"Islamic" Golden Age

I'll take that as a no.

I suggest if you are familiar with Khwarizmi's work, you read his efforts on distilling equations to describe the laws of Islamic inheritance as described in the Quran. He wrote it specifically to address the practical needs of Muslims in matters of inheritance.

If you have academic access, start here

http://www.jstor.org/pss/301569
 
SAM,

Please, if you think that Islamic philosophy can make a person an above average mathematician compared with than a non-religious or even a Xian or Zoroastrian person then you are sorely wrong. Mathematicians are born Mathematicians. And great mathematicians come from all walks of life Islamic or otherwise.

You seem to be arguing this point: Islamic Law of Inheritance is so inconsistent and screwed up that a person was driven to try and make sense of it and so Islam ushered the great era of "Islamic" math and so came the Great Islamic Golden Age....



Now, you seemed to have missed my question:

Do you think that the European Renaissance should be renamed the "Christian Golden Age"?

Michael
 
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Unless they innovated to bring practical considerations to scriptural theory, I don't think so. Were they looking for the best way to find the qibla in foreign lands? Was the appearance of the moon on the first day of an Islamic month of importance to them? Were they concerned with the maintenance of wudu in their considerations of hygiene? Were they concerned with whether the zero reflected a Quranic verse that said man is created from an essence of nothing? Did they design architecture in accordance with [what they perceived as] Islamic rules?

Here is an example of "Islamic science"

Most Islamic astrolabes have on them a prayer line which indicates the times of the five daily prayers: sunset, nightfall, daybreak, midday and mid-afternoon (the Islamic day begins with the rising of the moon at sunset). Daylight prayers are defined in terms of shadows, and night prayers in terms of twilight states. They vary according to latitude, and all depend on the position of the sun. The astrolabe therefore lends itself well to measurement of the prayer times. Indeed, by the thirteenth century the muwaqqit, a professional astronomer employed by a mosque, was a widespread institution. The muwaqqit calculated prayer-times and also made instruments, gave lectures to students and wrote treatises on astronomical subjects. Astronomical tables for the prayer times had to be used in conjunction with an instrument to check when the time advocated in the tables had actually arrived, astrolabes and sundials being the most popular instruments for this. Interestingly, when the astrolabe began to be used and made in Western Europe, not all of them lost the prayer line because it was still useful as a shortcut to finding the times of sunrise and sunset, which are important for the timing of Christian prayers.
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http://www.hps.cam.ac.uk/starry/isaslabereligion.html
 
Of course every single religion has some astrological aspects to it. That goes from Inca's to Shinto.

The fact is you want to think Islam, which you attest offers nothing novel, somehow as a life philosophy brought about a great and wonderous golden age complete with "Islamic" Science and "Islamic" math etc... and the truth is History shows this to be incorrect.

So, now that you knwo the you do think the European Renaissance should be renamed the "Christian Golden Age"
 
Okay, call it whatever you like, I'll call it as I see it. :shrug: :
 
I spoke with a North Korean who felt much the same - you konow seeing they are ushering the great civilization of North Korea as an example for all the world to follow - which we do, knowingly or not. All great inventions come from NK. Maybe their Kim Jung Ilian Science is something similar to you Mohammadian Atomic Theory?

One things for sure, get them young enough and its impossible for some to over come propaganda,
 
Stated like a true young propagandist, my son. You are progressing nicely toward the holy grail, of total lack of faith in any written or spoken statement.
 
There is simply no such thing as "Islamic" Math.

Math was and is discovered by all sorts of people. Sure, if there is a conundrum presented by a particular religious query someone may be interested in solving said math problem. That's a whole hell of a lot different than suggesting Islam inspired a great math revolution. Because history shows it didn't.

The need to mathematically explain celestial events is NOT "Islamic". Why? Because it's been used in every God Damn society on the face of the freaken earth to explain celestial events. Stone Henge comes to mind. Let me guess, much like Alexander, they were Muslims too :D

Golden Ages are short lived periods of wealth, open mindedness and creativity of all walks of life. Islam is unique in being the ONLY religion to have it's very own "Golden Age". No other religion has one. (oh I take that back, there's the European Christian Golden Age that led to all of the wonderful things we have today - like the Christian PC). Lucky for the Muslims, Islams Golden Age lasted oh, what, about 1000 years and resulted in ... well, not all that much for 1000 years of endeavors.

There's propaganda going on here and it isn't by me.

Lastly, Xianity had a stranglehold on Europe. But people questioned the bullshit. Such people are free thinkers.

Happy Free Thinking - if you can,
Michael
 
It should be noted, many people argue al-Khwārizmī' was actually a Zoroastrian. IF that was the case, does this mean his math is not Islamic Science? Or is it still Islamic Science?

Also, should we rename the Chinese Golden Age - the Shaman Golden Age? I mean, you know, to be consistent .

Comparatively speaking, since Christian's put people on the moon and invented about everything in the modern World. Are we living in the Second Great Christian Golden Age - you know, after the one erroneously called the Renaissance?


Does everyone agree that E=MC^2 is Jewish Zionist Math?

Just curious how far we can take the absurdity called Islamic Science and Islamic Golden Age.

Right about now SAM starts missing questions and defining things :p
She's already started it,
Michael
 
No, I don't intend to bother. If you cannot see how a muwaqqit is Islamic, you'll not see anything else. It does not matter if the scientist was a Muslim or not, if the science was done with reference to Islamic principles or to address a Muslim concern. It makes no sense to ignore the impact of Islam on the non-Muslim subjects

mathematically explain celestial events
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Is that what the prayer lines on the astrolabe are?
 
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S.A.M. said:
...astrolabes and sundials being the most popular instruments for this...
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Neither of those instruments were of Islamic design. Everyone used them, including Muslims. A refined Astrolabe was introduced to Europe from Spain in the 12 century.
 
I think these questions help organize our thought about this:

1) If al-Khwārizmī' was a Zoroastrian, does this then mean his math is not Islamic Math? Or is it still Islamic Math?

2) To remain consistent, Should we rename the Chinese Golden Age to the Shaman Golden Age?

3) Should we rename the Renaissance the Christian Golden Age?

4) Since Christian's put people on the moon and invented most everything "modern" in the modern World, are we now living in the Second Great Christian Golden Age?

5) Is E=MC^2 is Jewish Math?

6) Is Calculus Christian Math (Newton was a fanatic about Xianity he used math all the time to study the Bible - that's very well documented).

RE: astrolabe.

The first and the finest, up until modern age, were developed by Greeks to determine all sorts of things associated with religion -eclipses were especially insightful. People who used these were of course men of the Gods. According to SAM's logic, the Greek Golden Age must now be renamed The Greek Polytheistic Pantheon Golden AGE :bugeye: They built Greek Polytheistic Pantheon Astrolabes and developed Greek Polytheistic Pantheon Maths and Greek Polytheistic Pantheon Sciences.

(SURELY, even the most dense Scifi member can see how ridiculous this is).


Suppose 2000 years in the future people discovered Scientologists made a special TV (didn't discover but decided to modify modern TV's [Muslims didn't invent astrolabes, they built on what the Greeks had already made]) to look for signals from Xenu, according to SAM we're living in the Scientology Golden Age!


Really, anyone should see now, "Islamic Math" is oxymoron.
 
Yes, the more I think about it, if going by SAM's definition of Islamic Science and Islamic Math, then Calculus is Christian Math.

Isaac Newton's religious views influenced his lifetime of work.

Newton wrote a number of religious tracts dealing with the literal interpretation of the Bible, as he considered himself to be one of a select group of individuals who were specially chosen by God for the task of understanding Biblical scripture.[1] Newton’s conception of the physical world provided a stable model of the natural world that would reinforce stability and harmony in the civic world. The law of gravity became Newton's best-known discovery, but Newton saw a monotheistic God as the masterful creator whose existence could not be denied in the face of the grandeur of all creation.[2][3]
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And there you go, Calculus is forever Christian mathematics and all of the wonderful inventions that make use of calculus must therefor have been inspired by Christianity.


While that does sound stupid, just imagine, this is exactly what Muslims with SAM's point of view are brainwashing into their children generation after generation. No wonder they can't think clearly. Their brains are so weighted down with bullshit it's impossible to see straight.

This is exactly what happened in Europe with Xianity. BUT, the difference is, Europe had a long and successful history pre-Christianity. Arabs think they didn't. So, for them, everything before Islam was, you know, killing their own baby daughters and bullshit like this. That makes it doubly as difficult for them to progress into the modern multicultural and multireligous and multi-gods/goddesses world.

Which is why it's important they rediscover their pre-Islam history (before it's all destroyed) and to clarify these little oxymoronic misnomers like Islamic math and Christian calculus.
 
I think this thread is really about how to invent some bullshit idea and then bullshit away about how much bullshit it really is.

Don't you?
 
Not only that, Christian electricity, Christian airplanes, Christian internet, Christian medicine, ... pretty much everything in the modern world, oh, and we're living in the second Great Christian Golden Age....


Let's not forget: Christians voted in GW Bush Jr .... what was that study on the IQ tests again...
 
disease said:
I think this thread is really about how to invent some bullshit idea and then bullshit away about how much bullshit it really is.

Don't you?
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Tell me disease do YOU think calculus is Christian Math? Is science based on calculus and performed by Christians Christian Science? As our world is based on all this are we living in a Christian Golden Age?
 
No, I think math is just math. We've been at it for a while and Christianity didn't invent numbers or a base system (the Babylonians used base60, which we see today in the way we count time).

Science isn't 'good' or 'bad', those are what we do with it; generally we ignore the mess, but that's getting harder.
 
Then I agree, math is math and science is science. Which is why I said "Islamic" Math and "Islamic" Science are oxymorons. The problem is Muslims are told so much propaganda, about how they were barbaric pathetic nomades and along came "Islam" and *poof* from then on out everything is all good. It's all a bunch of bullshit.

You don't find to many people who will justify the European crusades and colonization but when Muslims read their history they see the word "Islam" and now Islamic crusades are "l.i.b.e.r.a.t.i.o.n." and to complete the illusion you must have you obligatory 1000 year long Islamic First Reich / Islamic Golden Age complete with Islamic Math and Islamic Science.

The crazy thing is the Islamic crusades were just as wrong as any other, a 1000 year old Golden Age never existed let alone one based on Islam and there is no such thing as "Islamic" Math.


Thinking about these things correctly is the point of this thread. At least we can agree "Islamic" mathematics is oxymoron.

Good start,
Michael
 
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