Satan: Virtuous

[Enmos]

Pah, :bravo:
And of course we're good as well.

Sure, but currently not so much as evil

I'm off to bed. Good night

 

[Oli]

Good night.

 

[Norsefire]

Firstly, I think you'll find it's the Garden of Eden. Secondly, God did no such thing. He said they could have as much from it as they liked once the fruit had become ripe. In the time being, they could eat and do anything else that took their fancy.

Still a restriction of freedom

Realise their freedom? That's what he professed to be doing, but you should realise that the Devil/Snake has always embodied dishonesty and duplicity. In this story, Satan is representative of that destructive 'little voice' inside all of our heads that defies logic and reason with wilful desire. That might sound attractive and racy to you, but in reality the Devil was purely Eve's need defy authority.

Satan represents indulgence, and indulging and satisfying your desires. Satan can be manipulative but if they are weak enough to be manipulated then so be it. Satan represents the ego; he is a "role model" of sorts for ultimate pleasure and self empowerment.

I once read that the best way to describe the Devil is ejaculation. A strange analogy, granted, but hear me out. When we are about to have sex, or when we are involved in the act itself, we are completely blinded by our lust. What we are doing maybe be completely wrong, we may be hurting ourselves, them or someone else, but we don't care. That is the Devil within us. Especially after the male release, often we feel a wave of momentary depression when all the lies we have told ourselves in the lead up to that moment are stripped away to reveal the reality. Too late, our primal desires (the Devil) have already got what they wanted from us.

But we should indulge our desires. The devil within us is indulgence and satisfaction, exactly! The self first.

Satan represents self-dishonesty and ultimately stupidity.

I disagree. And then, what does God represent? Bureaucracy and pointlessness

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

Ah, so basically, the whole Biblical history was kind of a pack social pissing contest...what with 'ye shall have no other gods' etc...

My god's bigger than your god, my god's bigger than yours!
My god's better than your god, my god's better than yours!
My god's meaner than your god, my god's meaner than yours!

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

Satan is the very epitome of the little man. He has never achieved or created anything except destruction. He represents all the ugliness and evils of an over-inflated ego. As a result he remains a symbol of loneliness, paranoia and bitterness, along with how these can all twist our purpose.

God is the very epitome of the little man. He has never achieved or created anything except destruction. He represents all the ugliness and evils of an over-inflated ego. As a result he remains a symbol of loneliness, paranoia and bitterness, along with how these can all twist our purpose.

We all have these Satanic traits within us, and these will always hold us back from perfection. We are condemned to a life of self-inflicted hardships.

He represents the fact that there is good and evil in each of us, and how we can be easily corrupted by our 'evil' side.

You have a mouse in your pocket?

The Opposite of God would be some equally powerful Deity of anarchy and destruction. However, we are constantly reminded in the Bible that, even at his peak, the Devil was never more than an angel. Now, he only has the power to destroy and mar what has been created by God.

The God of the KJV is the deity of anarchy & destruction.

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

Teratogeny?

I KNEW if I hung around in here long enough, I'd find a word I need to look up!

 

[Oli]

I KNEW if I hung around in here long enough, I'd find a word I need to look up!

Then it was concinnitous that you hung around.
Glad to be of service.

 

[Adstar]

Well,

Paul does say that salvation does not depend on the man who wills (freewill) or the man who runs (works) but on God who has mercy. And there are many denominations that teach this very thing. I did not invent either the text or this viewpoint. Millions of people believe this is true.

There is no safety in numbers where God is concerned. As you seem to know scriptures you will know that the way is narrow and few find it. I see you have added to scripture by adding (freewill) to will. Of course millions and millions want to have eternity with God just as i do but my will and their will does not determine our salvation, God does. And i know that many millions who have the will to be with God for eternity bend down on their knees and pray structured prayers regularly many times a day they work and work with fasting and works of religion and works of good deeds trying their best to work their way into eternity with God, But again it is not their works that determine their eternal destination because their works are as "filthy rags" compared to the righteousness of God.

Even my own church teaches this. They all think that they are "the chosen", "the elect", people of God who are being led by the Holy Spirit just like you do but they would disagree with you on this.

Yes and i guess they are the same kind of church that teaches the doctrine of justifiable war too. Just like most of the churches with millions and millions of members teach. How can they have any hope of being lead by the Holy Spirit into understanding the deeper things of the faith when they cannot accept the simple teachings of Jesus???? Any simple person who reads the beatitudes can see what Jesus has plainly said and they could no doubt see how the teaching of justifiable war is in rebellion against Jesus. Yes they have rejected that part of the Love of the truth, so they are given over to deception.

Why are you correct?

Because the Holy Spirit revealed the truth of the matter when i genuinely called out to God to give me understanding on the issue.

Are you more righteous than they are?

Nope, i am a contemptible Christian a pitiful and poor excuse of a Christian, but one thing i know it is better to follow the Word of God then the word of theologians who clearly twist the Word of God to make it conform to the needs of the kingdoms of the world and its evil elites.

Are you smarter or wiser than them?

Yeah. Not because i was born that way, or because i studied hard and "worked" my way to becoming wise. But because the Holy Spirit lifted me up and gave this moron some knowledge and understanding.

Are you more spiritual?

I have always hated that term. It is pulled out by those who want to be seen as being something in the eyes of others and it is given as a unwise term of praise by those who want to life others up to the status of God so they can follow their teachings rather than God's teachings.

Why are you correct and why are they wrong?
Is it just because they disagree with you? Is that all it takes?

Yes. I believe i am right. So if they disagree with me then they are wrong. i don't care if a million or a billion people disagree with me. i could not give a brass razoo if i am the only person in the world left who believes Jesus. God is the measure of what is correct and what is wrong. The popularity polls on doctrines mean nothing.

It is all way too confusing for me, and the more I try to figure it all out, and I have tried for many years, the more confusing it becomes.

I am glad i did not try and try for years to figure it out. I am glad that The Holy Spirit gave me the answers i needed, when i needed them.

So I have finally just given up trying to figure it all out and try to just live my life as much as is possible with respect and love for everyone I come in contact with.

Well you may or may not get better at loving others, my guess is that you will only be in an improved state as long as you can consciously carry the burden of being nice, sooner or later to will crack and you will spew forth the vial hatred that you try to dam up within you.

I am, of course, imperfect in this endeavour but it usually works out pretty well. I am a much better person than I used to be, when I thought I had all the answers. And I am a whole lot less judgmental of others around me. I realize now how arrogant I was.

I get it. See i am still in that supposed state, you know religious and judgemental and arrogant excreta. A well veiled hatred spew there.... Not.

Thanks!

Thanks be to God for your resistance. You have played your part in making me stronger. All things work for the good of those who love the Lord, indeed


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[codanblad]

What does satan really represent? It's all metaphorical, of course. And what does satan represent?

Satan represents the rebellion against senseless authority. And Satan represents indulgence. And Satan represents absolute, unbounded freedom. Satan represents making yourself a god, the only god, of yourself.

This is satan. And satan is...bad?

but god doesn't make bad things! cool concept, i hadn't thought about satan's positive qualities.

 

[Adstar]

There is no concept of fallen angels in Islam. Iblis (I think you made a typo) is a Jinn, which roughly equivalent to the Christian concept of demon, though not all jinn are technically evil, some are believers in God as well.


By the way, You and Adstar should watch the link I posted in my previous post. I want to hear your thoughts, it is pretty interesting.

Ok DiamondHearts i usually don't watch anything posted in from Utube because my internet connection is fairly slow so watching 8 parts of a video takes a long time. But since you have expressed a want for my thoughts on it i took the time to watch the whole video.

One thing before i continue the last part ended with more to be added. It is as if it has just been cut off. So i did not get to see the end of the show. i can only comment on what i saw.

1) From just looking at the man being interviewed, looking at his body language i was uneasy. He covered his face and mouth too often with his hands, this is a sign of someone who is either lying or holding some information back. Also he gave another sign that the bible reveals as a warning sign and that is pointing of the fingers.

Proverbs 6
12 A worthless person, a wicked man,
Walks with a perverse mouth;
13 He winks with his eyes,
He shuffles his feet,
He points with his fingers;
14 Perversity is in his heart,
He devises evil continually,
He sows discord.

When ever i see a person talk and gesticulates with a pointed finger i take that as a warning sign to take what ever they say with caution.

Ok next.

Séances:
As a Christian i believe that demons do impersonate dead people in séances, When one takes part in such activities one is going against the expressed will of God. In the bible God tells his people to have nothing to do with mediums and to never seek to talk to the dead. Once a person goes against the will of God then they open themselves up to be deceived and used.


Hypnotism and regression:
Two different things here, As a Christian i do not believe in reincarnation so i believe that regression to former lives is deception from an evil demonic source. i have never and will never allow myself to be hypnotised. While i know of no scriptural reference to it, i believe the Holy Spirit has guided me to avoid it.


satanic luciferin secret societies:
Yes i believe these exist and have controlling influence of the elites of the world, I believe the kingdoms of this world are tools of satan and it does not matter if you are talking about the USA or Iran or Israel or France or Saudi Arabia or any nation on earth. They also work to bring religious deception into the world, they are workers in the satanic plan for deceiving the world. This plan is far more deceptive then what the speaker in this video was pointing too.


The Immortal Soul.
Now this is where i will disagree totally with the Speaker and the 7th day adventist. As a Christian i believe that we have eternity either with God or in the Lake of Fire. For us to have eternity then we must exist forever so therefore we must be eternal. To say that we are not eternal (as this man was preaching) is a denial of the promise of God that Christians and might i say muslims believe.


Necromancy:
I agree with the Speaker in the video that contacting the dead is a form of necromancy and it does not matter if you do it by a séance or by praying to a supposed "saint" or Mary or any other Human being that has lived and died. Praying to saints and Mary is blasphemy introduced by the false catholic religion, who are i believe a agent of the deceivers just as i believe muhammad was also an agent of the deceivers. There are many deceivers working in history and in this world now spewing forth a flood of deceptions all designed to divert people away from the true Way to God.


Sunday Sabbath/ worship:
I agree with the speaker and the 7th day adventist that Sunday is not the true Sabbath. This is another false teaching introduced by the catholic church and is false Christianity. But even the 7th day Church does not observe the true Sabbath. They observe Saturday as the Sabbath. But the true Biblical Sabbath starts on Friday at sunset and goes till sunset on Saturday. So the 7th day adventists also do not acknowledge the true Sabbath. Also the Speaker made the point that the adventists where special and could not be deceived because they do not keep the Sunday Sabbath, the speaker failed to reveal the truth that Jews and muslims and hindus and buddhists and many other millions of people do not observe the Sunday Sabbath either. So observance of the correct Sabbath is not the key to being guarded from deception. What does guard from deception is believing Jesus. Teaching that if you observe the correct Sabbath then you will be guarded from deception gives people a false foundation to place their eternal security on.

Ok I hope i have covered all bases DiamondHearts.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[DiamondHearts]

Ok DiamondHearts i usually don't watch anything posted in from Utube because my internet connection is fairly slow so watching 8 parts of a video takes a long time. But since you have expressed a want for my thoughts on it i took the time to watch the whole video.

One thing before i continue the last part ended with more to be added. It is as if it has just been cut off. So i did not get to see the end of the show. i can only comment on what i saw.

I'm glad you took a look at it. You have to admit that this show, although obviously false in some parts (seventh adventist propaganda esp in end), gave a fairly accurate picture of what happens in satanist gatherings. One quote in particular struck me, 'The greatest thing that satan achieved was to make people disbelieve in him.' This quote is 100% true. Though I have my doubts that he is completely rid of his association with such people.

1) From just looking at the man being interviewed, looking at his body language i was uneasy. He covered his face and mouth too often with his hands, this is a sign of someone who is either lying or holding some information back. Also he gave another sign that the bible reveals as a warning sign and that is pointing of the fingers.

Proverbs 6
12 A worthless person, a wicked man,
Walks with a perverse mouth;
13 He winks with his eyes,
He shuffles his feet,
He points with his fingers;
14 Perversity is in his heart,
He devises evil continually,
He sows discord.

When ever i see a person talk and gesticulates with a pointed finger i take that as a warning sign to take what ever they say with caution.

Yeah, I noticed his nervousness too. Though I believe it is related to being afraid of what may happen to him by revealing this information. He was, however, willingly or unwillingly used by the Seventh day adventists, that is clear from the last part.

It's surprising the Bible comments on this pointing with fingers as being the trait of a wicked person. In Muslim cultures it is often seen as rude to point with a single finger, rather one should indicate with his whole hand and with respect, especially to people. Unfortunately, this is rather common in the West.

Ok next.

Séances:
As a Christian i believe that demons do impersonate dead people in séances, When one takes part in such activities one is going against the expressed will of God. In the bible God tells his people to have nothing to do with mediums and to never seek to talk to the dead. Once a person goes against the will of God then they open themselves up to be deceived and used.

Yes, this was quite revealing. Ghosts do not exist, they are demons (jinn) imitating the dead. This atleast reveals that he has had a personal experience with this.

Hypnotism and regression:
Two different things here, As a Christian i do not believe in reincarnation so i believe that regression to former lives is deception from an evil demonic source. i have never and will never allow myself to be hypnotised. While i know of no scriptural reference to it, i believe the Holy Spirit has guided me to avoid it.

Hypnotism is something from the occultic, pagan, satanic traditions. That is why he clearly indicates that hypnotism is a secret weapon of satan. There are no former lives, this is a trick. Furthermore, hypnotism has been a long practice among the satanic societies, and those whom associate with demons (jinn).

satanic luciferin secret societies:
Yes i believe these exist and have controlling influence of the elites of the world, I believe the kingdoms of this world are tools of satan and it does not matter if you are talking about the USA or Iran or Israel or France or Saudi Arabia or any nation on earth. They also work to bring religious deception into the world, they are workers in the satanic plan for deceiving the world. This plan is far more deceptive then what the speaker in this video was pointing too.

Agreed.

The Immortal Soul.
Now this is where i will disagree totally with the Speaker and the 7th day adventist. As a Christian i believe that we have eternity either with God or in the Lake of Fire. For us to have eternity then we must exist forever so therefore we must be eternal. To say that we are not eternal (as this man was preaching) is a denial of the promise of God that Christians and might i say muslims believe.

Yeah. This is merely propaganda from the church which released this video. Most believers in the scriptures and followers of Abraham know for a fact, the spirit is a part of man, and came before the creation of the body of flesh, made of earth.

Necromancy:
I agree with the Speaker in the video that contacting the dead is a form of necromancy and it does not matter if you do it by a séance or by praying to a supposed "saint" or Mary or any other Human being that has lived and died. Praying to saints and Mary is blasphemy introduced by the false catholic religion, who are i believe a agent of the deceivers

Yeah. Agreed. Worshiping human beings and idols are great transgressions against God. We should worship the One Creator, who existed before any creation.

just as i believe muhammad was also an agent of the deceivers. There are many deceivers working in history and in this world now spewing forth a flood of deceptions all designed to divert people away from the true Way to God.

Your personal choice, but that the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) taught us the best way to combat the evil of this world, from the satan and his deceivers, by worshiping and devoting ourselves to worship to God of Abraham, it cannot be so easily critiqued by simply calling him a deceiver. Indeed he is the last in a long line of Prophets, and among the greatest of them. Though I doubt you would agree with me, I welcome you to read the Quran for yourself, and judge it on its merit from it s own words. http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/SURAI.HTM

Sunday Sabbath/ worship:
I agree with the speaker and the 7th day adventist that Sunday is not the true Sabbath. This is another false teaching introduced by the catholic church and is false Christianity. But even the 7th day Church does not observe the true Sabbath. They observe Saturday as the Sabbath. But the true Biblical Sabbath starts on Friday at sunset and goes till sunset on Saturday. So the 7th day adventists also do not acknowledge the true Sabbath. Also the Speaker made the point that the adventists where special and could not be deceived because they do not keep the Sunday Sabbath, the speaker failed to reveal the truth that Jews and muslims and hindus and buddhists and many other millions of people do not observe the Sunday Sabbath either. So observance of the correct Sabbath is not the key to being guarded from deception. What does guard from deception is believing Jesus. Teaching that if you observe the correct Sabbath then you will be guarded from deception gives people a false foundation to place their eternal security on.

Interesting view. The Jewish and Muslim calendars follow the lunar calendar, which differs significantly from the solar calendar. Therefore the Jewish and Muslim days are basically similar, while the Christians mostly follow the solar calendar adopted from Europe. I agree that the day one practices as his holy day is not the major determinant of who is correct in his belief, rather it is the belief in God which is most important, and God will inevitably judge regarding this. This was what I deemed as one of the propaganda claims made in this video by the church who produced this interview.

Ok I hope i have covered all bases DiamondHearts.

All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Yes, it is was very enlightening. Take care of yourself.

SAM, if you are still here, can you also take a look at this interview:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zkcy3cux1B4

I'd like to hear your views regarding it.

 

[SetiAlpha6]

There is no safety in numbers where God is concerned.

Yes, I understand that. Thank You.

As you seem to know scriptures you will know that the way is narrow and few find it. I see you have added to scripture by adding (freewill) to will. Of course millions and millions want to have eternity with God just as i do but my will and their will does not determine our salvation, God does. And i know that many millions who have the will to be with God for eternity bend down on their knees and pray structured prayers regularly many times a day they work and work with fasting and works of religion and works of good deeds trying their best to work their way into eternity with God, But again it is not their works that determine their eternal destination because their works are as "filthy rags" compared to the righteousness of God.

I tried to make it obvious that I was adding (freewill) to "will" because that is what it appears to me to mean. I was not trying to trick you or anything else. I was trying to be clear. Sorry!

It seems like you are saying that God hides himself from the very people that are trying to find Him, who actually have the will to find Him, by the millions, which would seem to nullify the idea that a person can seek and find Him.

They might pray structured prayers because that is what they have been taught to do. That is what they think God wants. Why would a loving God destroy them for seeking Him even if they are misguided by the teachings of mere men? And again, why would God hide Himself from the very people who seek Him? Please do the world a favor and answer this one.

Yes and i guess they are the same kind of church that teaches the doctrine of justifiable war too. Just like most of the churches with millions and millions of members teach. How can they have any hope of being lead by the Holy Spirit into understanding the deeper things of the faith when they cannot accept the simple teachings of Jesus???? Any simple person who reads the beatitudes can see what Jesus has plainly said and they could no doubt see how the teaching of justifiable war is in rebellion against Jesus. Yes they have rejected that part of the Love of the truth, so they are given over to deception.

They do accept the simple teachings of Jesus and the beatitudes. Are you saying that unless a person has perfect knowledge in every area that God will lead them astray? Surely not!

Because the Holy Spirit revealed the truth of the matter when i genuinely called out to God to give me understanding on the issue.

And they also think that they have genuinely called out to God to give them understanding and also think they have recieved it, just like you, and yet they still differ from you. So who is more "genuine" in their approach to God? And if that is not the right word for it then what is?

Nope, i am a contemptible Christian a pitiful and poor excuse of a Christian, but one thing i know it is better to follow the Word of God then the word of theologians who clearly twist the Word of God to make it conform to the needs of the kingdoms of the world and its evil elites.

This "Word of God" of yours once told parents to kill their own children in cold blood. You know this, and you know you must agree with it or go to hell yourself for your unbelief. I think it is sick.

If by "contemptible", by "pitiful", and by "poor excuse of a Christian", you mean that you are still sinning as a Christian, then according to your "Word of God" you do not know Him.

Yeah. Not because i was born that way, or because i studied hard and "worked" my way to becoming wise. But because the Holy Spirit lifted me up and gave this moron some knowledge and understanding.

So how was your freewill really involved?

I have always hated that term. It is pulled out by those who want to be seen as being something in the eyes of others and it is given as a unwise term of praise by those who want to life others up to the status of God so they can follow their teachings rather than God's teachings.

I agree.

Yes. I believe i am right. So if they disagree with me then they are wrong. i don't care if a million or a billion people disagree with me. i could not give a brass razoo if i am the only person in the world left who believes Jesus. God is the measure of what is correct and what is wrong. The popularity polls on doctrines mean nothing.

Yes, but you also might be just another one of the millions that God is leading astray as well. Personally, I do not think that a loving God could or needs to lead anyone astray EVER but then that is your doctrine not mine.

I am glad i did not try and try for years to figure it out. I am glad that The Holy Spirit gave me the answers i needed, when i needed them.

Why did the Holy Spirit not teach me the same as you?

Well you may or may not get better at loving others, my guess is that you will only be in an improved state as long as you can consciously carry the burden of being nice, sooner or later to will crack and you will spew forth the vial hatred that you try to dam up within you.

Being nice is no "burden". Do you think it is? And I have no "vial hatred" for anyone I can think of.

get it. See i am still in that supposed state, you know religious and judgemental and arrogant excreta. A well veiled hatred spew there.... Not.

I am a more loving person than I used to be.

Thanks be to God for your resistance. You have played your part in making me stronger. All things work for the good of those who love the Lord, indeed

Appears to be a little selfish to me.

Thanks

 

[Adstar]

Yeah, I noticed his nervousness too. Though I believe it is related to being afraid of what may happen to him by revealing this information. He was, however, willingly or unwillingly used by the Seventh day adventists, that is clear from the last part.

I don't believe it was fear of what would happen to him, firstly he left the satanic cult and joined the adventists before 1950 So the Satanists have had about 50 years to carry out their threats. The interviewer kept on referring to his book that he has written about his experiences. So after all this time and after releasing the book he was not revealing anything new in the interview that he had not already revealed before.

It's surprising the Bible comments on this pointing with fingers as being the trait of a wicked person. In Muslim cultures it is often seen as rude to point with a single finger, rather one should indicate with his whole hand and with respect, especially to people. Unfortunately, this is rather common in the West.

Yes it is becoming common in the west but do not be blinded about what is going on in the middle east. You should watch a few videos of speeches given by the young devout muslim men of the middle east who make video speeches before they go into Jihad actions such as bombings. You will see them jabbing at the video camera with their pointed fingers with just as much enthusiasm as western rappers do it on their music video's.

Hypnotism is something from the occultic, pagan, satanic traditions. That is why he clearly indicates that hypnotism is a secret weapon of satan. There are no former lives, this is a trick. Furthermore, hypnotism has been a long practice among the satanic societies, and those whom associate with demons (jinn).

It reminds me of people going into trances and talking for the gods in some shamanistic religious services. So yes i agree with you on that score.

Yeah. This is merely propaganda from the church which released this video. Most believers in the scriptures and followers of Abraham know for a fact, the spirit is a part of man, and came before the creation of the body of flesh, made of earth.

The Bible does not say we existed in Spirit before we existed as flesh.

Your personal choice, but that the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) taught us the best way to combat the evil of this world, from the satan and his deceivers, by worshiping and devoting ourselves to worship to God of Abraham, it cannot be so easily critiqued by simply calling him a deceiver.

Anyone who teaches in opposition to the teachings of The Messiah Jesus and at the same time claims to be a messenger of the God of Abraham is a deceiver. The catholics preach justified war and muhammad preached jihad they are both in rebellion against the teachings of Jesus who taught to love ones enemies.

Indeed he is the last in a long line of Prophets, and among the greatest of them. Though I doubt you would agree with me,

You are right i totally disagree with you.

I welcome you to read the Quran for yourself, and judge it on its merit from it s own words. http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/SURAI.HTM

I also invite you to read the Gospel, may the Spirit of God move you to the Love of the truth http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=matthew 1;&version=50;

Interesting view. The Jewish and Muslim calendars follow the lunar calendar, which differs significantly from the solar calendar. Therefore the Jewish and Muslim days are basically similar, while the Christians mostly follow the solar calendar adopted from Europe. I agree that the day one practices as his holy day is not the major determinant of who is correct in his belief, rather it is the belief in God which is most important, and God will inevitably judge regarding this. This was what I deemed as one of the propaganda claims made in this video by the church who produced this interview.

Agreed.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days