Is it wrong to have sex for fun, knowing it might possibly lead to an abortion?

Status
Not open for further replies.
SetiAlpha6 said:
Do you know of any occurrences of God’s wrath where His love for one was not the root cause of His judgment for another.
Click to expand...

Numbers 31:
===============
And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying:“Take vengeance on the Midianites for the children of Israel. Afterward you shall be gathered to your people.”

So Moses spoke to the people, saying, “Arm some of yourselves for war, and let them go against the Midianites to take vengeance for the Lord on Midian. A thousand from each tribe of all the tribes of Israel you shall send to the war.”

(Moses goes and kills all the Midianite men in the name of the Lord. But his troops let the women and children live.)

And Moses said to them: “Have you kept all the women alive? Look, these women caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to trespass against the Lord in the incident of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the Lord. Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known a man intimately. But keep alive for yourselves all the young girls who have not known a man intimately.
=============

"Kill all the men, kill all the little boys, but keep the young virgins to rape" is difficult to justify from the point of view of God's love.

As far as I understand, His wrath is always rooted in love. Seems strange, but appears to be accurate to me.
Click to expand...
So his orders to kill and rape were rooted in love? Would you accept that excuse from a rapist?
 
SetiAlpha6 said:
God is perfect in all His ways. I do not have the ability to judge Him. He is God, I am not. It is not appropriate for me to be His judge.

I would have to be able to see and perfectly weigh billions of aspects of reality simultaneously to even have a chance of judging God. I can’t do that, glad you can!

It is also not even appropriate for me to judge (condemn) my fellow man either. Only God has that ability and right! I can’t even judge my own heart accurately, how then could I ever condemn the heart of another?

He will correct all things perfectly in His time as He wishes.
Click to expand...
Please stop preaching and proselytising.

SetiAlpha6 said:
As for homosexuality...
Click to expand...
The crux of your issues..

SetiAlpha6 said:
Homosexuality is evil because it is a corruption of the obvious, clear design of our bodies.
Click to expand...
How so?

Why do you think we are designed to be the way we are?

Are you suggesting we are designed to be heterosexual and procreate? Do you think people who are infertile are evil because they are somehow corrupted for not being in line with how you think they are designed?

SetiAlpha6 said:
Men put their penis in other men’s excrement.
Click to expand...
What the hell kind of porn have you been watching?

SetiAlpha6 said:
And contract disease and then spread it to others.
Click to expand...
Actually the biggest spread of these diseases is via unprotected heterosexual sex. You know, how 'God' intended sex..

SetiAlpha6 said:
They do all of this for a few seconds of physical pleasure.
Click to expand...
I don't know how to break this to you.. But..

Sex is actually pleasurable.

SetiAlpha6 said:
Is this really the model of human behavior?
Click to expand...
You are yet to define what is "the model of human behaviour".

SetiAlpha6 said:
Homosexuality has killed millions and counting, including my own brother, Kevin, who needed rectum repair surgery and then died of AIDS.
Click to expand...
Firstly no, homosexuality does not kill people.

Secondly, I am truly sorry about your brother.

Thirdly, I think your using your brother's death to spout homophobic nonsense is wrong and appalling.

Fourthly, your brother needed compassion, understanding and a loving family. By the looks of it, based on your own words, he probably did not find much support from said family.

And finally, your brother may have had unprotected sex. But he was not alone. The spread of HIV is not because of homosexuals in that it is not and has never been confined to homosexuality.

SetiAlpha6 said:
Do you really expect me to call it good???
Click to expand...
Frankly, your views are warped and twisted.

Not to mention bigoted.

SetiAlpha6 said:
Can you bring my brother back to me???
Click to expand...
Given your judgmental attitude and frankly appalling and offensive arguments about homosexuals, your spread of misinformation and constant parroting of bigoted and homophobic arguments, I get the distinct impression that your brother probably suffered enough.

And it had nothing to do with his suffering but probably had more to do with his family..
 
Listening to an album by the Cinnamon Chasers
called... “Great Escape”

THEY ROCK!!!
 
billvon said:
Numbers 31:
===============
And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying:“Take vengeance on the Midianites for the children of Israel. Afterward you shall be gathered to your people.”

So Moses spoke to the people, saying, “Arm some of yourselves for war, and let them go against the Midianites to take vengeance for the Lord on Midian. A thousand from each tribe of all the tribes of Israel you shall send to the war.”

(Moses goes and kills all the Midianite men in the name of the Lord. But his troops let the women and children live.)

And Moses said to them: “Have you kept all the women alive? Look, these women caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to trespass against the Lord in the incident of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the Lord. Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known a man intimately. But keep alive for yourselves all the young girls who have not known a man intimately.
=============

"Kill all the men, kill all the little boys, but keep the young virgins to rape" is difficult to justify from the point of view of God's love.


So his orders to kill and rape were rooted in love? Would you accept that excuse from a rapist?
Click to expand...

Yes, of course!

Your heart is in the right place, because of your love for your fellow man. Perfectly on point.

My heart breaks as your’s does when I read things like this.

Yes very, VERY tragic, situation indeed.

Apparently the wickedness and abuse of these people, possibly even a genetic, or AIDS like corruption was extremely great, so great that only a few were allowed to survive.

It does, of course, look terrible to us, looking back centuries into the past, and not fully understanding the full situation. Circumstances are kind of important things, that is how the news media warps reality. They leave them out!

To me this is extremely tragic...

And God was protecting those He loved from evil. To do that He had to destroy that evil. Extremely sad!!!

Of course, the Atheist has no reason to call God or anything else evil, because they have no basis for morality at all.

So, keep going, there are plenty more.
I used to use them myself in similar arguments.

Thanks so much!
 
Last edited:
SetiAlpha6 said:
Apparently the wickedness and abuse of these people, possibly even a genetic corruption was extremely great, so great that only a few were allowed to survive.
Click to expand...
Uh - OK. But that's exactly the same approach that the 9/11 terrorists took. The US was so evil that they only allowed a few in the WTC to survive, because Allahu Akbar. I don't think that's such a good example of love.
It does, of course, look terrible to us, looking back centuries into the past, and not fully understanding the full situation. Circumstances are kind of important things, that is how the news media warps reality. They leave them out!
Click to expand...
Just as the righteous attitudes of the 9/11 terrorists were left out of the media narratives? (And on the plus side, they didn't rape all the survivors.)
The Atheist has no reason to call God or anything else evil, because they have no basis for morality at all.
Click to expand...
If you use the killing and raping of innocents as your basis for morality, they have more of a basis than you do.
 
billvon said:
Uh - OK. But that's exactly the same approach that the 9/11 terrorists took. The US was so evil that they only allowed a few in the WTC to survive, because Allahu Akbar. I don't think that's such a good example of love.

Just as the righteous attitudes of the 9/11 terrorists were left out of the media narratives? (And on the plus side, they didn't rape all the survivors.)

If you use the killing and raping of innocents as your basis for morality, they have more of a basis than you do.
Click to expand...

You might take a look, at least for myself, I saw no mention of rape. That requires a leap for me never stated in the text.

You know God hates rape, right?

And you did notice that a plague went through the people, right?

So apparently God was trying to protect them from the spread of a plague.

Trying to understand it myself.

Such a horrific situation!
 
Last edited:
Beer w/Straw said:
You calling "fake news" on some media outlet?

Don't quite follow. Are you saying an atheist has no basis for morality "at all"?
Click to expand...

Well, what is your basis for morality? And is it consistent with your world view or belief system?
 
SetiAlpha6 said:
Well, what is your basis for morality?
Click to expand...
My brain/mind would be my basis for morality, I guess.
And is it consistent with your world view or belief system?
Click to expand...
What do you mean, if your answer to those questions is God, how do you explain why so many Christians have different views than yours? Morality is dynamic because reality is, or how it is perceived. At least I can learn as the mind and brain are both scientific areas of study. Whereas, some "Christians" never will, but be stuck in the past as the bible never changes, or is just so outdated and out of touch with reality.
 
SetiAlpha6 said:
You might take a look, at least for myself, I saw no mention of rape. That requires a leap for me never stated in the text.
Click to expand...
"But keep alive for yourselves all the young girls who have not known a man intimately."
You know God hates rape, right?
Click to expand...
Apparently not when he commands it. And apparently not as long as the rapist pays the woman's father 50 shekels afterwards (Deuteronomy 22.)
And you did notice that a plague went through the people, right?
Click to expand...
Yep. Apparently God wanted some people to experience a plague as well.
So apparently God was trying to protect them from the spread of a plague.
Click to expand...
Given that he caused it, hard to see how killing a bunch of men, women and children over it accomplishes much.
 
Well, what is your basis for morality?
Click to expand...

I'm an atheist and the basis for my morality is empathy--the ability to experience what someone else is experiencing and to treat them as I would have myself treated. The Golden Rule iow..
 
billvon said:
"But keep alive for yourselves all the young girls who have not known a man intimately."

Apparently not when he commands it. And apparently not as long as the rapist pays the woman's father 50 shekels afterwards (Deuteronomy 22.)

Yep. Apparently God wanted some people to experience a plague as well.

Given that he caused it, hard to see how killing a bunch of men, women and children over it accomplishes much.
Click to expand...

Wow, you will twist anything to make God appear evil.

There is no rape mentioned at all!
 
SetiAlpha6 said:
Wow, you will twist anything to make God appear evil. There is no rape mentioned at all!
Click to expand...
"But keep alive for yourselves all the young girls who have not known a man intimately."

When you tell soldiers "kill them all, but keep the virgins for yourselves" you think that means let them sit in your comfy chair?

And in any case, you don't need that to make God look evil. Telling him to kill all the children except the young virgins who might be useful (in some way) to their soldiers is pretty evil all by itself.

But if you still can't believe God is OK with rape, here's the text from that Deuteronomy passage:

"If a man finds a young woman who is a virgin, who is not betrothed, and he seizes her and lies with her, and they are found out, then the man who lay with her shall give to the young woman’s father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife because he has humbled her"

So if you rape someone, you have to pay 50 shekels. Then you can keep her, because you showed her who was boss. Of course if no one finds out, no problem.
 
billvon said:
"But keep alive for yourselves all the young girls who have not known a man intimately."

When you tell soldiers "kill them all, but keep the virgins for yourselves" you think that means let them sit in your comfy chair?

And in any case, you don't need that to make God look evil. Telling him to kill all the children except the young virgins who might be useful (in some way) to their soldiers is pretty evil all by itself.

But if you still can't believe God is OK with rape, here's the text from that Deuteronomy passage:

"If a man finds a young woman who is a virgin, who is not betrothed, and he seizes her and lies with her, and they are found out, then the man who lay with her shall give to the young woman’s father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife because he has humbled her"

So if you rape someone, you have to pay 50 shekels. Then you can keep her, because you showed her who was boss. Of course if no one finds out, no problem.
Click to expand...

Wow!!!

Miss application after miss application of the Bible!

Not even close to reality!

This conversation is too wicked for me to continue on in.

God would have destroyed them for raping those girls!

You hate God!

And want to spread that virus to me which I will never allow!

We are at an end.
 
SetiAlpha6 said:
Wow!!!

Miss application after miss application of the Bible!

Not even close to reality!

This conversation is too wicked for me to continue on in.

God would have destroyed them for raping those girls!

You hate God!

And want to spread that virus to me which I will never allow!

We are at an end.
Click to expand...
This is a parody, surely?

I mean, who speaks like this?

And Billvon did not misapply the Bible. Rape as a tool of war is in the Bible. As apparently sanctioned by God.

Perhaps you should spend more time reading your scripture and less time lying about said scripture.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top