Lie Detectors

Would you take the test?

  • Yes

    Votes: 16 66.7%

  • No

    Votes: 8 33.3%
  • Total voters
    24
  • Poll closed .
what if you were arrested and didn't make bail? How would you get beta blockers in prison?
 
I would certainly NOT take it.

If I don't take it, they can't prove I'm guilty.
If I do take it, there's a chance it will give innacurate results, in which case I now have to try to prove my innocence.

Not taking it would look suspicious, but that would be the only piece of "evidence" they have against me.
 
RubiksMaster said:
I would certainly NOT take it.

If I don't take it, they can't prove I'm guilty.
If I do take it, there's a chance it will give innacurate results, in which case I now have to try to prove my innocence.

Not taking it would look suspicious, but that would be the only piece of "evidence" they have against me.
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I don't think you ever have to prove your innocence against lie detector tests. It's still whatever evidence they collect against you that's going to make the case.
 
Simple, you're damned if you take it but more damned if you don't. If it's going to come down to the evidence regardless of whether or not I take the test, I might as well show a willingness to cooperate.
 
Enmos said:
They only serve as a tool to help police officers, see if they are on the right track and shit..
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I have had enough to do with the Police to know how unpredictable and unprofessional it can all get.

In other words, in the actual individual situation that one might be facing, the best course of action might have nothing to do with any speculations and preparations like ours here.
 
ashura said:
Simple, you're damned if you take it but more damned if you don't. If it's going to come down to the evidence regardless of whether or not I take the test, I might as well show a willingness to cooperate.
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I was in situations where the willingness to cooperate was sometimes counted to my advantage, somemetimes to my disadvantage.

It seems one can't really know in advance which will be better.
 
ashura said:
Simple, you're damned if you take it but more damned if you don't. If it's going to come down to the evidence regardless of whether or not I take the test, I might as well show a willingness to cooperate.
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Exactly.
 
I'd take the test, but I wouldn't rely on it. For all I know, I could be charged with terrorism and this is just a formality, But as others have said above, More dammned if i don't.
 
Orleander said:
Pretend you're accused of a crime you didn't commit. Would you take a lie detector test?
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Traditional heart-rate/respiration/galvanic skin response (technobabble for "sweat") lie detectors are little more that latter day voodoo. It might as well be measuring your body thetans. As with the old e-meter, its the guy conducting the test that matters. He (or she) interprets the results, which are from what I've read they are highly subjective.

There are supposedly newer ones that rely on CT scans, but I've seen no studies testing their efficacy.

The tests are mostly used to rattle suspects, and sometimes to weed out people who *might be* suspects (on the theory that, if they readily agree to the lie detector test, they are less likely to be guilty). If offered, you are probably better off taking the test, so that the police don't think it's suspicious that you refused.

I'd take the test even if I *had* committed the crime.
 
Pandaemoni said:
I'd take the test even if I *had* committed the crime.
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It is interesting that the people who are most likely to fool a polygraph (drugs aside) are sociopaths.

Also, the more honest you are the more likely you are to be wrongfully judged a liar according to this site (http://www.skeptics.org.uk/article.php?dir=articles&article=polygraph_or_lie_detector.php)

Ironically, the more truthful a person is, the more likely it is that they will fail the polygraph test. The reason being that they are very comfortable answering the control questions and so do not produce a marked physiological response to them. When they are questioned about a crime, for example, they can become very nervous about facing such questions and produce a physiological response that is more pronounced than they did to the unthreatening control questions: this may be interpreted as lying.
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They also provide some information on fooling a polygraph


The first line of defence is to produce a false strong physiological response to control questions; the second is to produce a false weak response to relevant questions. There are several methods for achieving both responses, and the result is that they will be interpreted as truthful or inconclusive answers as the control questions will have produced a larger response than the relevant questions.

An example of a countermeasure that was once used was the "drawing pin-in-the-shoe" method. When a control question was identified by the examinee, they would press their foot into the drawing pin to produce mild pain, resulting in an increased physiological response. These days polygraphers are aware of this method and will simply ask the examinee to remove their shoes before testing to eliminate it. That is an illustration of just how simple countermeasures are; there is nothing highly sophisticated about them.

Never trust a polygrapher. They may come across as friendly, helpful and sympathetic but they are not there to help examinees; they are there to interrogate them. That is what a polygraph test is; an interrogation. The false sense of empathy is just another form of deception that polygraphers use to elicit admissions.

The most famous case in which the polygraph was fooled is the Aldrich Ames case. Ames was a CIA agent who was spying for the Soviet Union. The CIA knew there was a mole in its ranks and so decided to polygraph everyone. Ames passed the test in 1986, and a subsequent one in 1991, which not only allowed him to continue to spy, but suspicion was moved from him and onto other agents who had difficulty in passing their polygraph tests.

Polygraphers state that they know when countermeasures are being employed. Again, this is a deception. There is no evidence that they can tell the difference between genuine and faked responses.

The important point to realise is that a polygraph is not foolproof: it is relatively straightforward to fool it.
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maxg said:
It is interesting that the people who are most likely to fool a polygraph (drugs aside) are sociopaths.
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Yes, probably because they are the ones who are not too uncomfortable to use manipulative strategies to cheat on such a test.


They also provide some information on fooling a polygraph

An example of a countermeasure that was once used was the "drawing pin-in-the-shoe" method. When a control question was identified by the examinee, they would press their foot into the drawing pin to produce mild pain, resulting in an increased physiological response. These days polygraphers are aware of this method and will simply ask the examinee to remove their shoes before testing to eliminate it. That is an illustration of just how simple countermeasures are; there is nothing highly sophisticated about them.
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Hence probably the earlier suggestion in this thread that one control the sphincter muscle. That's one of the few things that the examiners can't control.
 
greenberg said:
Yes, probably because they are the ones who are not too uncomfortable to use manipulative strategies to cheat on such a test.
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They also don't feel any remorse for what they have done and are not afraid to fail the test. Or maybe I'm talking about psychopaths...
 
portable lie detector time...people...
lie-detector-tv.jpg
 
Enmos said:
They also don't feel any remorse for what they have done and are not afraid to fail the test. Or maybe I'm talking about psychopaths...
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More importantly they feel no guilt so they don't experience physiological changes when they lie.
 
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