Is religion the worst thing that has ever happened to us?

[peta9]

^Science is the answer not religion and it always was, it just took a time to get to a point of realization. Religion was a muddled beginning. Science is responsible for vaccines, the food you eat, the sanitation to keep you alive and healthy etc among countless other things.

And I think to live by a philosophy is much healthier than a religion because religious execution was not the problem but religion itself. Morality is instrinsic and is understood easily and develops so and is not exclusive to a particular religion. It is conveyed many times as favoritism is evident in religion as well as divine right to others best property by some sort of divine favoritism as justification. Dangerous, bad, and self-serving fluff.

 

[Saquist]

It was also in the company of scientific advancement, the settling of new lands, and other factors. Religion is not all there is.

but it is the only point on the topic of the thread.

Again, there are lots of things going on besides religion. There is crowding because there is no more available land.

That's incorrect there is plenty of land available. Over crowding is for other issues like demand on location not the lack of land...

There is the rise of globalism and multinational corporations. There are superpowers and the political ideologies they support. I'm not sure how it all plays into it, but don't speak as if religion is the only force working in human affairs.

retrospectively lets not assume religion is the cause of the negative effects.

People have ALWAYS died by the tousands from hunger, sickness, war, and sectarian violence. It's not a new thing, you know.

Irrelevant to level of destruction and death in the 20 century. This is common knowledge. The scale is large diminishing it generalization is inaccurate to the truth of the world around us. The population of Earth is much much large than ever before...The daily death toll on Earth through mere population and natural cause is larger than ever before...the added homicides, then added epidemics, then add common sickness, then war...the reasons are almost endless.

scaling them inporportion tells us that deaths for the sake of religion is a small part. Overlay...the added understanding that the destruction seems to leave behind every principle of religion world wide seems to aleviate the finger pointing to embrace man himself as the probelm...Life isn't getting better on the Earth...It's getting much much worse.

at least as far as I can tell.

 

[Enterprise-D]

Most of us know without being told that Hitler had nothing to do with religious tenets. To quote is one thing by a wise observer knows the differnce between a wolf and a sheep no matter how well dressed the wolf is.

It matters not that Hitler was obviously immoral. What matters it that he thought he was justified by his religion. Added to that the fact that the actual catholic powers that were did not speak out actively against Hitler.

While a religious organization did not in and of itself begin WWII, it can be seen that Hitler was motivated by religion. Were he untainted by religion, and were there not Judaism to hate, maybe he'd have had less of a reason to start a war.

Of course, megalomaniacs seldom need a reason. The point of challenging Vital's sweeping statement was that catholicism especially (and religion on the whole) is certainly not blameless for its part in WWII.

 

[Liege-Killer]

Saquist, you're going to have a tough time making a case that the death and destruction of the 20th century was a result of "leaving behind every principle of religion."

You're taking a situation with many variables and focusing only on one of those variables without trying to account for the rest. Somehow I don't think you'd be very good at designing scientific experiments (or any kind, really).

How about.... oh I don't know, let's see.... the rapid rise of new and extremely powerful weapons never seen before the 20th century as a big factor in all that destruction? Atomic bombs. Chemical weapons. Napalm. Aircraft capable of carpet bombing. Just as a few examples.

 

[sandy]

Believing in science as God will get a person a one way ticket straight to hell when they die.
Believing in Jesus Christ will get them a one way ticket straight to Heaven.
The choice is simple.

 

[geeser]

Believing in science as God will get a person a one way ticket straight to hell when they die.

lol. is that the hell they dont believe in.

Believing in Jesus Christ will get them a one way ticket straight to Heaven.
The choice is simple.

yes the irrationality is simple.

what if your brother, sister, mother, father, your children, any one of your loved ones, choose the former how would you feel, if you were up in heaven sunning yourself and they were down in hell being tortured.

 

[(Q)]

The truth is more startling than that. Relgion has been used as a blunt tool and justification for many to subjugate his fellow man. It is a method of control and in the wrong hands it's influence undermines our confidence in ourselves and our societies.

There are no "right" hands.

In the last 200 years the human families devolopment has progressed at warp speeds where before thousands of years of same potential and the same knowledge inspired only the most minimalist progress. Suddenly humanity has slowed down yet again. Someone has applied the brakes.

As we compare the acceleration rate with the presence of religion we see that the acceleration human societies was in full company of religion. Yet...now when people are now walking away from churches and science is establishing it's self as a "self God" we see that our progress has slowed.
Why?

Complete nonsense. It is the other way round.

 

[SkinWalker]

Believing in science as God will get a person a one way ticket straight to hell when they die.
Believing in Jesus Christ will get them a one way ticket straight to Heaven.
The choice is simple.

Well. When you put it that way, it seems so.... deluded. Why not the belief in Zeus to get into heaven? Or Ptah? They're gods. They were here long before the alleged Christ. And more people (per capita) believed in them for a longer period of time.

Is religion the worst thing that ever happened to humanity? No. Not in the long run because it was probably necessary for Neolithic and Paleolithic man to develop routines and beliefs that inspired things like the rise of complexity and the emergence of agriculture. I, for one, am a fan of gospel music, religiously inspired classical music, religiously inspired painting and sculpture, and some of the most fascinating architecture has religion to blame for its beauty and wonder.

I think religion has run its course as a means of dominating a society and providing societal rules and structure, however, as it limits reason and injects superstition into our lives rather than rationalism. Religion is too un-yielding and inflexible to even permit honesty and truth of rational perspective when looking at biblical mythology as a wondrous work of art and literature. Instead, adherents take it literally and, thus, find themselves having to choose between rationalism and superstition when it comes to important matters of society and science. That a blastocyst has a soul and that their god rejects a whole class of people based on the gender they fall in love with are superstition-based failures of rationalism.

 

[Saquist]

It matters not that Hitler was obviously immoral. What matters it that he thought he was justified by his religion. Added to that the fact that the actual catholic powers that were did not speak out actively against Hitler.

Some did...but it's even worse than you think.

While a religious organization did not in and of itself begin WWII, it can be seen that Hitler was motivated by religion. Were he untainted by religion, and were there not Judaism to hate, maybe he'd have had less of a reason to start a war.

And here's what I mean. Everything about WWII was about power and the Catholic church got in on that bid for power. The Clergy made a contract with the Nazi regime. After the War was over the Clergy would be the only church allowed to exist in Europe in Nazis occupied lands.

Of course, megalomaniacs seldom need a reason. The point of challenging Vital's sweeping statement was that catholicism especially (and religion on the whole) is certainly not blameless for its part in WWII.

No, of course, you're correct. But the Idea of religion isn't the cause. It's the people behind it. And that is a common thread is it not?

Whether it's about War, Politic, or religion or Science the one common denominator is man and his need for power...It's no the tool he uses to accomplishes which is evil...It's man himself. That's how I see it.

Saquist, you're going to have a tough time making a case that the death and destruction of the 20th century was a result of "leaving behind every principle of religion."

You're correct. That's because there are so many varriable. YET, just as difficult is the attempt to isolate religion as any cause...very few religions actually endorse violence as it's edicts.

You're taking a situation with many variables and focusing only on one of those variables without trying to account for the rest. Somehow I don't think you'd be very good at designing scientific experiments (or any kind, really).

This is more about apparent coincidences. I've often if it is a coincidence that while the People in France and Russia and many other places are abandoning the church in record numbers and people are begining to endorse Science as their new religion...is there any corelation with the new found moral freeness much of the "christian" world is enjoying.

I don't believe in coincidence.

How about.... oh I don't know, let's see.... the rapid rise of new and extremely powerful weapons never seen before the 20th century as a big factor in all that destruction? Atomic bombs. Chemical weapons. Napalm. Aircraft capable of carpet bombing. Just as a few examples.

I'd entertain that thought by asking how many people do you think die by carpet bombing, chemical weapons, Naplam and Atmic bombs every day?

 

[Medicine*Woman]

Believing in science as God will get a person a one way ticket straight to hell when they die.
Believing in Jesus Christ will get them a one way ticket straight to Heaven. The choice is simple.

*************
M*W: Sandy, you make a lot of statements, but you don't offer any evidence of such. How do you know someone will "go straight to hell?" And how can you determine who will "go straight to heaven? "Even personal experience would be interesting, but I believe you have none.

Christians are adamant about getting to heaven, but they just can't verify there is such a place.

Christians demand proof from atheists, so Sandy, it's time you back-up your statements with some proof.

 

[Wisdom_Seeker]

*************
M*W: Sandy, you make a lot of statements, but you don't offer any evidence of such. How do you know someone will "go straight to hell?" And how can you determine who will "go straight to heaven? "Even personal experience would be interesting, but I believe you have none.

Christians are adamant about getting to heaven, but they just can't verify there is such a place.

Christians demand proof from atheists, so Sandy, it's time you back-up your statements with some proof.

Give me proof of an Eternal and Infinite Universe, and I shall believe your words.

 

[Medicine*Woman]

Give me proof of an Eternal and Infinite Universe, and I shall believe your words.

*************
M*W: I can only say that my experience of the universe has been eternal and infinite while I've been here. I don't care if you believe my words or not.

 

[sandy]

*************
M*W: Sandy, you make a lot of statements, but you don't offer any evidence of such. How do you know someone will "go straight to hell?" And how can you determine who will "go straight to heaven? "Even personal experience would be interesting, but I believe you have none.
Christians are adamant about getting to heaven, but they just can't verify there is such a place.
Christians demand proof from atheists, so Sandy, it's time you back-up your statements with some proof.

I'm not here to win friends, influence people, or try to get anyone converted. I do that in everyday life. God said it first (unless you are born again you can not see the kingdom of Heaven. -John 3:3) I believe Him. I have no proof, just faith.

 

[Nickelodeon]

I'm not here to win friends, influence people, or try to get anyone converted. I do that in everyday life. God said it first (unless you are born again you can not see the kingdom of Heaven. -John 3:3) I believe Him. I have no proof, just faith.

So what are you here for? To tell eveyone how "hot" you are?

 

[IceAgeCivilizations]

And what she like to eat.

 

[sandy]

So what are you here for? To tell eveyone how "hot" you are?

LOL For fun. I didn't start the hot thing until I got crucified for "PoliticallyIncorrectHottie"

 

[EmptyForceOfChi]

I'm not here to win friends, influence people, or try to get anyone converted. I do that in everyday life.

thats a classic.


peace.

 

[IceAgeCivilizations]

Is the smell of sock puppet rising again?

 

[Nickelodeon]

Jesus was the worst thing to ever happen.

 

[geeser]

Jesus was the worst thing to ever happen.

but he isn't.
hes a myth just like mithra, gigamesh, etc....
but I do see your point however, the thoughts behind this fictional character are the killers of men and the destroyer of common sense.

and sandy: as thats not you in the picture/avatar it's actress Christie Brinkley, what do you really look like is it anything like this, as this is a real hottie.

and she's extremely Politically Incorrect.