Mosheh Thezion said:
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M*W: Who else could it be but Satan?
Religious Tolerance
- Thread starter Solve et Coagula
- Start date
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M*W: Who else could it be but Satan?
Medicine Woman said:
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M*W: No, wait, I was wrong. It was Ignorance.
There are those among us who are arrogant enough to believe that by imagining alone, without recourse to rigorous experimental verification, they can arrive at truth and knowledge. God lives only in the imagination of the arrogant. My tolerance is almost nil, not because I'm convinced that theists are arrogant and self-deluded. I'm very tolerant of those who fantasize and admit that it gives them comfort. I do it myself. The arrogant theist has the nerve to insist that his god is real however, without confronting nature and the outside world with the slightest objectivity. It's called physical evidence.
superluminal said:
But why should that influence your tolerance of their beliefs and thoughts? I mean, can't you think/believe that they're wrong without being IN-tolerant of their beliefs/thoughts? I don't think I understand exactly why you can't be tolerant of them?
superluminal said:
What would you have them do ...insist the god they believe in is NOT real?? ...even though they have no objective prove? Are they to belief in their god, yet denounce that belief because you don't like it?
Your post is confusing to me. If it's possible, could you explain that a bit better?
Baron Max
Sorry.
With no convincing evidence, a theist will insist that his god is "real". He can't prove any physical manifestation or effect as being attributed to a god , yet he insists that the god is "real". He then goes on to insist that public policy should incorporate allowances for the "reality" of this god, which affects how our society functions. I have no wish to live in a society who's decisions and policy are based on belief in an unprovable conjecture. Therefore, I have no tolerance for theists, all of whom insist that their imaginary construct (god) is "real".
Ok?
With no convincing evidence, a theist will insist that his god is "real". He can't prove any physical manifestation or effect as being attributed to a god , yet he insists that the god is "real". He then goes on to insist that public policy should incorporate allowances for the "reality" of this god, which affects how our society functions. I have no wish to live in a society who's decisions and policy are based on belief in an unprovable conjecture. Therefore, I have no tolerance for theists, all of whom insist that their imaginary construct (god) is "real".
Ok?
QuarkMoon,
Excuse me, but atheists humbly accept what nature shows them, and accept the experimental evidence for what it is, without spinning fantasies to deny some uncomfortable truths that science reveals.
P.S.
I've been condescended to by every theist I've spoken to seriously, especially after suggesting that they provide a bit of physical evidence for this god of theirs. Arrogant pricks. Scientists (overwhelmingly atheist/agnostic) are always ready to change their opinions based on solid evidence. A theist will never, ever change his mind.
Excuse me, but atheists humbly accept what nature shows them, and accept the experimental evidence for what it is, without spinning fantasies to deny some uncomfortable truths that science reveals.
P.S.
I've been condescended to by every theist I've spoken to seriously, especially after suggesting that they provide a bit of physical evidence for this god of theirs. Arrogant pricks. Scientists (overwhelmingly atheist/agnostic) are always ready to change their opinions based on solid evidence. A theist will never, ever change his mind.
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superluminal said:
Atheists also expect everyone else to drop their beliefs because there is no proof. The belief in God is more than a comforting belief, it also breeds the feeling of meaning to ones life and fulfillment. Faith in science is the same thing as faith in God, science can not explain everything, and never will. People use God to fill in the blanks of science. To deny them of that is the epitome of arrogance.
why would something like this "evolve"
http://www.time.com/time/covers/1101041025/
another source
http://washingtontimes.com/world/20041114-111404-8087r.htm
http://www.time.com/time/covers/1101041025/
another source
http://washingtontimes.com/world/20041114-111404-8087r.htm
superluminal said:
What is the point of asking a theist to prove their God with physical evidence? The idea of God is that He transcends the physical.. If there is a higher power, he cannot be tested...omnipotence infers this. So why ask? The question achieves nothing, as you ignore the very essence of what God is supposed to be.
QuarkMoon said:
How naive. No atheist expects any theist to drop his beliefs. The atheist just wants the theist to stay the hell out of public affairs. And "Faith in science"??? Faith is by definition the acceptance of things without supporting evidence or proof. Scienc is by definition the acceptance of ONLY those things demonstrated by overwhelmine evidence and proof.
superluminal said:
Many people do that same thing with something that we call "love". I would guess that there's many such things that humans do/say that can't be proven with convincing evidence ...can't think of any more at the moment.
superluminal said:
Hmm, Muslims are the only ones that I know where their religion is directly connected to their government and/or social laws/rules. Do you know of any other such nations/governments?
superluminal said:
I'm not sure, but I think tolerance is actually the ability to accept that others believe differently than you and that you not denigrate them or their beliefs just because you believe that they're wrong. Or do you have a different understanding of the meaning of the word "tolerance"?
Baron Max
FallingSkyward said:
Your statement is the very essence of irrationality. How can anyone rationally support a belief in such an "entity"? I have an invisible, ethereal, pink elephant living in my house. He leaves no trace, yet I insist that he is "real". Am I rational? Why did I even propose the existence of such a thing? Why did ancient humans propose the existence of a god?
superluminal said:
I daresay that there are more theists than there are atheists in the USA, yet you seem perfectly willing to deny them any role in their own government? ...just because of their beliefs? WoW!!
(edit): Gee, and to think that this thread is about ....tolerance!
Baron Max
Baron Max said:
1) "Love" is purely subjective thing and no one expects the rules of evidence to apply. Theists insist that their god has a real effect on the world. It is then in the realm of science and reason to examine it. god is a wholly unsupported hypothesis.
2) The slowly evolving theocracy of the United States of America.
3) I don't denigrate the belief itself. I denigrate the application of this belief to the real world. It is irrational and frankly, a bit stupid.
Mosheh Thezion
Registered Senior Member
superluminal said:
actually....
i would have to argue with that.... there is plenty of evidense.
evidense suggesting the application of energy from an outside sourse.
the evidense.. generally.
some theory regarding simple dimensional progressions...
alittle biblical comparison....
NEVER acuse me of not being fully versed in the sciences sir...
in fact i dare say i was not very religious until i became knowledgable in the sciences and cosmology....
and i, like a madman can go over the entire known universe with you in analysis of proposals for universal formation and the nature of NATURE as we know it....
-MT
Baron,
Your arguments re "love" are in the subjective world of human emotion. Not the objective world of phenomena (e.g. god answers prayers, god is responsible for my health or lack of it, etc...) I will no longer address that issue.
Your arguments re "love" are in the subjective world of human emotion. Not the objective world of phenomena (e.g. god answers prayers, god is responsible for my health or lack of it, etc...) I will no longer address that issue.
superluminal said:
Interesting viewpoint. In days past, the USA was a LOT more religious than it is now ...yet you seem to feel that it's the other way around? How so?
superluminal said:
Hmmm, let's reword that a bit, okay? "God" is purely subjective thing and no one expects the rules of evidence to apply.
Just about the same thing, ain't it? Not much difference in what I see.
superluminal said:
What application? Please explain.
Baron Max
Mosheh Thezion said:
I do accuse you of not being versed in the METHOD of science sir. You may have facts, but your critical thinking abilities are suspect. Your drawings look like nonsense to me.