POLL:What do you think the origin of UFOS is?

[chunkylover58]

Strange how when I ask you a simple question like, "How did you get to view this evidence and did you corroborate it with other credible sources," you resort to childish assumptions and personal attacks.

As for the whole deal with demons and witches and such: All of these things had some trigger that led to the embellishment into legend. Werewolfs were people going nuts and hallucinating from bread fungus, witches were victims of overly-imaginitive religious folk, many claim that"vampires" were often people who were afflicted with a blood disease known as porphyria which causes the gums to recede, extreme sensitivity to sunlight, and an overall pale, gaunt look. Stories were created to explain these things ... the scarier and more mystical the better. A friend once witnessed two men placing what appeared to be a body bag into the trunk of a car one dark, rainy night. Whether it was really a body bag with body or not, he was able to concoct a very nice story about the events leading up to and those following for a potential screenplay. None of it is true, it was simply based on something he saw and a story was created.

If someone sees something they can't explain, it is natural to make up a story. As this story is passed along, it becomes ever more embellished and more people believe it. Soon, people begin formalizing these embellishments into what are eventually called "credible sources" and the people who believe them are the ones who believe them anyway....People will pull similar observances and thoughts and discard the other, more logical elements because they don't fit, and the story becomes "universal" among those who choose to believe.

See: religion

 

[Unknown_user]

Strange how when I ask you a simple question like, "How did you get to view this evidence and did you corroborate it with other credible sources," you resort to childish assumptions and personal attacks.

Hey, take some of your own medicine.

You want credible evidence of a UFO. I got it!!! However, no one here is interested in it. Look down to my link NJ lights/UFO 2001. There was corroborating witnesses, radar data, video.

Yes, it is a UFO! Now, you can speculate that it is a flare or whatever, but not a one skeptic or official came out to say they are sure it was. So, therefore, this remains unidentified even after two years.

 

[VRob]

Chucky,

Are you going to respond to my recent post?

 

[chunkylover58]

Chucky,

Are you going to respond to my recent post?

You mean: Nobody is assuming or stating these objects were absolutely extraterrestial. However, these were not unidentified objects in the sky. Unless of course, you're wondering who built them, or who was piloting them. They were clearly identified, and I can assure you, they were not witches on broomsticks, or strange lights off in the distance. They were identified through video, radar, sightings from the ground. By very credible witnessess. In the Mexico city incidents, they've occured during daylight, and were eyewitnessed by 10's of thousands of people. Don't you find it strange that this has never been commented on by the US news?

They also performed manuever that our known technology cannot perform. ???/

You say they were "identified......" As what, exactly?

 

[craterchains (Norval]

No, just as you see here in these forums, any evidence gets the cold shoulder and it didn’t happen. If it’s not on CNN and coming from a White Horse Souse it didn’t happen. To any body that has done even the basic research of UFO’s, ETI, and so on it is very apparent that there is on hell of a major cover-up and misinformation campaign going on. Throw 50 dice down and when they all come up sixes in a row I may listen that CS crater chains are caused by something natural. Till then I will affirm and state that these are weapons that have been used in our solar system. Yes, it probably took spacecraft to do these crater chains. So another affirmation of evidence of UFO’s that isn’t ever gonna make the 6 o’clock news.

 

[chunkylover58]

Picture a meteor coming through the atmosphere at a low trajectory. As it hit the surface, would it not sort of skip like a stone on a lake? Would this not cause a crater chain? Especially if the planet or moon's surface was somewhat soft and molten when it hit, perhaps in its early stages of formation?

 

[craterchains (Norval]

What can I say?

 

[chunkylover58]

By the way, I happen to be a participant in setiathome. Wonder why their sensitive recording devices haven't picked up any alien signals? Hell, they get thrown off by a washing machine or a microwave, why wouldn't a strong, foreign signal right here in our own back yard tip them off?

 

[chunkylover58]

Yes, it probably took spacecraft to do these crater chains. So another affirmation of evidence of UFO’s that isn’t ever gonna make the 6 o’clock news.

How can you use "probably" and "affirmation" in the the same statement concerning the same subject?

 

[VRob]

You say they were "identified......" As what, exactly?

So Chucky, Are you telling me that you're commenting on this subject here and you have never heard of, or seen the video/photo's, eyewitness testimonials, of the Belgian or Mexico City incidents???

If this is the case, then you are precisely what I was referring to when I used the term ignorant.

 

[chunkylover58]

All I asked was, as what they were identified. Was a public statement made by a reputable source of information that these were, indeed, alien spacecraft? Or just a bunch of people who witnessed a radar blip or a blob of light do something weird?
Everything I've seen about the Belgian icident goes on and on about what the object was NOT! I couldn't care less about what it was NOT .... What WAS it?

Plus, you would think that a race of beings so capable of interplanetary travel would have eventually figured away around the need for headlights on their vehicles.

 

[VRob]

Chucky,

The only thing unidentifiable about the objects, was who was piloting them, and who/where they were manufactured. From our limited knowledge of things we can disertain this:

1. There was a solid object of approximate size at a specific location in the sky.
2. It was seen from the ground, on video, on photos, on radar, via the air from other pilots.
3. The Mexico city incident was in broad daylight, it was a shinny silver disk that appeared to be spinning on its axis.

What more information do you need?

Can you please answer me one simple question? Have you ever heard of these 2 incidents?

 

[chunkylover58]

Doesn't matter whether or not I have heard of either incidents. Are you completely knowlegeable about every other possible thing it could NOT be to lead to the conclusion that it's ET? If not, then you are just as ignorant. I researched the Belgian one because of this thread. The only sites I found that stated it as true were site devoted purely to UFOs and psi. None were from any authoritative, disinterested source. I did find this that you may find interesting. Of course, you'll probably poo poo it: http://membres.lycos.fr/marchallet/BelgianUFO.htm

Can you answer me a simple question? How do any of those 3 statements you list make any sort of conclusion that the object was not of this world? Again, the simple truth is that just because it's unidentified does not mean it's unidentifiable.

 

[VRob]

Chucky,

Where did I ever state that these objects were emphatically 'from out of this world'?

Chucky, the fact that you had never heard of either of these incidents, tells me you know very little about the subject you are attacking. I do not view each individual incident, and state any conclusions. I've reasearched this subject for the last 25 years. When you've analyzed how the military/intelligence community has dealt with this subject over the years, you'd have to be blind and deaf to conclude there's nothing going on. Conversely, large numbers of credible eyewitness(Military officers, pilots, politicians,) who have gone on and off the record, stating that the subject is real, and is taken very seriously at the highest levels.

I have spoken to a former high ranking NASA employee who stated to me that he'd never go on record with his statement, but the craft are real, and are not manufactured from our society(Earth).

You need to think for yourself, and put ALL the evidence together.

 

[VRob]

Can you answer me a simple question? How do any of those 3 statements you list make any sort of conclusion that the object was not of this world? Again, the simple truth is that just because it's unidentified does not mean it's unidentifiable.

WHAT is unidentified? AND who said anything about something being unidentifiable? What are you trying to say here?

 

[chunkylover58]

You keep saying it is identified, but you do not identify it as anything in particular. "Real" doesn't mean anything. Everything you can see hear or touch is "real." What IS it? What are these statemnets by these pilots and officers and politicians (reliable sources if I ever saw any)? "I saw something strange and I don't know what it is." "Uh...yeah, I saw it, too. I don't know what it was, but it certainly was weird, and definitely real."

I'm not attacking the veracity of the incidents. I'm sure those people saw SOMEthing. However, keeping with the theme of this post, you have given no evidence or clear indication of WHAT the something was, certainly no evidence of ET (again, the theme of this post. If you want to propose another possibility, perhaps another thread topic is in order?) It's not my purpose to disprove your assertations. The burden of proof is on you.

 

[VRob]

Chucky,

I don't have the time or energy to educate you on everything I've learned on this subject over the past 25 years. I suppose I could post the major issues, and give you an overview of the important details, but frankly, I don't think it's worth the effort. The reason I say this is cause you came in here attacking a subject you know NOTHING about. I find this very perplexing.

Why would someone attack a subject, and people involved in a subject when they know absolutely nothing about it?? If you can give me an answer to this question, I might reconsider.

 

[Unknown_user]

The burden of proof is on you.

Chunky, I think you can grasp the main point of the conversation which is that although nothing is conclusive at this point, there does seem to be visitations here which were and are kept under wraps.

It is impossible to apply a scientific method of research under these circumstances.

What needs to be done is some real investigation by sources other than the government and idiot UFOologists like Dr. Greer. He singlehandedly discredited many credible witnesses by attaching his name to them and bringing in obvious freaks that had no proof. Then, after a little research, we find out that he sells UFO sighting kits and takes people out to find UFOs.

Therefore, there needs to be a credible UFO sighting investigator and doubt that will happen. Think about it Chunky, when was the last time you saw the NASA shuttle fly overhead with your own eyes. I never have. Maybe that doesn't exist either.

 

[chunkylover58]

I attacked nothing. I merely made a completely reasonable statement that just because someone sees something they can't identify, does not mean it's alien in nature. That is all. I'm seeking corpus delecti.

 

[chunkylover58]

Boulder, Colorado. August 2001....Could have been the space lab, but it was going in the right trajectory and was late in the evening before the shuttle landed the next morning in Califorinia.