No one said "religious integrity" is easy.
In this day and age "integrity" religious or no, isn't easy.
jan.
Religious integrity
- Thread starter Bishadi
- Start date
No one said "religious integrity" is easy.
In this day and age "integrity" religious or no, isn't easy.
jan.
for your education
Exodus 3
1And Moses hath been feeding the flock of Jethro his father-in-law, priest of Midian, and he leadeth the flock behind the wilderness, and cometh in unto the mount of God, to Horeb;
2and there appeareth unto him a messenger of Jehovah in a flame of fire, out of the midst of the bush, and he seeth, and lo, the bush is burning with fire, and the bush is not consumed.
3And Moses saith, `Let me turn aside, I pray thee, and I see this great appearance; wherefore is the bush not burned?'
4and Jehovah seeth that he hath turned aside to see, and God calleth unto him out of the midst of the bush, and saith, `Moses, Moses;' and he saith, `Here [am] I.'
that is where the torah was (OT) is supposed to have come from
'every word in existence used by mankind to articulate was created by mankind
"made up"......... is like letters in an alphabet
try .................. gonapsyphilherpalaids
i think i got it a new STD
that goo is just a word
the idea as the words was defined bugs you; has nothing to do with reality
who know, maybe god is the goo and he told some dude from a non consumed burning stove top
lots of metaphors
eg... eve is said to come from adam (his rib)... i say all biology life must give a portion of itself to continue in life; cells divide
it makes me sad battling an unarmed person (with no integrity)
what dogma?
name one (at least when you are trying to impose a label)
be fair, as i don't do dogma.........'beep'
The only people with religious integrity are fundamentalists. Everyone else makes compromises between the text and the requirements of real life. That being said, I don't believe such integrity is a virtue, as it involves being true to something with no valid supporting evidence.
Bishadi,
1) notice that the bush did not talk
2) notice that the bush did not burn
3) as pointed out by Potizio, the torah was revealed to Moses at Mount Sinai, according to orthodox rabbis.
It is also stated in the kabbala that the torah was created prior to creation;
Your fraudulence would not be based on your words, but your intent.
You have demonstrated your intent, which is to mislead the people, we know that, because you said it.
How do you know that God was the result of such intent?
I doubt it.
So as long as it can fit with your belief, it's ok?
Are you aware that you have been wrong on almost everything you've
attempted to educate? Are you aware that you have used ad-hominems to
bolster your position?
The belief that we are brothers and sisters of the primeval goo.
This belief is considered by you to be authoritative and undisputable.
It is the platform you base you entire philosophy on, even when attempting
to understand the bible, which clearly regards 'spirit' as the cause of the material creation.
jan.
1) notice that the bush did not talk
2) notice that the bush did not burn
3) as pointed out by Potizio, the torah was revealed to Moses at Mount Sinai, according to orthodox rabbis.
It is also stated in the kabbala that the torah was created prior to creation;
Your fraudulence would not be based on your words, but your intent.
You have demonstrated your intent, which is to mislead the people, we know that, because you said it.
How do you know that God was the result of such intent?
I doubt it.
So as long as it can fit with your belief, it's ok?
Are you aware that you have been wrong on almost everything you've
attempted to educate? Are you aware that you have used ad-hominems to
bolster your position?
The belief that we are brothers and sisters of the primeval goo.
This belief is considered by you to be authoritative and undisputable.
It is the platform you base you entire philosophy on, even when attempting
to understand the bible, which clearly regards 'spirit' as the cause of the material creation.
jan.
Basically you are just reiterating what i said at the opening; the words came from a talking bush and that is what the 'three religions' of abraham were BORN from.
another addendum to the revised revisions, interpreted as such.
i said all words are created by man and these three lines are your rebuttal
my intent is for mass to comprehend its existence (purely: to share what has been learned; what 'life' is; from atoms and energy forward)
if my intent was other, i would publish what gravity is and be a super star
when did i say that? that is a bold lie.
to me knowledge should not be for sale, nor owned;
my intent is to make sure the truth never is and it equally 'free' to all mankind
existence itself is god to me, and so HIS laws are natures laws
and that intent in all 'life' is to continue (just look around)
then i post that 'cells divide' and that to me, that is what the lesson of the adams ribs making eve (metaphor) meant
and you post this
what belief? I learn truth (biology) and share how an analogy gives credibility to a metaphor?
Common sense, tells us that ribs don't make eves
but the metaphor can be understood
just like the adams apple, (eve,serpant,fruit;story) shares that choice was born; we became capable in awareness; consciousness was born
i am battling with selfishness and have denned with the wolves; i know you by your 'intent' (it is all about yourself as nothing you post is offering anyone anything but your attempt to discredit me; not the words or message)
because i understand i breath air (entangled to the environment)
i know we came from the earth; not some magical place with magic wands making things i don't understand.
i will not false witness just to be a part of the magic game
i am responsible for my actions and offer any material so each can see the same (equally); so they can be too; by choice.
i like to enable others in equality, truth, compassion and the understanding of life.
and you have no idea what 'the light' is (the true spirit of life)
as to know 'light' then you can know truth and it be universal across all of existence. (god himself)
i wanted to apologize to all the construction workers for my fib there
ribs are good for making eves,
sorry, i lied without being holy aware.
Bishadi,
You've been corrected.
Learn from that.
That is your opinion. The fact still remains.
It's not intended as a rebuttal.
Can you answer the question please.
How do you know that God was the result of the same intent you had with
the 1st century people hypothesis?
''...could you imagine being back in the 1st century with walkie talkies and a friend like me, (with a mean streak)
we could have ruled the world; cuz we were 'talkin to God,' and no one would know the difference...
....but it talked and wanted girls to be all making children by me, first.
maybe i should start a religion? ''
You mean you want the people of the world to think the way you think.
That statement has no meaning.
You will die soon therefore God as you know HIM, plus yourself, will cease to
exist. What is the point of saying God is existence?
The body may continue (in part), but what of the person themself, they are different. The goo trail has nothing to do with experience, but experience is
what makes us the individual people we are.
If you lost someone you love, but was able to use DNA to reproduce another
person who was identical in look, but had none of the experiences, would your greiving come to an end?
You've taken God out of the picture, reducing Him to the actual biological
process. This means you have to do the same throughout the the bible
and other religious scripture. And that's just plain silly.
Again you are missing out the essential, God.
If you don't believe in God just say so, there's no need to make stuff up
to fit your understanding.
Why does it have to be a metaphor?
You cannot see beyond your atheism, and as such, everything is wrong
if it doesn't agree with it. And you get frustrated when you are being corrected.
Real atheism can only go as far as "I do not believe in God (for whatever reason)" Anything outside of that which attempts to prove or show that God does not exist, or is a figment of imagination, or God is not necessary, eventually becomes a belief, doctrine, dogma, and then religion (albeit Godless)
Can't you see what you are doing?
You are giving yourself a reason to deny God, by asociating God with magic, of the childish variety. This kind of (self-) hypnosis is conjured up (no pun) with
phrases like "celestial teapot", "flying pink elephants", "pink unicorns", ", faries", and other childish things.
Try enable yourself first.
I have no idea WTF you're talking about, more to the point.
jan.
You've been corrected.
Learn from that.
That is your opinion. The fact still remains.
It's not intended as a rebuttal.
Can you answer the question please.
How do you know that God was the result of the same intent you had with
the 1st century people hypothesis?
''...could you imagine being back in the 1st century with walkie talkies and a friend like me, (with a mean streak)
we could have ruled the world; cuz we were 'talkin to God,' and no one would know the difference...
....but it talked and wanted girls to be all making children by me, first.
maybe i should start a religion? ''
You mean you want the people of the world to think the way you think.
That statement has no meaning.
You will die soon therefore God as you know HIM, plus yourself, will cease to
exist. What is the point of saying God is existence?
The body may continue (in part), but what of the person themself, they are different. The goo trail has nothing to do with experience, but experience is
what makes us the individual people we are.
If you lost someone you love, but was able to use DNA to reproduce another
person who was identical in look, but had none of the experiences, would your greiving come to an end?
You've taken God out of the picture, reducing Him to the actual biological
process. This means you have to do the same throughout the the bible
and other religious scripture. And that's just plain silly.
Again you are missing out the essential, God.
If you don't believe in God just say so, there's no need to make stuff up
to fit your understanding.
Why does it have to be a metaphor?
You cannot see beyond your atheism, and as such, everything is wrong
if it doesn't agree with it. And you get frustrated when you are being corrected.
Real atheism can only go as far as "I do not believe in God (for whatever reason)" Anything outside of that which attempts to prove or show that God does not exist, or is a figment of imagination, or God is not necessary, eventually becomes a belief, doctrine, dogma, and then religion (albeit Godless)
Can't you see what you are doing?
You are giving yourself a reason to deny God, by asociating God with magic, of the childish variety. This kind of (self-) hypnosis is conjured up (no pun) with
phrases like "celestial teapot", "flying pink elephants", "pink unicorns", ", faries", and other childish things.
Try enable yourself first.
I have no idea WTF you're talking about, more to the point.
jan.
corrected on what.
i know bushes don't talk, i said the religion was created with a foundation stating such within.
me not much of a 'false witness'
perhaps you need to reread the thread. (comprehension issue: you are lacking)
i said the kabala rendition was an addendum and you said
what fact? (the fact someone wrote it, perhaps?)
then i said 'all words are created by mankind' and you rebuting the rebuttal with
the word and concept 'God' in itself is the creation of mankind
it is used to articulate a concept, "the almighty everything" (i call that 'creator' existence itself; all mass, all energy all time; the total)
and the process of how existence works can be defined mathematically (the name)
this result of the same intent you had with the 1st century people hypothesis?
i don't understand this question but now you know what god is to me
so you don't hurt yourself with confusing me with any named idea cuz religiously and scientifically (within current paradigm) i fit NO WHERE
''...could you imagine being back in the 1st century with walkie talkies and a friend like me, (with a mean streak)
we could have ruled the world; cuz we were 'talkin to God,' and no one would know the difference...
....but it talked and wanted girls to be all making children by me, first.
maybe i should start a religion? ''
You mean you want the people of the world to think the way you think.
no and i am sorry; it meant, i could have been a moses, pharoah, quetzcoatl....etc..... for having something of knowledge, that the rest of the world did not; an object of science that is magic to another
(a bic lighter to a person from an untouched native tribe, would be a magic thing)
the point, knowledge could practically make someone a god back in them days; ooooops on my part
existence aint going no where. and darwin won! As his gifts are alive because of a choice he himself made, to contribute to us all; he is alive in what he did. (thanks Big D)
it is that you believe conscious awareness is your life but forget that every night yu sleep; then you would be practicing death, by your own concept, each night
(life is the energy of the mass; eg...dead person, same mass, lights are out)
so we are basically a life capable of self awareness, that can give of our energy for other life to live, by our own choices
all within the ever sought concept called GOD; existence, our creator, the garden, mother nature; the total as ONE
we are just lives that live within and have been defining existence (God) over time, with words
the pinnacle is when 'mass can comprehend its existence'
(you talking to that idiot)
nope, we are lives within existence; the process, just is
we (mankind) are learning how it works
ooooops
all knowledge combines, jan
all the religions combine as the same exact core principle is in each; be fair be honest and one day the truth will come (find it all combines under 'the light".............. the core comprehension of how life exists upon mass)
because they could not define what was seen; the true scope (just like you not comprehending what 'life' is; the true scope)
the rest of your post was just ranting
i am not atheist nor religious
perhaps try just 'honest'
that is a choice i can sustain as no one else represents me or i to another; i choose to be responsible
that's it!
The bush didn't talk, the bush didn't burn. God spoke, and created the fire which did not consume the bush. Hence the any religion worth its salt is based on God.
That fact that it wasn't based on a guy talking with a bush that was being consumed by fire.
You can't rubutt something if there's nothing to rebutt.
Err...yeah-but no-but, how do you KNOW God is a concept to articulate
everything?
I'm not interested (at this point) in your opinion, I wish to know
what knowledge/technology you have acquired which leads you to that conclusion.
Ah ah, it's too late now, you said it, that is the stuff of your mind-set.
If it makes you feel better, that same expression is expressed by loads of
people here with the same mindset.
Your point was that they would believe you are talking with God, because you say so, and they wouldn't understand the technology, and as such you could start a religion. To you, that is what religion is, which is why I asked you the question regarding God.
But for how long?
They'd soon realise it is not much different to the way they ignite fire.
Things, objects, is what would make someone practically a god, not only back then, but today as well.
Will YOU not cease to exist when you die?
Darwin is dead, get over it.
What he proposed was not a new thing.
I don't know about you, but I am still conscioius and aware in my sleep, just different to my waking consciousness, and awareness, is all.
To you, life is nothing more than a biological process, which is why you
see things the way you do. You instinctively know that God is real, but your
atheism prevents you from the linking/binding process. Now you have a shed-load of useless information which, as an outcast of human reality, you try and put the pieces together to create the link with God.
Are you calling me, or yourself an idiot?
If we don't exist, does existence exist?
If yes, how so?
How is this learning taking place?
You're an atheist because you deny God His Supremity, and replace Him with a concoction.
jan.
so you know the facts; the bush didn't talk
but still fall on a magical rendition of a separate being from the event (total compiliation of everything to bring moses even up there)
the separation is to consider a god did it, rather than all that occurred as god (mass, energy, time; the total of everything at once)
see the difference
i know, i see it as moses (of the stories) would have learned what he did while living in the pharoahs house and realized the group had no laws equal to all of them to be observed.
walked up the hill and began chiseling; (my opinion) (he can talk to himself or the genus euonymus plant that perhaps ignited naturally)
after not eating when he got his wits back he realized what he (Moses) create, tablets!
so we have common ground? You agree ALL words were created by mankind!
that's a big step for any who hold theistic views as law (real)
wonder how many others finally realize that fact
not some dude, a god but all of existence; then yes
then it means, we all are a part of existence and capable of contributing by choice; kind of like what darwin did and notice after all these years and he is still alive in what he did. (we still lovin, his gifts)
so all mankind in a sense is and can be a part of that 'evolution of knowledge' by choice
then imagine that final 'owners manual' that can be given to the kids (our future) so when they learn, they could one day learn the 'truth' on the first pass and live a life with foundation and comprehension of life; from the beginning.
(that be to me the 'book of life'.... in which them who gave of themselves, for the future, by choice, will be a part of the pyramid of knowledge to them kids of our future; as then they live forever in the minds of tomorrow)
pretty basic, no magic, no false promises; just common sense everyone of us can actually comprehend!
no pocketes for me
just the knowledge that enables life
the conclusion is this; the current ideology of how life exists can be understood by comprehending electromagnetism (light) (eg.. gravity itself is just a property of em called entanglement)
life: abuses entropy (current paradigm is wrong!)
nope
me makem' bigem' splash
not to you, he lives in your mind; he splashed too
nor is life; but can you define it at the level equal to nature, experience, physics, theology and philosophies?
He put in his brick; say thanks
did i say, it was not possible.................. as monks sit in caves and fly thru the eyes of an eagle; not to mention prophecy and deja vu.
point is and you know it; life (defined) is not being consciously aware
nature showed me and you too
i know i am a part of existence, nature, the garden and never separate no matter which idiot tells me; that is reality of my factual experience
There is and never has been some separated, isolated, creating, type thing sitting on a thrown with a magic wand that gets pissed at people for doing things not approved of in a book of religious literature.
i trust that i can understand better than the idiots who hold a book and then not follow what it says
when a honest person sees the incosistancies, then they can judge for themselves.
you will not let your integrity make the call over your minds-set, pursuit of a pretty pictured belief.
"i am therefore i exist"
abe lincoln is in the dirt; his rocks are making no choices; but what he did still exists. Almost like taking a candle and starting a fire
difference is, the man, can make a choice and live in what IT does
knowledge evolves (words evolve)
Did your grandpa teach you the word 'google'?
did einstein know the evidence to the property of entanglement as measured in rubidium in bell labs?
did constantine realize that if Jesus was supposedly of David lineage (matthew 1), then Joseph and mary had to make the baby; otherwise if Jesus was immaculately concieved; then he was not of josephs bloodline! (genetics of life; biology) (adopted don't make a bloodline)
i know god by what he has revealed to all of mankind
not by the concoction of religious quacks who will fib to keep their one opinion as fact
basically telling your children you don't care about them and their future, just your own acceptance in belief. (you choose self, over others, jan.)
you oppress!
Bishadi,
So YOU know the facts; the bush was never thought to have spoken, by those who have read and understood the text.
So why knowingly allude to that idea, if not to purposely discredit
When you use the term "magic" i imagine a magician on stage with an attractive assistant, conjouring up rabbits out of a hat, and sawing a member of the audience in half. Then it turns out that they're ok.
Why would you use such a word to describe Gods' activeties?
It would show integrity to at least use relevant description, such as "creator",
or "original cause". Those are the definitions of God, from any scripture you
may care to mention (not only in the bible). And as such form a part of the basis of the reasoning structure of those who believe. Despite your belief status.
If you believe it doesn't deserve that kind reasonablness, then why bother
to argue?
It may surprise you to know that people don't necessarily believe in God
because he created the world.
I think with the growth of the atheist movement, and the advancement of
technology and science, this has become the sticking point, or even battle
ground. But it is not the focus of belief in most cases.
Of course there is a difference, but yours is a belief just like the other, as
you do not REALLY know.
You are rationalising it. Fair enough.
But you are still in the same position as anyone else who doesn't
actually know, be they theist, agnostic, or atheist. You believe it
because it is a rational explanation, not because you have any
knowledge which can validate your hypothesis.
The problem is a rational explanation can only come from what
we percieve with our senses, and our senses are'nt perfect. Such an explanation can only be in alighnment with what we understand of nature, at all times (past, present, and future).
Do you feel confident that we have sufficient data to be certain of your ideas?
Actually no, I don't agree, but if can show me why you agree, I may well
change my mind.
Again, because of your mindset, you have no choice but to believe that
alphabets, words, and forming words to communicate, have been created by
man. The theist may well hold this opinion also, but may consider that there is an intelligent force which has the ability to make sure some beings have this ability, who in turn impart it to mankind.
The difference between the two understandings is the theist operates from the understanding that the 1 is the the root of everything, including the zero, which is only relevant in light of the 1.
It is of no real importance, whether or not that is a fact.
The fact is, we do not have the capability to actually know, unless
we can somehow travel back through time and witness it.
You are implying that God is nothing more than a man.
Why do you try to belittle God?
I will respond again shortly.
jan.
So YOU know the facts; the bush was never thought to have spoken, by those who have read and understood the text.
So why knowingly allude to that idea, if not to purposely discredit
When you use the term "magic" i imagine a magician on stage with an attractive assistant, conjouring up rabbits out of a hat, and sawing a member of the audience in half. Then it turns out that they're ok.
Why would you use such a word to describe Gods' activeties?
It would show integrity to at least use relevant description, such as "creator",
or "original cause". Those are the definitions of God, from any scripture you
may care to mention (not only in the bible). And as such form a part of the basis of the reasoning structure of those who believe. Despite your belief status.
If you believe it doesn't deserve that kind reasonablness, then why bother
to argue?
It may surprise you to know that people don't necessarily believe in God
because he created the world.
I think with the growth of the atheist movement, and the advancement of
technology and science, this has become the sticking point, or even battle
ground. But it is not the focus of belief in most cases.
Of course there is a difference, but yours is a belief just like the other, as
you do not REALLY know.
You are rationalising it. Fair enough.
But you are still in the same position as anyone else who doesn't
actually know, be they theist, agnostic, or atheist. You believe it
because it is a rational explanation, not because you have any
knowledge which can validate your hypothesis.
The problem is a rational explanation can only come from what
we percieve with our senses, and our senses are'nt perfect. Such an explanation can only be in alighnment with what we understand of nature, at all times (past, present, and future).
Do you feel confident that we have sufficient data to be certain of your ideas?
Actually no, I don't agree, but if can show me why you agree, I may well
change my mind.
Again, because of your mindset, you have no choice but to believe that
alphabets, words, and forming words to communicate, have been created by
man. The theist may well hold this opinion also, but may consider that there is an intelligent force which has the ability to make sure some beings have this ability, who in turn impart it to mankind.
The difference between the two understandings is the theist operates from the understanding that the 1 is the the root of everything, including the zero, which is only relevant in light of the 1.
It is of no real importance, whether or not that is a fact.
The fact is, we do not have the capability to actually know, unless
we can somehow travel back through time and witness it.
You are implying that God is nothing more than a man.
Why do you try to belittle God?
I will respond again shortly.
jan.
The only way to represent your integrity is through your actions.
An oxymoron.
Religions make claims which are either false outright or at least unsupportable.
This is good reason why religion is BS.
You're expecting that to be religious is to be part of a religious text that is thousands of years old. It doesn't take me to tell you that most scripture has been made redundant, because we have progressed. It obviously makes some people feel good to have a thing to 'belong' to, but they obviously can't think for themselves - and above all, be honest.
Who needs to believe in a jewish zombie if you can actually think for yourself?
A common ornamental shrub which you can buy and use to amaze your friends.
Its leave actually burn without injury and it is common to the middle east.
Also call the dictamnus albus.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictamnus
Here it burns but is not consumed...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2q1ap8SwWPs
God is not even as much as that. A mere concept and a bad idea at that.
did i post the the scripture, to let the words make their own case,
rather than you tell me and the globe "the bush was never thought to have spoken"
which is funny, as the majority of the religious of Torah, bible, OT; ALL believe a burning bush gave up the commands
so your opinion is different. Perhaps you can tell us where the commandments came from.
because ANY phenomenon not UNDERSTOOD is still 'magic' to the uneducated.
Sure, some will say; 'god did it'
but realiy don't work on magical creations from a god; them ideas are from beliefs, in magic, miracles, omnipotence and that some dude is consciously making them things occur.
that is the integrity of the politically correct or believers; not reality.
Original cause?.......
to what?
i represent what i know.
I can witness God as existence itself and be respectful to her/him/mother nature; God. As our creator, our breath, the spirit of our life, the provider; the boss!
see the difference?
then i said Moses being raised in pharoahs house; is perhaps how a single man could have learned the knowledge he has and lead people, write laws, and represent as if he talked with god himself (normal to talk to god, when pharoah is practically a god to the land of the people)
and you say this
as that is how honest people work at truth. As they do not hold an idea and say, it was magic that told him. (god talking to him by a bush)
show us something rational about god talking to one person over another?
YES!
OK....
"gonapsyphilherpalaids".............. another created word; by the choice of 'man'.
there's your proof positive!
are you not aware of the adam and eve stories?
man named eve, after eating the apple; man named the 'mother of all life'
man named God 'itself'
perhaps i should let the book speak for itself
Gen 3
20And the man calleth his wife's name Eve: for she hath been mother of all living.
21And Jehovah God doth make to the man and to his wife coats of skin, and doth clothe them.
**** the garden provides ****
22And Jehovah God saith, `Lo, the man was as one of Us, as to the knowledge of good and evil; and now, lest he send forth his hand, and have taken also of the tree of life, and eaten, and lived to the age,'
It says man became aware of choice, used words to describe, the garden (nature) provides and mankind has and is capable of good and bad. (and can live forever in what 'they' do (we the people))
relying on a isolating 'thing' to take care of us, by choice
rather each contributor (prophet, scientist, giver of self for others) is who does the works...............BY CHOICE
as that is the magic; we all can give and live in them choices
the total of existence; all mass, all energy all time
the corporeal (mass), the spirit (light/life of mass/energy), the transcendent (time); this your trinity combined to the ONE (total of existence/nature; the boss)
hence:
If existence only operates ONE way; then the math is the 'name' to know.
it shares the process of how existence works; hence, the last word to all arguments is the name of the boss.
No one can witness, the beginning nor who 'created' the first 'words'
but we can all be honest, by choice, as to what we witness
and since none of us can see the past or future, as 'in fact'.... then we can only represent what we can experience.
i am know that math; the name!
sorry, charlie.... it would be like saying jesus is god, and most know that aint true
all of existence is the boss, not a single isolated 'dude'
that is why from confucius to darwin, if what they offered is 'good' then consider it 'from god' too
so we all can learn from god (existence/nature/ the universe/all of mankinds knowledge)
now that is a SWARM of GREAT LOGIC!
as then no one should 'false witness' (lying would die)
are you trying to make me call you SIR?
just as "puff the magic dragon' was a man/women-made 'creation'
ever notice 'he' evolved into a 'Barney'
much of.....it...........is
i am not expecting anything but folks to be honest (at least with themselves: don't have to tell me (the forum) anything
knowledge evolves (too)
have a 'KISS" from me
as knowledge is what. ....................'sets you free'
all of mankind!
and once the truth unveils.......... then never again willmankind be held under the oppression of any religion, institution, governments or 'power minds'
we all will be free as our children will eventually weed out the corrupt
we owe to them folks, least we are all worthless;
if we do not give to them our very selves for their lives.
remember, we live in what we do, not what we believe!
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