Right and wrong is determined by God

[(Q)]

On this site?

No, globally.

 

[S.A.M.]

You might want to ask yourself why you don't move to an atheist society for that asnwer.

Seeing as they are so much better at everything.

 

[Bishadi]

What "need" is there of the views of theists?

some were pioneers of evolution being proven via genetics (even when they don't know what they did)

http://anthro.palomar.edu/mendel/mendel_1.htm

Gregor Mendel

While Mendel's research was with plants, the basic underlying principles of heredity that he discovered also apply to people and other animals because the mechanisms of heredity are essentially the same for all complex life forms.

Through the selective cross-breeding of common pea plants (Pisum sativum) over many generations, Mendel discovered that certain traits show up in offspring without any blending of parent characteristics. For instance, the pea flowers are either purple or white--intermediate colors do not appear in the offspring of cross-pollinated pea plants. Mendel observed seven traits that are easily recognized and apparently only occur in one of two forms:

1. flower color is purple or white
2. flower position is axil or terminal
3. stem length is long or short
4. seed shape is round or wrinkled
5. seed color is yellow or green
6. pod shape is inflated or constricted
7. pod color is yellow or green

This observation that these traits do not show up in offspring plants with intermediate forms was critically important because the leading theory in biology at the time was that inherited traits blend from generation to generation. Most of the leading scientists in the 19th century accepted this "blending theory." Charles Darwin proposed another equally wrong theory known as "pangenesis" . This held that hereditary "particles" in our bodies are affected by the things we do during our lifetime. These modified particles were thought to migrate via blood to the reproductive cells and subsequently could be inherited by the next generation. This was essentially a variation of Lamarck's incorrect idea of the "inheritance of acquired characteristics."

some 'theist' like Roger Bacon also were pioneers in believing more than what the church liked (our favorite kind of religious person, the rebel holding honesty before belief)

 

[S.A.M.]

Not to mention they set up Oxford, Harvard and many of the premier educational institutions in the world. As well as the fact that the only funding source for many of them was the church, since the materialists could not be bothered to waste their wealth on anything as mundane as exploring the universe.

 

[(Q)]

some were pioneers of evolution being proven via genetics (even when they don't know what they did)

Gregor Mendel



some 'theist' like Roger Bacon also were pioneers in believing more than what the church liked (our favorite kind of religious person, the rebel holding honesty before belief)

Again, what "need" is there for theists views. We are talking about theism, not evolution.

 

[Bishadi]

Not to mention they set up Oxford, Harvard and many of the premier educational institutions in the world. As well as the fact that the only funding source for many of them was the church, since the materialists could not be bothered to waste their wealth on anything as mundane as exploring the universe.

good stuff

but the bottom line left open is; the knowledge itself is the giver of truth; not the religion and the beliefs.

 

[Bishadi]

Again, what "need" is there for theists views. We are talking about theism, not evolution.

prophecies are recorded within the literature

the personal views of identifying an 'almighty' is easy to observe true and absolute, just by comprehending 'mother nature' (existence itself) as GOD


so many of the 'theist' can be observant but the rituals and ability to misrepresent and then using 'a god' as the foundation without causality to application is just ignorance at work

theists do not mean liars in all cases; it just seems that way

 

[(Q)]

Not to mention they set up Oxford, Harvard and many of the premier educational institutions in the world. As well as the fact that the only funding source for many of them was the church, since the materialists could not be bothered to waste their wealth on anything as mundane as exploring the universe.

Wow, a forty foot tall strawman. Never seen on of those before.

 

[(Q)]

prophecies are recorded within the literature

And, what of those prophecies has ever come to light?

theists do not mean liars in all cases; it just seems that way

Delusion is a big part of it. Theist's sometimes believe they're telling the truth, but their truth is based on their scriptures.

Others simply lie outright, knowingly.

 

[S.A.M.]

Wow, a forty foot tall strawman. Never seen on of those before.

Where were all the atheists?

John Harvard (November 26, 1607 – September 14, 1638) was an English clergyman and first benefactor of College which was named Harvard University in his honor. [1] He directed that half his money, along with his library, be given to the recently created school. His gift assured its continued operation.

Well-known scholars were, we know, lecturing in Oxford on theology and canon law before the middle of the twelfth century, but these were probably private teachers attached to St. Frideswide's monastery. It is not until the end of Henry II's reign, that is about 1180, that we know, chiefly on the authority of Giraldus Cambrensis, that a large body of scholars was in residence at Oxford, though not probably yet living under any organized constitution.

Half a century later Oxford was famous throughout Europe as a home of science and learning; popes and kings were among its patrons and benefactors; the students are said to have been numbered by thousands; and the climax of its reputation was reached when, during the fifty years between 1220 and 1270, the newly-founded orders of friars -- Dominican, Franciscan, Carmelite, and Austin -- successively settled at Oxford, and threw all their enthusiasm into the work of teaching. Kindled by their zeal, the older monastic orders, encouraged by a decree of the Lateran Council of 1215, began to found conventual schools at Oxford for their own members. The colleges of Worcester, Trinity, Christ Church, and St. John's are all the immediate successors of these Benedictine or Cistercian houses of study. Up to this time the secular students had lived as best they might in scattered lodgings hired from the townsmen; of discipline there was absolutely none, and riots and disorders between "town and gown" were of continual occurrence. The stimulus of the presence of so many scholars living underconventual discipline incited Walter de Merton, in 1264, to found a residential college, properly organized and supervised, for secular students.

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

god is all mass, energy time
(awake).............

Mass, energy & time cannot be obeyed or disobeyed or require a duty or punish or reward.

do you live in a democracy?

No.
Do you? If so, which planet are you posting from & how are you accessing our internet???

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

I give you full right to make fun of my atheism anytime you wish, Sam. Feel free. Although, I'm not sure what kind of fun can be gleaned from a lack of belief in fairy tales? :shrug:

:roflmao:

 

[(Q)]

Where were all the atheists?

Being burned at the stake by theists?

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

There are at least two sides to every issue

OriginalBiggles, Prime

Often there are not. There are solidly constructed buildings & there are flimsy facades.

Now hold on a second here.
Atheists believe in evolution.

Not necessarily.

We also believe the sun will rise in the morning and set in the evening. As you can see, we have our faiths, too.

I don't believe the sun will rise in the morning.
Do you truly???

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

You might want to ask yourself why you don't move to an atheist society for that asnwer.

Seeing as they are so much better at everything.

You might ask yourself why you don't move someplace where gods exist.

 

[mike47]

Those who believe that everything is from a god somewhere make life so easy for them as they do not have to rsearch anything at all . Relogions are the only subject where you can talk all days and all nigts without proving one single statement .

 

[(Q)]

I don't believe the sun will rise in the morning.
Do you truly???

Relatively speaking, of course.

 

[Doreen]

Those who believe that everything is from a god somewhere make life so easy for them as they do not have to rsearch anything at all . Relogions are the only subject where you can talk all days and all nigts without proving one single statement .

I guess this latter sentence supports itself as an example. You are talking about religion and have made a statement you not only haven't proven but could not. Politics, psychobabble, discussions of celebrities, all discussions of taste issues, gossip, ethical discussions, etc., are other subjects I have heard people go on for long periods not only without proving anything, but without being able to. And then there are a whole host of discussions I've heard on a wide range of topics where not one proves a single statement. Of course proving things is extremely hard in many cases, but the range of topics where people hardly bother to support their assertions is also legion. Your post above for example.

 

[James R]

I've learned a lot about you in this thread, James. And interestingly, I've learned a lot about some other people, too.

From the comment above, I've also learned that no one can stand up for anyone else unless they, too, have been offended in some way. Attorneys can't speak for the victims of verbal abuse; forum moderators can't punish anyone for offensive language unless they, too, have been offended by it.

Interestingly, too, is that I've discovered that no one should ever be offended by anything. ...and yet, I wonder how many people have been banned from this site for "offensive" posts or comments or words????

Baron Max

Just blowing hot air, I see. As you were.

 

[S.A.M.]

good stuff

but the bottom line left open is; the knowledge itself is the giver of truth; not the religion and the beliefs.

Maybe, but knowledge doesnn't occur in a vacuum. The only reason a socially dysfunctional theist like Galileo could elucidate his theories and preserve them for the next generation is because, inspite of having alienated both his peers and the man who funded him, the Pope, he was given enough provision so as to be able to ignore his daily responsibilities toward his family and sit and write. This is also true for Mendel and Darwin and all those who were able to do what they did because they did not have to spend their time worrying about their material needs.

Without the educational institutions, the opportunity for and access to learning, there would be very few people who could devote their time to study and research. Like an artist, the process of learning is not productive in itself, its the results which may or may not even benefit the one who may have spent his life in working on it, but will enhance the society in which he will leave it behind.

To diminish the efforts of those who provided these opportunities is to diminish the results obtained from them.