New Muslims

Ah the beauty of the Quran!

Chapter(4) Verse "56" In the name of Allah most Gracious most Mercieful lo!Those who disbelieve Our revelations, We shall expose them to the fire. As often as their skins are consumed We shall exchange them for fresh skins that they may taste the torment. Lo! Allah is ever Mighty, Wise. Allah The Great indeed spoke the truth.


So tolerant to other faiths.

002.256/7
YUSUFALI: Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.
Allah is the Protector of those who have faith: from the depths of darkness He will lead them forth into light. Of those who reject faith the patrons are the evil ones: from light they will lead them forth into the depths of darkness. They will be companions of the fire, to dwell therein (For ever).


The problem is that any faith which claims to be the truth must by definition claim all other faiths false.

These false faiths can only be the work of the devil and so all disbelievers (that's people who have rejected the faith, not those who have never heard it) must be evil and worthy only of Hell.

I can't help thinking this kind of logic is a form of insanity.
 
The only Muslims I have known were Sufis, and they believe there is some truth to be found in all (or at least most) religions.

Partly because of my experiences with them, I count myself as a Muslim, though I also count myself as a Buddhist, Daoist, and Christian.
 
marv said:
Most American "converts" to Islam are behind bars for violent crimes! I wonder why
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Many of the people who embrace Islam in prison are cursed by society and condemned for crimes (such as drugs or theft), however when they lose all hope in people, they gain hope in Allah swt and upon learning the truth of Islam and the mercy of Allah swt they embrace the beloved religion and dedicate themselves to piety. Islam is a dynamic religion and can change the most criminal people into the most pious with the words of Allah swt. You will see among the converts of Islam in prisons are the strongest, most loyal, and completely changed men you will ever meet.

Igor Trip said:
These false faiths can only be the work of the devil and so all disbelievers (that's people who have rejected the faith, not those who have never heard it) must be evil and worthy only of Hell.
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Wrong, we don't believe this as black and white as you put it. In Islam, we believe each nation had a prophet and that every people were sent Islam before the advant of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (s). The old religion of Islam had been changed and lost its meaning in its current forms, this is why the Prophet Muhammad (s) was sent to humanity to preach the one true religion and the glorious Quran for all of humanity.

It's Allah swt's will who goes to where in the afterlife. It is not correct to even say this one Muslim is going to Paradise, because he might not be. It's all up to Allah swt.

Finsnuffle said:
The only Muslims I have known were Sufis, and they believe there is some truth to be found in all (or at least most) religions.

Partly because of my experiences with them, I count myself as a Muslim, though I also count myself as a Buddhist, Daoist, and Christian.
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That's nice. Those who we consider Sufi are the great scholars of Islam and that the majority of Muslims believe there are many truths in other religions. We might not accept them as absolute truth, but there are many great teachings in other religions which can serve the betterment of humanity, however as Muslims we believe Islam is the best way of life.

Peace.
 
DiamondHearts said:
Wrong, we don't believe this as black and white as you put it. In Islam, we believe each nation had a prophet and that every people were sent Islam before the advant of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (s). The old religion of Islam had been changed and lost its meaning in its current forms, this is why the Prophet Muhammad (s) was sent to humanity to preach the one true religion and the glorious Quran for all of humanity.

It's Allah swt's will who goes to where in the afterlife. It is not correct to even say this one Muslim is going to Paradise, because he might not be. It's all up to Allah swt.
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So I quote the verse again.

Chapter(4) Verse "56" In the name of Allah most Gracious most Mercieful lo!Those who disbelieve Our revelations, We shall expose them to the fire. As often as their skins are consumed We shall exchange them for fresh skins that they may taste the torment. Lo! Allah is ever Mighty, Wise. Allah The Great indeed spoke the truth.


I did say it only applied to those who had rejected the faith.

There are no 'ifs' or 'buts' in that verse.
 
That is words tainted from am imperfect prophet. God is just and that doesn't sound just to me. I will not believe in a God that condones such torture for such an action. That God, I will reject and torture him through my words just as he tortures others senselessly. The God I believe in wouldn't allow such an atrocity. That is not merciful.
 
Surah 4, An-Nisa, The Women

51. Hast thou not turned Thy vision to those who were given a portion of the Book? they believe in sorcery and Evil, and say to the Unbelievers that they are better guided in the (right) way Than the believers!

52. They are (men) whom Allah hath cursed: And those whom Allah Hath cursed, thou wilt find, have no one to help.

53. Have they a share in dominion or power? Behold, they give not a farthing to their fellow-men?

54. Or do they envy mankind for what Allah hath given them of his bounty? but We had already given the people of Abraham the Book and Wisdom, and conferred upon them a great kingdom.

55. Some of them believed, and some of them averted their faces from him: And enough is Hell for a burning fire.

56. Those who reject our Signs, We shall soon cast into the Fire: as often as their skins are roasted through, We shall change them for fresh skins, that they may taste the penalty: for Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise.

57. But those who believe and do deeds of righteousness, We shall soon admit to Gardens, with rivers flowing beneath,- their eternal home: Therein shall they have companions pure and holy: We shall admit them to shades, cool and ever deepening.

These are the words of Allah swt relating to belief or disbelief. Islam teaches that believers will obtain Paradise, and Disbelievers a penalty. This however is provided that these people 1. know the truth of Islam and its major teachings, 2. Information of Islam is readily available, or 3. Have a chance to embrace Islam but reject it of their own will.

In the end, it is Allah swt who will decide who goes where. It is not proper for any human being to say where a person will end up in the Afterlife.

The Holy Prophet Muhammad (s), said, 'One day a prostitute walked by a well and saw a hungry dog, she took of her shoe and filled it with water for the dog. Because of her kindness to the dog, Allah swt blessed her with eternal Paradise and forgave all her sins.'

Never underestimate the Mercy and Love of Allah swt. Do not outright reject Allah swt, because if you do, He will do the same to you.

Allah swt says in Hadith Qudsi, 'My servant who has forgotten Me in this life ( denied Allah swt his respect and belief), I will forget Him on the Day of Judgement.'

Peace.
 
usp8riot said:
That is words tainted from am imperfect prophet. God is just and that doesn't sound just to me. I will not believe in a God that condones such torture for such an action. That God, I will reject and torture him through my words just as he tortures others senselessly. The God I believe in wouldn't allow such an atrocity. That is not merciful.
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i hate to break this to you, but the G-d of abraham, isaac, and ismael was a very vengeful being.

i am jewish and i can admit that diamondhearts is not wrong in these arguments. what is your problem, usp8triot?
 
What Is The Purpose Of Life ?

They say that a fool lives to eat and a wise man eats to live. But then the question remains: for what purpose does the wise man live? Living is not an end by itself. There has to be a purpose for man to live for. So what is this purpose? ...

Why Islam?

Islam is not a new religion; it is not a different religion. It is in essence the same religion that Allah (or “God”) sent to all mankind through all His prophets at different times in history - the religion that had unfortunately been changed through human adulterations, theology and philosophy. That is why the Prophet Muhammad came as the last and final prophet and messenger of Allah. He needed to come to remove all the riddles and confusion in the lives of people. He corrected matters of diversion in belief that were introduced by confusing human philosophy and theology. He restored the pure monotheistic belief of our Creator and brought the most perfect and most noble understanding of Allah (or “God”).

The purpose of life is to know Allah, to believe in Him and to worship Him according to how He wants to be worshipped, this includes that we live our lives according to His commands. In the Quran, Allah tells us that since the messages of all prophets before the Prophet Muhammad have been distorted, none of these objectives could be achieved correctly except through His last and final message, and therefore He will judge people on the Day of Judgment based on whether they believed and followed Islam.

http://www.beconvinced.com/en/article.php?articleid=0166&subcatname=Selected Articles
 
DiamondHearts said:
Surah 4, An-Nisa, The Women

56. Those who reject our Signs, We shall soon cast into the Fire:
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What signs?

Your entire religion comes down to the word of just one man!

That’s it!

Why should I or any intelligent person, believe him and at the same time reject everyone else?

The idea that God was incapable of keeping his message uncorrupted through out history and so a final prophet is needed to correct all the errors, is farcical.

The truth is not obvious. If you think so then you have never read up on Quantum physics or General Relativity.

Truth needs to be explained and proven properly.

Simply promising Paradise for believers and Hell for unbelievers is simply appealing to peoples most base instincts.
 
DiamondHearts said:
What Is The Purpose Of Life ?
That is why the Prophet Muhammad came as the last and final prophet and messenger of Allah. He needed to come to remove all the riddles and confusion in the lives of people.
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In that case he failed miserably.

One of the first things to happen after Muhammad’s death was a civil war which still splits Islam to this day.

If Muslims can’t agree then the message can’t be that clear.
 
Religion is like a virus in the human host. Islam in particular is popular because it satisfies the doubt and uncertainty inherent in a self-conscious being while allowing full expression of aggressive tendencies.
 
"I have heard that Islam is the fastest religion in the world and even America"

'Fraid not Chuckles, its Buhdism, or some religion from around there
 
Igor Trip said:
What signs?

Your entire religion comes down to the word of just one man!

That’s it!

Why should I or any intelligent person, believe him and at the same time reject everyone else?

The idea that God was incapable of keeping his message uncorrupted through out history and so a final prophet is needed to correct all the errors, is farcical.

The truth is not obvious. If you think so then you have never read up on Quantum physics or General Relativity.

Truth needs to be explained and proven properly.

Simply promising Paradise for believers and Hell for unbelievers is simply appealing to peoples most base instincts.
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The Quran is an entire book which teaches the revelations of Allah swt to the people. Paradise and Hell are just one of the teachings of Islam. I suggest you read more about Islam.

A quick website for learning the basics of Islam can be found here:

I SUGGEST EVERYONE PLEASE LOOK AT THIS WEBSITE BEFORE POSTING FURTHER.

http://www.islam-guide.com/

Peace.
 
some of us have studied, but may be not every aspect of the quran, however there are athiest ex-muslims on this site that contradict you, such as statements like this from here, http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?p=1027992#post1027992 when ask "muslims what do they offer".
"nothing never have, although they do like to take credit for a lot." and this "I was one of these muslims, born in turkey brought up in england from the age of five, we were fed this junk from day one, muslims are the best, mohammed is the best, allah is the best etc, anything they could take credit for they did, we had the first written language, we were the first astronomers, the first in mathmatics etc, we were even told our religion came before hebrew and christianity, yes the are some scholarly muslims, yes we may of developed somethings for the better but theres is not much if anything we've actually invented." your link starts with how scientific the muslims are and how fantastic they are, etc etc...
makes you want to puke. mind you the xians are just as bad, they all love to self praise.
 
DiamondHearts said:
The Quran is an entire book which teaches the revelations of Allah swt to the people. Paradise and Hell are just one of the teachings of Islam. I suggest you read more about Islam.

A quick website for learning the basics of Islam can be found here:

I SUGGEST EVERYONE PLEASE LOOK AT THIS WEBSITE BEFORE POSTING FURTHER.

http://www.islam-guide.com/

Peace.
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DH, as we are going to be spending a lot longer dead than alive, I rather think that heaven and hell are very important.


I have been to two Muslim countries and I loved the people and the culture.

I have also read the Qur’an. I was not impressed.

All religions teach people to be good, but so will their mother and the people around them.

The problem is that religions like Islam introduce an extra barrier between people which can lead to conflict.
 
geeser said:
some of us have studied, but may be not every aspect of the quran, however there are athiest ex-muslims on this site that contradict you, such as statements like this from here, http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?p=1027992#post1027992 when ask "muslims what do they offer".
"nothing never have, although they do like to take credit for a lot." and this "I was one of these muslims, born in turkey brought up in england from the age of five, we were fed this junk from day one, muslims are the best, mohammed is the best, allah is the best etc, anything they could take credit for they did, we had the first written language, we were the first astronomers, the first in mathmatics etc, we were even told our religion came before hebrew and christianity, yes the are some scholarly muslims, yes we may of developed somethings for the better but theres is not much if anything we've actually invented." your link starts with how scientific the muslims are and how fantastic they are, etc etc...
makes you want to puke. mind you the xians are just as bad, they all love to self praise.
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It is wrong to deny that Muslims have not contributed to anything to the world, please I suggest you read on both the primary scholars of Algebra and Chemistry (Al Khwarizmi, Ibn Sina, Jabir ibn Hayan, Al Farghani) Muslim scientists who have laid the foundation for the Western renaissance and scientific achievement. In the era of Islamic golden age, Muslim scientists were the most intelligent and knwoeldgeable scientists in the world. Even today, many of the primary medicial professors in many fields are Muslims, among them the top Brain surgeon in the world (Irani) who practices in New York.

Peace.
 
Yes Islams have contributed here's part of their contributions;

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click

click

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yea! they have contributed allright, and unfortunately these fucking bastards are still contributing! :bugeye:

Godless
 
So does anyone here live in a Western nation and has Muslim friends, family, or neighbors which they would like to talk about?
 
yes me, but everyone muslim I talk to spouts the same inane rubbish as you, their all so far up there own arses, they cant see the truth, for the s**t.
islam is just as irrational as any other religion, it's about time you woke up and smelt the rosies.
 
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