Name a god - how many can we find

Your assertion was that since there are so many names of so many different gods, that these are all versions of the one 'god.' I find this to be a bigoted statement, since gods are created by so many cultures with many diverse qualities. To say that this reflects your god is to ignore the cultural validity of others. My criticism is fair. If you don't like it, feel free to refute or ignore as you see fit.

This is not fair, it is not his god he is talking about, the teaching that all gods are manifestations of the one god is vedic in origin and occurs throughout Hinduism. This has been lived in practise by such teachers as Rama Krishna. There is nothing new about this and indeed this idea predates most modern and many ancient cultures.


It seems strange that when religions proclaim their truth at the expense of all others it is called bigoted, yet when religions allow the truths of others to exist in harmony you call this bigoted as well. It seems you have set up a catch 22 here. The only bigoted view here is yours which is apparently voicing opposition to tolerance within religion just to further your on personal opinion!!



I for one agree that all gods are manifestations of the one god. They are god as people are able to comprehend god.
 
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No. The bigoted view here is in reducing the thousands of versions (many of them vastly different and contradictory) to a single god of a single cult for the sole apparent reason that a member of this cult can't bear that others might not believe *his* god. What a crock.

I criticized it also as convenient, because it is. When trying to assert that you have a god, which cannot be demonstrated to begin with, the claimant then goes on to say, "by the way, all the gods that have ever been, including your own gods, are just my god anyway." Its a convenient argument, but won't wash among free thinkers using critical thought.

I will defend to the end *any* religious adherent's right to believe what he/she wants to believe with regard to god(s); but I also reserve the right to criticize to the end that same adherents public position on his/her god(s). If its bunk, its bunk.

Vitalone clings to the fallacy that since my god hasn't been disproved by science, he must exist. An argument of personal incredulity if I've ever heard one.

LightG. goes on ad infinitum about the "thousands of names of god" as if there's any reason to accept that *his* god is genuine to begin with, making comparisons with a "thousand names for water," a substance with very definite, testable characteristics. Something no god has. Many gods have contradictory characteristics, consistent with fiction invented by men. His specialty is tautology and straw man arguments, where he creates arguments he can try to knock down with double-speak but mostly arguments that support themselves by their own argument. For him, perhaps it is necessary to show that all the gods of humanity -extant as well as extinct- are but the same god (his), for if it were possible for man to invent many gods that weren't, that creates the possibility that LightG's god is also fiction. Which it probably is.
 
No. The bigoted view here is in reducing the thousands of versions (many of them vastly different and contradictory) to a single god of a single cult .

It’s not a single god of a single cult, its god per se, regardless all of human definitions and conceptions.


I criticized it also as convenient, because it is. When trying to assert that you have a god, which cannot be demonstrated to begin with, the claimant then goes on to say, "by the way, all the gods that have ever been, including your own gods, are just my god anyway." .

That is not the case, it is not ‘my god’, it is just god. The many gods are due to people having to identify with god in this way, but higher appreciations of god do not need form, attributes or even definitions for god. This is not to say it is a different god, just a different understanding of god. God without form or attributes is called brahman nirguna in Hinduism.

Please take a few minutes to read the short article in this link, it is about a slightly different subject but I think it explains the different levels of comprehension of god quite well.

http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/teachers/creation_benjamin.htm


I will defend to the end *any* religious adherent's right to believe what he/she wants to believe with regard to god(s); but I also reserve the right to criticize .

And I would also defend the same right plus the right of anyone not to believe. I will though (as you) still argue my case and criticise others where I see fit.


Its a convenient argument, but won't wash among free thinkers using critical thought. .


Hhmm…. free thinkers. Now does your use of the term free thinkers preclude anyone with a religious or spiritual belief. It would seem that it does. What about those of us who are free thinkers within religion i.e. we do not adhere solely to one particular religion but still have religious and spiritual belief. Within religion we are free thinkers, and among these free thinkers the argument certainly does wash.

But no , your definition of free thinker seems to mean anyone who does not believe – anyone who jumps on the atheist bandwagon. And if someone uses their free critical thinking to arrive at a conclusion of belief in anything spiritual all of a sudden they are not free thinkers (according to you). Well this thinking doesn’t seem very free to me – it seems fettered within the realms of materialism. You cannot criticise the religious for free thinking and at the same time hold it as a virtue for atheists.
 
Light,

It’s not a single god of a single cult, its god per se, regardless all of human definitions and conceptions.
And every cult that promotes a specific god will adopt the same arrogance - i.e. they have the only truth and everyone else is wrong.

Why would you be considered any less arrogant since all you have is an unsupported assertion exactly the same as any other assertion for a god?
 
Question for everyone -

If gods were possible why should there be only one god? Why not have many gods?
 
It’s not a single god of a single cult, its god per se, regardless all of human definitions and conceptions.

That still implies a false assumption that god actually exists. This is logical fallacy since it hasn't been demonstrated one way or the other. With no positive reason to accept the assertion of a 'god,' we are left with the logical conclusion that until positive evidence exists there is no valid reason to assume its existence. To do so implies that the nature, characteristics, or qualities of this 'god' are known. The very assertion that there is *a* god and not multiple or infinite gods is, itself, an assertion that these qualities are known. This is simply false. Thus: poppycock created by man to satisfy his credulous nature.

That is not the case, it is not ‘my god’, it is just god.

Which begs the question: 'how do you know?' And I use begs the question as its rare, but true, definition of circular reasoning because the answer is invaribly something along the lines of it is known because it is true or other arguments of petitio principii.

The many gods are due to people having to identify with god in this way, but higher appreciations of god do not need form, attributes or even definitions for god. This is not to say it is a different god, just a different understanding of god.

Complete and utter poppycock. Not only is there no supporting evidence of this, but there is a vast body of evidence that discounts this notion completely. All one need do is look at the contradictory and diverse nature of man's gods. Again, the reason those that consider themselves "spiritual free thinkers" use such analogies is clearly because if other gods of humanity can be admittedly fictional, then why cannot the same assumption be made of their own. This is why, while you may claim to be one, free-thought is limited among the so-called 'spiritual free thinkers.' True free thought requires that your own assumptions be logical examined and evaluated and, regardless of what your final conclusions may be, an admittance of provisionality be made.

I'm an atheist, but at least I've the intellectual honesty to admit this is a provisional position. I'm more than willing to revise this position with real evidence -not the tautological nonsense that keeps getting suggested by so-called 'spiritual free thinkers.'

God without form or attributes is called brahman nirguna in Hinduism.

Its called human mythology and good fiction. Such a god is oxymoronic since the very act of assuming this 'god' is without attributation or form is an attributation -a form. Thus, we can toss this out; discard the notion as pure, human invented fiction. It cannot be accepted as any sort of real definition without sacrificing your intellectual honesty.

Please take a few minutes to read the short article in this link, it is about a slightly different subject but I think it explains the different levels of comprehension of god quite well.

http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/teachers/creation_benjamin.htm

If a few minutes presents itself as free, perhaps I shall, but I'm betting that I'd be better satisfied reading an article that explains the different levels of comprehension of Jedi Knights. At least it'll be entertaining, albeit equally fictional.


And I would also defend the same right plus the right of anyone not to believe. I will though (as you) still argue my case and criticise others where I see fit.

I'd have it no other way.

[...] your definition of free thinker seems to mean anyone who does not believe – anyone who jumps on the atheist bandwagon. And if someone uses their free critical thinking to arrive at a conclusion of belief in anything spiritual all of a sudden they are not free thinkers (according to you). Well this thinking doesn’t seem very free to me – it seems fettered within the realms of materialism. You cannot criticise the religious for free thinking and at the same time hold it as a virtue for atheists.

I'm quite used to being accused by the credulous of not being "open-minded" simply because I don't buy into their fanciful explanations of gods, demons, ufos, perpetual motion, free energy, esp and the like. Free thought, as I said, involves the characteristic of being willing to revise a position based on evidence when new evidence is presented. I fully admit to being materialist and naturalist. This is what matters in the universe as the mystical superstitions of man are untestable. I'm sure there is bound to be some postmodernist, new age response of nonsense from someone with that statement, going on about how "nothing can be empirically tested, blah, blah, blah..."

Believe your superstitions and magical mumbo jumbo all you want. If you're willing to assert them in public, be prepared to have them cricitized and perhaps ridiculed. That there is some un-spoken rule that religious belief is somehow immune to criticism and ridicule (i.e. parody), while it's okay to criticize and ridicule political beliefs and other social institutions, is utter nonsense.
 
That still implies a false assumption that god actually exists. This is logical fallacy since it hasn't been demonstrated one way or the other. .

The lack of demonstration would make it an empirical fallacy (not logical)

Which begs the question: 'how do you know?' And I use begs the question as its rare, but true, definition of circular reasoning because the answer is invaribly something along the lines of it is known because it is true or other arguments of petitio principii.
.

The knowledge is subjective - which helps not one iota in providing emperical evidence, and I would never expect it to, but it is my reality.... I do not for one minute expect everyone to conform on my say so without having their own subjective experience to verify.

What am I doing here , just discussing opinions...

This is why, while you may claim to be one, free-thought is limited among the so-called 'spiritual free thinkers.' True free thought requires that your own assumptions be logical examined and evaluated and, regardless of what your final conclusions may be, an admittance of provisionality be made.
.

But I have provisionality, my definitions aren't fixed. I'll even say it here "there is a slight possiblity that all my notions of god and spirituality are wrong". My mind is open to new information whether it be spititual or material. (can you really say the same). But at present I believe in spiritual realty.

Al knowledge is only a work in progress until higher knowledge arrives - whether that be spiritual or material knowledge. or even knowledge based on empirical information.



I'm quite used to being accused by the credulous of not being "open-minded"
.


I did not accuse you of that (...although maybe I just have in the last paragraph:D ). My obection was that you were excluing me from your definition of free thinker

be prepared to have them cricitized and perhaps ridiculed. That there is some un-spoken rule that religious belief is somehow immune to criticism and ridicule (i.e. parody), while it's okay to criticize and ridicule political beliefs and other social institutions, is utter nonsense.

It was not me that objected to being criticised it was lightgigantic i believe. Criticise all you like, it does not bother me.

It is only the funamentalists that oppose criticism and believe me I am more opposed to fundamentalism than I am to atheism. Although there is the odd fundamentalist atheist - man on a mission to convert all , filled with hatred for the religious, well hes no better than the religious fundamentalist fanatic.. (and dont take offence because I am certainly not talking about you).
 
There would seem to be both that which we agree upon as well as that which we disagree. Cheers.
 
The flaw in your assumption is that everyone would agree on the description of water whereas no one would agree on the descriptions of their gods, hence would not agree with you on the description of your god with theirs. Simple, really.

If a person cannot agree on what god is (the cause of all causes etc etc) its because they have no knowledge of god - like for instance a person could indicate a glass of water and say "This is pani" and another could say "No this is water" - in the absence of knowledge arguments can be unlimited simply on the platform of semantics
 
Question for everyone -

If gods were possible why should there be only one god? Why not have many gods?

Because if there are many gods it indicates that they are governed by a superior cause (time, the laws of nature, illusion etc etc) - in other words saying there are many gods (with none of them indicated as the cause of all casues) is akin to saying that there is no god
 
lg,

Because if there are many gods it indicates that they are governed by a superior cause (time, the laws of nature, illusion etc etc) -
Non sequitur. Why does many gods mean a superior cause? I see no connection.

in other words saying there are many gods (with none of them indicated as the cause of all casues) is akin to saying that there is no god
Why must there be a cuase of all causes? It doesn't follow that that is a neccessity.

Why couldn't the god you perceive simply be one of a family of gods?
 
cris


“ Because if there are many gods it indicates that they are governed by a superior cause (time, the laws of nature, illusion etc etc) - ”

Non sequitur. Why does many gods mean a superior cause? I see no connection.

if there is no ultimate controller, it means that the demi-controllers are duking it out in a superior medium - just like on this planet we have humans chalking up their borders and countries but it all happens under the jurisdiction of the superior laws of the universe (so the laws of the universe dictate control, not the humans)


“ in other words saying there are many gods (with none of them indicated as the cause of all casues) is akin to saying that there is no god ”

Why must there be a cuase of all causes? It doesn't follow that that is a neccessity.

Why couldn't the god you perceive simply be one of a family of gods?

god is defined as being the cause of all causes - if one has a temporal entity, one has an entity that is not god
 
Lg,

if there is no ultimate controller, it means that the demi-controllers are duking it out in a superior medium –
Why? If they have superior intelligence then consensus would be the result.

just like on this planet we have humans chalking up their borders and countries but it all happens under the jurisdiction of the superior laws of the universe (so the laws of the universe dictate control, not the humans)
An excellent atheist perspective, i.e. no gods are necessary. But that isn’t my argument. If gods were to exist why can’t there be more than 1.

god is defined as being the cause of all causes - if one has a temporal entity, one has an entity that is not god
Not so if gods are uncaused which means there could be many gods.
 
Cris

“ if there is no ultimate controller, it means that the demi-controllers are duking it out in a superior medium – ”

Why? If they have superior intelligence then consensus would be the result.

by consensus do you mean democracy :eek:


“ just like on this planet we have humans chalking up their borders and countries but it all happens under the jurisdiction of the superior laws of the universe (so the laws of the universe dictate control, not the humans) ”

An excellent atheist perspective, i.e. no gods are necessary. But that isn’t my argument. If gods were to exist why can’t there be more than 1.

there can be more than one but one must be evidenced as the eternal cause - its just like asking why can't a person have more than one biological mother


“ god is defined as being the cause of all causes - if one has a temporal entity, one has an entity that is not god ”

Not so if gods are uncaused which means there could be many gods.

that lands itself into various difficulties - namely what is the relationship between this world and two or more entities that are the cause of all causes? Clearly its an oxymoron
 
The god concept has been around for many millenia. How many can we find.

One line answer per god/goddess please - name of the deity and the religion and/or era. Plus an optional short description.

If you have web references that give a neat list then paste the list and not the link. Try to remove any duplicates given from previous posts.

I'll start with some examples -

Gaia - Earth mother
Zeus - Ancient Greece
God - Christianity
Allah - Islam




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:)


hello there ,


God = ALLAH = he has so many names , and the main name of God is ...


( ALLAH )


but those so many names are not as you tell or invent ,




they are the names ALLAH said about him self and each name has a deep meaning that is not the same as human meanings .

we beleive in only names ALLAH told us in his books , and hence all books were changed and edited but only quran is the only book hasnt been changed as its the last book and message , so we take the names told to us in Quran .

for example when i tell you that ALLAH has the name THE STRONG ... this does not mean he is strong as humans .
ALLAH THE STRONG means he has the whole strong power that is beyond your imagination and so on.


you can read some of what ALLAH said about himself in this translation of the meaning of a part of Quran :


---------------------------------------------------------


In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.





[21] Had We sent down this Qur-an on a mountain, verily, thou wouldst have seen it humble itself and cleave asunder for fear of Allah. Such are the similitudes which We propound to men, that they may reflect.

[22] Allah is He, than Whom there is no other god; Who knows (all things) both secret and open; He, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.

[23] Allah is He, than Whom there is no other god; the Sovereign, the Holy One, the Source of Peace (and Perfection), the Guardian of Faith, the Preserver of Safety, the Exalted in Might, the Irresistible, the Supreme: Glory to Allah! (High is He) above the partners they attribute to Him.


[24] He is Allah, the Creator, the Evolver, the Bestower of Forms (or Colours). To Him belong the Most Beautiful Names: whatever is in the heavens and on earth, doth declare His Praises and Glory; and He is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.
 
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