict Medal). It is simply the Duty of a Good Catholic to do the best he can do. It is NOT our Universe, it is God's. God should be the Acknowledged Center of things. When a Catholic is given the choice of deciding between God's comfort and one's own, there really is no choice is there? God is the only One who matters, no?

But Evil in the World does bother me. It is the Duty of every Good Catholic to do his best to achieve what Christ had failed at, that is, bringing the Kingdom of Heaven upon Earth. This is not done by condoning or assenting to Evil. Here a good example would be to point at what is a good Catholic Family although it could have been better -- The Kennedies. Even when they were running rum through Boston during Prohibition, they realized that their Catholic Duty was to make the World a better and a more moral and charitable place for everybody. But now the Antichrist Republican's have turned Liberalism into the New Sin, and those who believe in sharing and charity are supposed to feel ashamed that they do not have enough of that Individual Spirit that has made America Great. God help us all.

But, again, here my attention is on the Collective. We think of God, or we think of the Community as a whole. Or we see individuals as microcosms of that God or that Great Collective. But to consider individuals as individuals. What for?

In one of my Visions I was told by the Great Angel of God to remember that Christ was the Life of All Things. Life. Life as One Universal Organism. How does one individual relate in all of that. One small spark in One HUGE Universal Conflagration.

But, although individuals don't matter, it doesn't keep me from spending 20 minutes calling for a new feral kitten to come to the feeding station. You see, although individuals are not important, the Collective Interaction between Each and All... that IS important. Individuals come and go, but the Life of All Things -- that is Christ.

 

[one_raven]

I knew every aspect of her voice and every subtlty of her guitar (she had insisted on having me partner with her in this project because she said she felt I was the only percussionist that ever 'really' listened to what the strings were doing) and when I would echo the slightest flourish in a chord I could catch the slightest smile of appreciation... even during the big performance when I would catch her ad libing a new rif and I'd follow her flawlessly through it.. as though our two minds were one. Yeap, better than sex.

Good sex can be very much like that.

 

[one_raven]

Is he not the Jewish Celebrity that brought a little 11 year old girl around the world so that he could adopt her and then commense sexually abusing her. What was the adoption routine all about but in order to establish a strong incest fantacy.

No he isn't, in fact.
Please do a little research and look at the details, rather than just the sensational headlines that feed your anti-semetic beliefs before you libel a person.
He was not her adopted father.
They didn't even live in the same house.

 

[one_raven]

So, because people do not want their pre-pubescent children raped, and people do not like to have non-consentual sex, then sex itself is a dirty and bad thing?
Am I misunderstanding you?

 

[Leo Volont]

Good sex can be very much like that.

The audience would like it too. They picked up on the Chemistry of the Duet like a bunch of voyeurs. I could see out into the crowd and there were ladies with their mouths wide open with whatever romantic astonishment was going through their minds... they knew they were witnessing more than a song performance, but a virtual fusion of Spirit.

I've worked with other musicians, and sometimes it is not altogether bad. I like it when sometimes another musician will catch me anticipating and following perfectly what they though was a spontaneous phrase or flourish -- a surprised expression like "how were you able to read my mind"... but that would be a moment here and a moment there. With that one Lady, it was a complete performance... well... she had been in town for a couple of years and we often performed together, and it would happen everytime. Years later fans would ask me to do certain songs, and I would have to explain that without that certain lady, it would not be close to being the same. I could sing and I could play, but without her guitar and voice to wind about in and slither through, it just would not have the same magic. I would tell people to simply treasure their memories of what they were lucky to have caught back then. Lightening doesn't strike twice.

Ofcourse the other guitar players and singers that I would perform with would hear me talking such and perhaps feel insulted. But, honestly, they were still reading their chords out of books, like school children... they weren't yet REAL musicians. With that one Lady, the Performances were alive. Neither of us knew exactly how the songs would go. Her mind was ever open to the next Creative Insight -- the Flourish from out of Nowhere. The reason she liked me is that I was the only one of hundreds listening who would know when such moments would happen -- I would raise my eyebrows and she would keep singing through a broad smile.

It also goes to my theory of percussion. Many percussionists think that they should 'lead the rhythm', 'set the beat' and all of that. But I would always go to the Lead String and say "I'll follow you". And I would. That is really what made me semi-famous. The Percussionists who insisted upon overpowering and leading were left sitting at home, but I would be called in because the Strings knew I would let them be heard doing what they wanted to do without stealing the pace and imposing my own rhythm, and that I was there only to give them an added depth and texture -- an echo, or rather a kind of Sound Shadow. and my Divine Tenor voice didn't hurt anything (age has turned me into a baritone with no bottom end... the ravages of the years).

 

[cole grey]

When a Catholic is given the choice of deciding between God's comfort and one's own, there really is no choice is there? God is the only One who matters, no? ...

- This has a high likelihood in my mind of being a hypocritical statement which you do not fully apply to yourself.

- Please submit a list of comforts you have given up so as to comfort God.

- Are there any more you need to give up?

- If so, hold on tight to your talisman's of grace

 

[Leo Volont]

No he isn't, in fact.
Please do a little research and look at the details, rather than just the sensational headlines that feed your anti-semetic beliefs before you libel a person.
He was not her adopted father.
They didn't even live in the same house.

Oh great!

Where are all the people willing to defend the Pedophile Priests the way you defend that Pedophile. It only proves my point, you know, that you seem to expect that behavior from everybody but Catholics and are willing to forgive it in anybody but a Catholic.

Why don't you give him some civic award for boiking some little school girl for whom he should have been only a father figure.

 

[one_raven]

Oh great!

Where are all the people willing to defend the Pedophile Priests the way you defend that Pedophile. It only proves my point, you know, that you seem to expect that behavior from everybody but Catholics and are willing to forgive it in anybody but a Catholic.

Why don't you give him some civic award for boiking some little school girl for whom he should have been only a father figure.

He's not a Pedophile, and she was hardly a school-girl, nor was she his daughter, adopted or otherwise.
Again, perhaps you should educate yourself rather than jumping to unfounded assumptions that will conveniently support your anti-semetic positions.

 

[cole grey]

I've worked with other musicians, and sometimes it is not altogether bad. I like it when sometimes another musician will catch me anticipating and following perfectly what they though was a spontaneous phrase or flourish -- a surprised expression like "how were you able to read my mind"...

All good improvisors are able to accomplish this "feat".

I submit that you have a sense of false pride because you didn't get the chance to play with a lot of good musicians. When I play with someone and this happens, i.e. most of the time, we do enjoy it, but we don't think we're John Coltrane or some BS like that.

I also submit that you have a sense of false pride that stems from living in a world with a lot of uninformed, depraved individuals, and that feeding a kitten doesn't make you Mother Theresa.

Don't let your pride act as a millstone around your neck.

 

[Leo Volont]

- This has a high likelihood in my mind of being a hypocritical statement which you do not fully apply to yourself.

- Please submit a list of comforts you have given up so as to comfort God.

- Are there any more you need to give up?

- If so, hold on tight to your talisman's of grace

Oh Jeez!

What Saint was ever not a Hypocrite?

When Perfection is the Standard by which one measures oneself, it becomes ridiculous to keep score on one's shortcomings.

As I said previously, it is a Catholics Duty to do his best.

But, upon reflection, I have thought of a few things I do for God, or rather for the good of the Collective. When addressing young ladies, I adopt a fatherly tone. With women closer to my own age, I speak with something of the Hairdressers Accent in order to emphasize that I have no sexual interest. When I see attractive young ladies on the street or in the Shops, I avert my eyes.

Now, I would like as much as the next person to flirt up a storm. I used to be good at that. But, in appreciation for the Life in All Things, I have chosen not to impose myself on others unnecessarily, to be reassuring in my discretion, and to extend to others the Peace that comes by appreciating their needs for Privacy.

I also have refrained from expressing any displeasure whenever any of my cats inadvertantly destroy something. I consider myself their host and they are my guests and so I am uniformally polite to them. It is in the role of Host that we do indeed practice this virtue of surrendering our own comfort to God or Other. It is why God singled out Abraham. The man was a good host.

There are other things, but eventually this will amount to my singing my own praises. It would only bore you.

 

[Leo Volont]

He's not a Pedophile, and she was hardly a school-girl, nor was she his daughter, adopted or otherwise.
Again, perhaps you should educate yourself rather than jumping to unfounded assumptions that will conveniently support your anti-semetic positions.

Have you bothered applying any of those same defenses to the Pedophile Priests. In most instances these young men were only technically children. They were having discreet homo parties. years later, when all of the lawsuits broke out, the young homos, deciding to cash in, signed up to be prostitutes to be paid for services once rendered. Certainly, not what priests should be doing, but also not conforming to the picture we have of Pedophilia which is of adults forcing themselves on innocent prepubescent gradeschoolers.

But why is it that you feel so compelled to defend somebody who snatches the daughter of a wife and copulates with her? You think it laudible to betray not only one trust, but two, and then only for the sake of pleasing an erection?

Is that what you are doing? Is that what you would do? If not, then stop defending it. But if it is what you do, or hope to do, then you should be horsewhipped for it too.