Osama Bin Laden is Dead

[Gustav]

yes well for a long time now i have been calling for the fall of the US backed, whabbist,house of saud which indeed houses the biggest female prison on earth .... As they are the epicentre of international terrorism

nonsense

pakistan epicenter of terrorism
About 308,000 results (0.33 seconds)

VS

saudi arabia epicenter of terrorism
About 208,000 results (0.27 seconds)

/giggle

 

[CptBork]

One thing I haven't been able to find out: okay so they were in such a gawd awful hurry to dispose of Osama's body at sea, but what did they do with the bodies of his son Hamza and his anonymous wife?

Not sure about the wife yet, but I hear they made a bong from Hamza's skull and it's presently making the rounds.

 

[S.A.M.]

Not sure about the wife yet, but I hear they made a bong from Hamza's skull and it's presently making the rounds.

And the rest of his body?

Found an amazingly un woo-woo article on Osama ID here:

U.S. officials have told various news sources that CIA facial-recognition technology was used to identify bin Laden, and that his wife – apparently also killed in the attack – called him by name during the firefight that ended his life.

But they say that DNA was the final piece of evidence.

Rep. Mike Rogers, R-Mich., chairman of the House Intelligence Committee told the AP that more than one DNA sample was used to identify bin Laden.

One problem – whose DNA did they compare it to?

According to several reports, U.S. intelligence experts have been collecting DNA from Osama’s many relatives for years. Hospital officials in Boston have been unable to confirm reports that one source of DNA was bin Laden’s half-sister, who allegedly died of brain cancer at a Harvard-affiliated hospital.

Bin Laden had plenty of half-brothers and half-sisters to offer DNA samples. He was the 17th child of Mohammed bin Awad bin Laden, who had 54 children with 22 wives. Bin Laden’s father died when he was 10.

The FBI has lots of ways to use DNA fingerprinting to identify culprits.

It can be done in hours using what is called PCR, or polymerase chain reaction, to amplify the tiny bits of DNA and then look for a specific part of the genetic code called short tandem repeats.

Although human beings share 99.9 percent of their DNA, these short tandem repeats, or STRs, tend to be very different from one person to another. The United States uses an agreed-upon set of 13 places for STRs in the genome, and the odds that two individuals will have the same DNA profile are about one in a billion, according to the Energy Department lab taking part in the Human Genome Project.

But does the government have earlier DNA that, for certain, came from bin Laden? Not likely, and so the next-best source is a sibling.

And in that case, says Stephen Quake, a Howard Hughes Medical Institute professor of applied physics and bioengineering at Stanford University, all the DNA analysis will say for sure is that the dead person is one of the many sons of Osama bin Laden’s father.

One factor could make things easier: Osama bin Laden was the only child whom his mother, Alia Ghanem, had with his father. That could make it easier to triangulate any tissue samples with samples from half-siblings.

It is not an exact science, however. DNA was used to establish that Thomas Jefferson was related to the descendants of his former slave, Sally Hemings. In that case the Y chromosome, which is passed down with very little change from father to son over the generations, was used. But all that the DNA indicated in the end was that descendants of Jefferson’s paternal uncle have the same Y chromosome as a male-line descendant of Eston Hemings, the youngest son of Sally Hemings. The research could never finger Jefferson individually with complete accuracy.

“You are still dealing with probabilities,” Quake said.

The best bet, Quake said, will be whole-genome analysis, which takes a week or more using current technology and will produce a complete map of the corpse’s DNA.

“They got the sample, Quake said. “They can take as much time as they want to do the analysis.”

If bin Laden’s mother, now known as Hamida al-Attas, could be persuaded to give some of her DNA, that might provide compelling evidence. She was last reported to be living in Saudi Arabia, and ABC News reported that U.S. officials had asked bin Laden’s relatives for DNA samples after they thought they might have killed him in a missile strike last February.

The White House says that bin Laden was buried at sea. One can only hope they kept some tissue and blood samples to back up the DNA claims.

http://www.nationaljournal.com/tech/did-dna-finger-bin-laden--20110502

So there you go, it can be proved if it was Osama's bod or not.

 

[keith1]

i'd kind of like a view from googleearth of the compound if someone has the coordinates.

34.169470, 73.242600

 

[CptBork]

So there you go, it can be proved if it was Osama's bod or not.

Yeah, I'm already imagining all the excuses you would make even if you saw a photo with all the relevant DNA markers. Something like "I still need to taste his blood to make sure he was actually killed when they said they killed him." Then we provide a sample, and the next complaint will be "If you supposedly shot him as you said, how come I can't taste any lead?"

 

[S.A.M.]

Yeah, I'm already imagining all the excuses you would make even if you saw a photo with all the relevant DNA markers. Something like "I still need to taste his blood to make sure he was actually killed when they said they killed him." Then we provide a sample, and the next complaint will be "If you supposedly shot him as you said, how come I can't taste any lead?"

You're probably right. I need for things to at least make sense. Just now reading that article above I thought of a few things

1. If Osama is the only child his mother had with his father, then of the 50 plus siblings only the brothers would share his fathers genes with him [Y chromosome] - so do they have any DNA samples from his brothers? Also what about his first cousins and second cousins? Won't the male cousins also carry similar Y chromosome genes?

2. One of the half siblings whose DNA was used by the US for comparison was that of his half sister who died of cancer. Apparently they used her brain tissue for the DNA [strange but true, the CIA has access to Osama's half sisters brain tissues]

But this is bizarre. The half sister could obviously not share Y chromosome genes from his father [hint hint sister = x chromosomes] and her mother was clearly unrelated - so what does the comparison show?

3. If they have no prior DNA sample from OBL himself, its going to be darned difficult to use DNA as evidence of his identity

 

[CptBork]

You're probably right. I need for things to at least make sense.

Yes, you need them to make sense in a certain way that fits with a certain worldview and outlook. That's pretty obvious.

1. If Osama is the only child his mother had with his father, then of the 50 plus siblings only the brothers would share his fathers genes with him [Y chromosome] - so do they have any DNA samples from his brothers? Also what about his first cousins and second cousins? Won't the male cousins also carry similar Y chromosome genes?

2. One of the half siblings whose DNA was used by the US for comparison was that of his half sister who died of cancer. Apparently they used her brain tissue for the DNA [strange but true, the CIA has access to Osama's half sisters brain tissues]

But this is bizarre. The half sister could obviously not share Y chromosome genes from his father [hint hint sister = x chromosomes] and her mother was clearly unrelated - so what does the comparison show?

The Y chromosome is great to look at for comparisons to the father, but it's not the only way of doing it. And I thought biology was supposedly your specialty?

 

[S.A.M.]

Yes, you need them to make sense in a certain way that fits with a certain worldview and outlook. That's pretty obvious.

The Y chromosome is great to look at for comparisons to the father, but it's not the only way of doing it. And I thought biology was supposedly your specialty?

Hence I asked if they had samples from any of his brothers or uncles. The ones from his half sisters don't count [since they do not have a sample of his fathers DNA and he has no siblings who share both his parental DNA, I presume. Theoretically they could find half sibling index markers which are high but his mother was Syrian-Palestinian so the common markers would still be on the fathers side and probably, with all the first cousin marriages, highly conflated with regional gene pool markers ] and I don't know if they have any from his mother. Since they did the test in a day, it would have to be accelerated PCR. So what did they use for comparison?

edit: I am going by the 15 STR and one amelogenin comparison test which is standard. I don't have any details of the tests conducted by the US

 

[CptBork]

That's the thing that gets me. If he's so bloody innocent, he didn't act like it. And if he wants to lend his star power to the war against the U.S., or Western colonialism, or the infidels, or whatever, I just don't think you can reasonably start your consideration of Osama bin Laden with such a wide-eyed blank slate.

If all the guilty folks just argue about who's more guilty, it doesn't mean any one of them is actually innocent.

The point is moot anyhow- if OBL did what he's accused of doing and there was never any question of it, I can't see why SAM wouldn't approve of it and justify it all the same.

 

[CptBork]

Hence I asked if they had samples from any of his brothers or uncles. The ones from his half sisters don't count and I don't know if they have any from his mother. Since they did the test in a day, it would have to be accelerated PCR. So what did they use for comparison?

Why don't you fly out to the USS Carl Vinson and tell us yourself?

 

[S.A.M.]

Why don't you fly out to the USS Carl Vinson and tell us yourself?

Is that where the test was done?

 

[Bells]

You're probably right. I need for things to at least make sense. Just now reading that article above I thought of a few things

1. If Osama is the only child his mother had with his father, then of the 50 plus siblings only the brothers would share his fathers genes with him [Y chromosome] - so do they have any DNA samples from his brothers? Also what about his first cousins and second cousins? Won't the male cousins also carry similar Y chromosome genes?

2. One of the half siblings whose DNA was used by the US for comparison was that of his half sister who died of cancer. Apparently they used her brain tissue for the DNA [strange but true, the CIA has access to Osama's half sisters brain tissues]

But this is bizarre. The half sister could obviously not share Y chromosome genes from his father [hint hint sister = x chromosomes] and her mother was clearly unrelated - so what does the comparison show?

3. If they have no prior DNA sample from OBL himself, its going to be darned difficult to use DNA as evidence of his identity

They probably had his son's. They could probably have managed to get a sample from his son when they offered him asylum when said son escaped his father's madness.

Plus they also had the DNA of his other son who also died, as well as probably being able to collect samples from his other children who were living in the compound.

 

[S.A.M.]

They probably had his son's. They could probably have managed to get a sample from his son when they offered him asylum when said son escaped his father's madness.

Plus they also had the DNA of his other son who also died, as well as probably being able to collect samples from his other children who were living in the compound.

Yes, which is why I wondered what they did with the bodies in the compound. I wonder if they will publish their findings

It also depends on which test was conducted. Generally the test for genealogical paternity tests for STRs on the Y chromosome

A man's patrilineal ancestry, or male-line ancestry, can be traced using the DNA on his Y chromosome (Y-DNA) through Y-STR testing. This is useful because the Y chromosome passes down almost unchanged from father to son, ie, the non recombining and sex determining regions of the Y chromosome do not change. A man's test results are compared to another man's results to determine the time frame in which the two individuals shared a most recent common ancestor or MRCA. If their test results are a perfect, or nearly perfect match, they are related within genealogy's time frame.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genealogical_DNA_test#Y_chromosome_.28Y-DNA.29_testing

 

[Zakariya04]

nonsense

pakistan epicenter of terrorism
About 308,000 results (0.33 seconds)

VS

saudi arabia epicenter of terrorism
About 208,000 results (0.27 seconds)

/giggle

not sure what this means gustavs

 

[YoYoPapaya]

I think it means he made a google search on those keywords.

 

[Captain Kremmen]

If he turns up in a new video in two months time, Obama is screwed.

 

[Billy T]

If he turns up in a new video in two months time, Obama is screwed.

Years ago a Chicago news paper, trying to beat others to the street, had front page banner headline that stated:
Dewey Wins But in fact Truman had won in a close election when the slower to come in rural results from his "whistle stop" train trip campaign efforts came in.

Perhaps OBL, like newspapers waiting for one of two events to become reality has made two videos:

One tells how the US is falling apart - even with budget tricks that extended the shut down of government for a

 

[The Esotericist]

Thanks for the timeline. If OBL was dead, then Bush's loss of interest makes sense, but why wouldn't he claim the credit for it? Why pretend he was still there? That makes no sense.

Oh, it makes perfect sense.

The short answer? So the elites can see Obama re-elected.

He was built up as the mastermind of 9/11 and the whole reason for the war in Afghanistan. At that point, they wanted to continue the war there, and they had no intention or desire to extricate themselves from the bloody gawd awful mess that they had created there.

The situation on the ground has changed. For the past couple years there has now been talk about exit strategies. In more conservative circles, this meets with resistance.

On top of this, the knowledge of his death is a relative state secret. If you accept that her concrete knowledge of his death and the circumstances of it were a major reason for her assassination, and if you look at her resistance to accept the west's interference in Pakistani affairs in going after someone who was already dead in the rapid "war on terror," a sort of, "we'll play our part in the war on terror our way," rather than being a client state, things seem to become more clear.

With election season starting here in the U.S., Obama's using this manufactured event, and the "revealing" of this state secret makes total sense. There isn't a whole lot the conservatives can do about it. Although they know it is a bunch of hogwash, if they say anything, they would end up looking like the den of vipers that they are. Using a dead man as a boogie man to instill fear into the American populace during the whole war on terror as a way to run elections and control the populace though use of terror alerts was very effective.

What it really comes down to is the financial and cultural elites that run both parties. They want Obama in office another four years. The days of one term presidents are over. Those will only be back when the people of the U.S. actually manage to elect men and women that weren't intended to be their overlords, candidates that weren't first choices of TPTB.

If this doesn't boost him in the polls enough? I wouldn't be surprised if we saw Obama presiding over a peace settlement in the middle east that saw the creation of a two state "solution." I use the word "solution," reservedly, because it would be a solution, only about as much as Hitler's final solution was a solution. For surely the political elites and upper classes in Palestinian society will sell the poorest among the common folk down the river.

The media, both the right and the left, will do what ever they can to make this guy look like a champ. Even after the conservatives took the house b/c the American people were pissed that they rammed through health care against our wishes. . . they STILL aren't listening.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8TwRmX6zs4&feature=player_embedded

This is their ultimate puppet to create world government and the world feudal state. When this is over we will have a world credit and banking system that you will have to buy into if you want to eat, buy clothes, and have a roof over your head. They want to destroy Islamic banking and ostensibly, all other forms of money and credit creation. Although I don't believe in the dogma of any religion, I do believe the original Christian doctrines, and the Islamic doctrines had it right on, usury is immoral. If you have something extra and you can help your fellow man, you should do so and not make a profit off another person's want or need. Humanity should work together. When we don't, what we get is friction and war.

These elites would have us all slaves. That is their end game. Islamic banking is superior.
http://www.puppet99.com/?p=218

 

[CptBork]

That's just straying soooooo damn far from the topic... But yeah if you're gonna rant about the banking system and how much you hate paying interest, I have some advice: find someone who will willingly loan you money without interest, or else simply refrain from borrowing. You want a cigarette and no one has one to spare? That's your problem.

 

[CptBork]

If he turns up in a new video in two months time, Obama is screwed.

I'm sure he'll be in at least a dozen music videos, maybe he'll have a digitally altered cameo in the next Forrest Gump movie, like they did in the first one with JFK. They shot him in the head, so that rules out his return as a zombie.