You would have to be one of the most dishonest hacks to ever grace this site.
I know they can't get an abortion during the birth or just before the baby is born, do you know why? BECAUSE NO DOCTOR WILL PERFORM SUCH A PROCEDURE. How many god damn times does this need to be repeated? Or are you just going to keep lying to make a point that cannot exist in reality? No, really, how many times?
Again a later term abortion can involve induced labor so you are wrong, doctors will and have performed such a procedure it is what a later term abortion generally is.
And again, saying doctors forbid it means your saying doctors make up ethics for women, that doctors have final say on what is right and wrong. Well then if doctors say she needs a c-section and she rejects it, do the doctors have the right to do the c-section against her will?
Nope. That is at the discretion of the abortionist. Roe vs Wade applies the 24 week scale of viability. Do women abort after this point? Yes. Should she have a right to? Yes. However common sense also prevails here, something you and Capracus are clearly lacking and you have instead attributed arguments that are so extreme to myself and others, because you are too god damn dim to apply real life situations and have instead adopted a 'what if' dumbarse and moronic scenarios that could not exist in reality.
Well again on the real life case you present of women being charged with child abuse and child endangerment for doing things that harm or could have harmed their viable fetus, why not? Why is that unacceptable to you, but a women willing harming her viable fetus is to outlandish for you to believe possible.
I even linked an interview with one of the few doctors who perform late term procedures and she clearly states, she will not abort past 35 weeks because it is too close to term. She even clearly states, she will not do it at 35 weeks because it could be at 37 weeks since calculating the exact age is so difficult.
So then does your ethics consist of doctors telling you what is and is not right, and you don't have any ethics of your own on this? Why is it right for a doctor to say that a 35 week fetus can't be aborted, regardless if the women wants to abort it, but that say a 28 week one can be aborted? Worse when you say doctors can forbid a very late term abortion, your saying there are times when a women losses her rights to her body, that someone else, as long as a it a doctor (perhaps only female doctors) can strip pregnant women of their rights over their body, as long as they deem the fetus is old enough past viability.
The doctor who did do that is up on murder charges and rightly so.
Why? via the 'dry foot' model it would not be murder.
Did you even read why it is so rare? And why it is legal?
yes.
You do realise, the only person who has made the argument for eugenics has been you, right?
Not at all for when ever you say there is a medical exception on the part of the fetus that makes an abortion more acceptable
your making allowance for eugenics.
Do you think this is not something that is considered? Again, stop making crap up. If a woman is 24 weeks pregnant (the line of viability) and she cannot survive a c-section because she needs urgent life saving treatment, and for the foetus to survive, it needs to come out by a c-section... Which would you choose?
it could come out via induced labor then, both ways would be pretty risky for her, that would also account for an emergency abortion as well. Do you think forcibly stretching up her cervix, trusting in forceps, chopping up the baby and scraping everything out is that much better then a c-section, or removing the fetus completely intact? Frankly I don't think emergency abortions happen, it might be one of those hypothetical you disdain, but because it comes from you it is somehow acceptable to consider: Well again if having to kill it or her was the only options in this hypothetical you provided, other metrics beside viability would need to be considered,
those would generally side with killing it to safe her, these include consciousness, social value, ability to feel pain, etc, etc, now if c-sections or induce labor does not provide any greater risk to her then an 'emergency' abortion then viability would win out and do a c-section or induce labor instead to try to save the fetus
as well as her.
Well since you already established that if a woman is sick, then she just isn't worth that much to you, so we already know what you would pick if your "breeder" is ill.
This is your logic applied back to you: "Well you already established that a women can take her child to the grave with her if she wants, see we already know you hate children."
Because a foetus is not a person and viability does not always mean 'will survive'.
When is a fetus a person, if a fetus is not a person then that covers from embryo to moments before birth, not a person, but you say it would be murder if it's killed moments before birth, there for it IS a person, yet is still a fetus? So when is a fetus as person? From what I can surmise your ethics are that its when no doctor would perform an abortion it is a person, is that the arbitrary measure you use?
Your right, I had forgotten the level of perverts I was dealing with. For example, thus far I have been compared to a plethora of things and had the title of supporting murder of babies assigned to my name. Now here you are saying that I might as well give trolls a blow job because "gasp", I actually apply reality to my argument. Because it isn't sexist at all to tell a woman that when she deals with men like you, then I might as well just give trolls like you a blowjob. And you have the nerve to say that I should not show my disgust at the display of misogyny and just downright stupidity I have seen here?
If you think we are trolls, then no you should not, any time you recognize a trolls existence in any way, whether it to eschew there 'misogyny' or 'stupidity',
they win. The only way to stop a troll is to ignore a troll, no matter what they say.
Really, you sit there and wonder how to kill a woman and you are surprised that I react with disgust?
I was not wondering any such thing.
You fucking sit there and determine that if a woman is terminally ill, then she just isn't worth that much or worth considering and you expect me to just, well, get on my fucking knees and suck you off,
Again if I was a troll, then that is metaphorically what you have
already done by replying to me, and are continuing to do by replying to me. If you truly believe I'm a troll you need to stop reply to me and 'pleasing me'.
because if I find people like you offensive and disgusting, well, that's just giving you what you want, so I should just suck your dick right off the bat? I'll put it this way, I'd have rather have eaten the placenta.
Well then I recommend you eat placenta then.
I mean I could come up with all sorts of weird fantasies that cannot ever exist in reality to destroy another person's argument, but hey, reality is sick enough.
Killing a viable fetus in a later term abortion is not a weird fantasies that will never ever exist in reality, it happens in reality, is real, and not fantastical.
Why do you say 'men' then?
Well yes dumbass, which is why the midwife asked me if I wanted it. Did you notice I never said that no woman would want to eat her placenta? It was already established that some do. But again, it's much easier for you to lie than deal with reality, yes?
But you have said no women would want to kill her fetus right before it born, yet women do. Women kill it in late term abortions, women even kill it after it is born, but that time slot in between is somehow impossible psychological for ALL women, or somehow impossible to do because it's also psychological impossible for ALL doctors, therefor we don't need to consider the ethics of personhood if it starts in this 'impossible' time slot, is that what your saying?
1) So again the fetus before viable, not a person and can be aborted, not murder.
2) After viable, not a person you say, can be aborted, not murdered.
3) Right before birth, IMPOSSIBLE TO BE ABORTED THEREFOR NOT TO QUESTION HOW IT BECOMES A PERSON HERE, you say if indirectly.
4) Right after its is born a person, murder, you agree.
So for the first and last we agree, I have a few objections about the second but I generally agree, but the third...
Oh wow.. it just gets more stupid and more dishonest with more lying...
Exactly what am I lying about? And why can't I get a simple answer to a simple question: "can a women abort a viable fetus for what ever reason she wants? why or why not?"