Is Hell a Physical Reality?
- Thread starter Lawdog
- Start date
yes lets look at jesus, why would he tell his followers to buy a sword.woody said:
King James Version
luke 22,
36: Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.
Ok, maybe Jesus ordered his followers to buy swords to keep them for self-defense situations only.
But buying the swords by itself is a very bad idea from the "man of Peace" as the Bible calls him.
Imagine if every xian in the world today owns a gun in his/her home, Imagine how dangerous the society will be.
You can't expect every xian to be as good as Jesus if you know what I mean! Owning guns would certainly make the job of the government's law enforcement a lot harder!
and what about jesus killing his enemies/ of asking for there deaths.
luke 19,
26: I tell you, that to every one who has will more be given; but from him who has not, even what he has will be taken away.
27: But as for these enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, bring them here and slay them before me.'"
28: And when he had said this, he went on ahead, going up to Jerusalem.
this is an obvious contradiction to what Jesus taught for Love toward the enemies.
According to Luke 19:11, Jesus was telling a parable or story. But even though he was telling a parable, it is clear that Jesus believed in it, since he preached it by his own mouth, and practiced it as shown below.
revelations 2,
22: Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.
23: And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.
All this for a bit of nookie with somebody other than her husband quite common now days.
amongst xians too.
and what of jesus hiting others with a whip, this certainly takes his perfection away.
john 2,
15: And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables.
nice bloke.
musta, So these events in your opinion make Jesus the Bad guy. Don't you have the right to kill if you are being raped, isn't it ok to spank your kids if they are ripping people off, and isn't the death penalty deserved in some cases?
AS for the harlot church in the book of revelations, it will be judged, and those that have used God's church for personal gain and corruption will be judged with the harlot church. Some of them are here today -- the pedophile preists are an example.
AS for the harlot church in the book of revelations, it will be judged, and those that have used God's church for personal gain and corruption will be judged with the harlot church. Some of them are here today -- the pedophile preists are an example.
I was'nt saying jesus was all bad, just pointing out to you he's not all good, you said "If you want to see God's good side look at Jesus". I was just pointing out the fallacy in the statement.
if jesus existed, he was just a man.
if jesus existed, he was just a man.
Can hell be a physical reality if it defies the laws of nature?
(rethorical question)
(rethorical question)
mustafhakofi said:
Having a sword at that time was considered a natural thing. Jesus couldn't have given us the law of today, 2000 years ago. In the same way as Moses couldn't have given Jesus teachings to the people. It would have been too much for them. They wouldn't understand. Jesus said: "there are many thing which I want to say to you, but you cannot bear it yet. The holy spirit which I send to you, will teach you the rest."
Our own understanding. We ourselves, will learn the rest of God's law. One day, the religions of today will go away (just like Aztec and Sumerian and Greek religions have gone away) This is because we are changing. We are becoming better people. Some of the old laws, like the ones in the OT, almost seem evil, to most people. We have advanced so much. One day, we will not need religion at all, we will trust ourselves in every way. We will know ourselves, so we will know God.
If Jesus returns again, he will once again tell us much more. The law of God is not changing, but we are. We can understand more about the law of God. Consider the animals. They obey God in everyway, they are still with him. You see that they also kill. The law of animals cannot be compared to the law of humans. Animals don't have as much understanding as we. They obey God's law on animal level. Similarly, atoms also obey the law of God, but now, on material level (and so on)
So... 2000 years ago, we were also much different.
I guess you could say so. But don't you think humans can be all good? Jesus said that we are the temples of God, and that God lives within us. This way, all humans can become like God.
I think you raise a very interesting theological and scientific point there. After all, we humans are just animals ourselves, but there is a clear qualitative difference between the way that we humans behave and the way that animals behave, in that you would never (or only very rarely) state that anything an animal did was what we would regard as sinful or evil.Yorda said:
(I say "rarely" rather than "never" because on rare occasions, animals do behave wilfully and cause pain and destruction with no justification. I did hear of some chimpanzees where a childless female appeared to act with jealousy and stole a baby chimp and may have killed it. And there was the famous case of the Tsavo lions, "the Ghost" and "the Darkness", dramatised in the film of that name.)
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I doubt monitor size has anything to do with anything, although if you'd like to just fuck around with some "my penis is bigger than your penis" argument instead of paying attention to the actual discussion itself then fine. It is more to do with how many posts per page you have set up and perhaps screen resolution. All that aside Woody, monitor size is hardly a worthwhile issue to bring up.
Anyone with an internet connection has a dictionary handy. It did happen to say it's three goddesses. Do you deny that?
Much that that's very sweet, it goes completely against what I actually said - which if you missed it the first 30,000 times I shall put here yet again for you to try and digest:
"Sure, I have no idea what grace is".
Since when would any sane human consider that as a disagreement to anything? You're being an idiot Woody.
When do I say smorgasboard? I've never said it in my life. Oh well.
Ah, so clearly admitting that if anyone disagrees with you, you'll stop talking to them? True cowardice.
Not according to James.
No, but then he wasn't on the winning side when it came to determining the course and basic theology of two millennia of Christianity, was he?SnakeLord said:
Er, isn't it already like that in the largest, richest and most devout of all Christian nations???mustafhakofi said:
yes, woody lives there, I dont, and I did'nt want to upset him.
There are many instances of reality defying the laws of Nature, for example, the bumblebee which should not be able to fly by every concievable rule of dynamics, the miracles of Jesus which defied nature, and i am sure there are countless others.spuriousmonkey said:
LOL!Lawdog said:
How can something that exists in nature defy the laws of nature?
The bumblebee does NOT defy the laws of nature, nor does it defy "every conceivable" rule of dynamics.
I suggest you do some research on the matter, for example: http://www.news.cornell.edu/Chronicle/00/3.30.00/insect_flight.html or maybe http://www.apologeticspress.org/articles/2528
This is just another example of you failing to realise the fundamental concept that a "lack of evidence for" something is not "evidence to the contrary".
And even though YOU may be sure there are countless other things that are "defying the laws of Nature", try and understand that it might just be us not understanding exactly what those laws are.
Lawdog said:
Actually you are wrong here.
yes, but still no official findings? it is very likely, dont you agree,
that scientists contrived data and findings in order to contradict religious folk.
After the whole Evolution debacle that lasted for a over a century
(thank God its over), how can any scientist in the biology feild be trusted?
What will they claim next? That they know how birds or
monarch butterfly migrate over hundreds of miles?
that scientists contrived data and findings in order to contradict religious folk.
After the whole Evolution debacle that lasted for a over a century
(thank God its over), how can any scientist in the biology feild be trusted?
What will they claim next? That they know how birds or
monarch butterfly migrate over hundreds of miles?
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S/L: You're being an idiot Woody.
Woody: What's the difference between an idiot and a fool in your opinion?
S/L: Ah, so clearly admitting that if anyone disagrees with you, you'll stop talking to them?
Woody: Clearly saving ourselves a lot a keystrokes that don't make a bit of difference in the end. Nobody's mind is changed so what's the point, unless you just wanna fight for the heck of it.
Woody: What's the difference between an idiot and a fool in your opinion?
S/L: Ah, so clearly admitting that if anyone disagrees with you, you'll stop talking to them?
Woody: Clearly saving ourselves a lot a keystrokes that don't make a bit of difference in the end. Nobody's mind is changed so what's the point, unless you just wanna fight for the heck of it.
I fail to see the relevance.
That's hardly why you made the statement you did, and a discussion never really has to make that much of a difference. If you honestly thought you were going to come in here and start turning people into god fearing christians, you made a mistake - but that doesn't instantly negate any worth to discussion. "For the heck of it", is fine with me.
Anyway, getting back to James...