Brutus1964 said:
The works that the LDS church considers scripture are The Bible as long as it is translated and interpreted correctly, The Book of Mormon, Doctrine and covenants, Pearl of Great Price, and any official pronouncements from the first presidency and the council of the twelve apostles. Notice I said "official pronouncements" this does not mean that everything the leadership of the church says is doctrine. They can have their own opinions on things, but when they speak directly for God they will say so. We do not believe our church leaders are infallible, but they are inspired and directed by God.
But if you consider the Bible (essentially the KJV, isn't it?) insufficient or flawed, why use it at all? Or if it is sufficient, why add to it?
Also, your stance on the relative authority of the prophets is problematic. They are believed, aren't they? They are considered authoritive
even when speaking "non-officially"; nothing they say will be disputed while they are alive. And Brigham Young disagreed with you: "I have never yet preached a sermon and sent it out to the children of men, that they may not call Scripture (Journal of Discourses, vol. 13, p.95)."
For instance, at one stage, polygamy was considered a
requirement for exaltation, to such an extent that Brigham Young promised you will be damned if you "deny the plurality of wives". But today you can be excommunicated for polygamy.
How can church leaders make statements like "Obviously the holy practice [of plural marriage] will commence again after the Second Coming of the Son of Man and the ushering in of the millenium" (Mormon Doctrine, p. 578) in the face of a passage like:
Luke 20:34-36 Jesus replied, The people of this age marry and are given in marriage. But those who are considered worthy of taking part in that age and in the resurrection from the dead will neither marry nor be given in marriage, and they can no longer die; for they are like the angels. They are God's children, since they are children of the resurrection.
Who are to be believed, when official doctrine, Bible and apostles all disagree? (The issue here is not polygamy or even "celestial marriage", but authority. If they have authority, they have authority; if they do not, they don't.) For that matter, if Joseph Smith did not stand the test of Deut. 18, why is he still considered a prophet?
"And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved" (Acts 4:12).
LDS Church believes that salvation comes though Jesus Christ Alone. We believe that men and women are saved by grace, but glorified based on our works. As the scriptures say "faith without works is dead".
We could have agreed on that, but I think by "saved" you mean "resurrected", and by "glorified" you mean exaltation by works, which leaves no room for grace -- it is "grace
after all you have done". Who wants to be "saved" if he will not be "glorified"? Is God's grace insufficient?
We probably both agree that Christ is "the resurrection and the life", but you seem to
end Christ's work there. If it were by works, that is where we would take over.
Matt.25:31-34
When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his throne in heavenly glory. All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. Then the King will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. ...
41 Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.
46 Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.
Yes, your works
will be weighed, but they cannot save you . They will never cover your guilt. And once it is forgiven, nothing you do can make it
more forgiven. It's a question of life or death -- not
progression:
Ezekiel 33:12-13
Therefore, son of man, say to your countrymen, 'The righteousness of the righteous man will not save him when he disobeys, and the wickedness of the wicked man will not cause him to fall when he turns from it. The righteous man, if he sins, will not be allowed to live because of his former righteousness.'
If I tell the righteous man that he will surely live, but then he trusts in his righteousness and does evil, none of the righteous things he has done will be remembered; he will die for the evil he has done.
Both Brigham Young and Joseph Smith Jr. believed and preached that believing in Jesus
and Joseph Smith was necessary for salvation (in a clear elaboration on Romans 10:9). And President Hinckley believes only the LDS church knows who Christ is. Is this your opinion as well?
We believe that we teach the same gospel that Christ and the original apostles taught. Through the years men have changed or misinterpreted the original gospel for their own ends. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is Christ’s restored gospel upon the Earth.
When was the last genuine gospel preached, and when was the first interpolation done?
And if the first Christians, who were supervised by Christ's own apostles, could change Jesus' gospel, why not Joseph Smith, who could be supervised by no recognized or recognizable authority?
