Is eeryone happy with the Big Bang? I'm not.

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prometheus said:
In reality of course, there is no preferred direction in the universe. As big as they are, effects like the great attractor are both small (the cosmological redshift is a far bigger effect) and local. Galaxy clusters effect each other gravitationally - that's not in doubt, but there isn't progressively bigger and bigger great attractors. All the evidence points to a homogeneous and isotropic universe at large scales. If you think that's wrong, provide some evidence to the contrary, and by evidence I don't mean more of your own waffle, I mean a real scientific paper or equivalent.
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Not the Universe, Prometheus - the Observable Universe. An infra red picture of the Observable Universe will show a deeper red at one end than the other. I believe this is called the Doppler Effect, and it shows the preffered direction of the Observable Universe.
As for Structure, the more they looked, the more structure they found, these Seven Samurai. Their leader, Sandra Faber, described an Observable Universe made of 'filaments' and 'voids,' an Observable Universethat resembled a Sponge. There has been so much Structure observed in Space that I think it puts your Cosmological Principal (the isotropic Cosmos) to bed.
And you think these structures don't become more massive as we move in? Of course they do. The Shapely Concentration is a much bigger mass than the Great Attractor, which is more massive than the Hydra Centaurus Super Cluster which is more massive than our Local Group including the Virgo Group.
This agrees completely with my thinking, that the center of the Universe evolved fastest.
 
astrocat said:
Not the Universe, Prometheus - the Observable Universe. An infra red picture of the Observable Universe will show a deeper red at one end than the other. I believe this is called the Doppler Effect, and it shows the preffered direction of the Observable Universe.
As for Structure, the more they looked, the more structure they found, these Seven Samurai. Their leader, Sandra Faber, described an Observable Universe made of 'filaments' and 'voids,' an Observable Universethat resembled a Sponge. There has been so much Structure observed in Space that I think it puts your Cosmological Principal (the isotropic Cosmos) to bed.
And you think these structures don't become more massive as we move in? Of course they do. The Shapely Concentration is a much bigger mass than the Great Attractor, which is more massive than the Hydra Centaurus Super Cluster which is more massive than our Local Group including the Virgo Group.
This agrees completely with my thinking, that the center of the Universe evolved fastest.
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Finding a citation should be easy then.
 
astrocat said:
I suppose some matter might become less dense over time, but I certainly never learned it in Physics Class. Got any proof?
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Do you have any proof you were ever in a physics class? All the evidence to date indicates you were not. If you only have a photograph of you with your mop and broom and janitor's uniform outside the room, that would help.
(My apologies to all janitors for this slur on their character.)
 
prometheus said:
Finding a citation should be easy then.
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Not soeasy as you might think. The article I would like you to read, the citation I would like to make, was written by James Gleik in the New York Times of Dec 2, 1986, where it was presented as a full two page spread- called 'Galaxies reported moving at High Speeds.'
You can read the first paragraph of the article if you google that title, but no more, as the article has been suppressed by Modern Scientists because of its content. Not just that, but they have deleted this article from the works of James Gleik.
Around this time COBE's much anticipated 'infra red' photograph was unveiled to certain NASA selected a. retentive science reporters for the first time. It showed a perfectly smooth, warm soupy Early Universe with no sign of any Clumps or Big Bangs.
The picture was presented as an Oval shaped photograph, pink of course, and not at all what these a.retentives had been expecting.
They laughed at this picture because it reminded them of one of the lozenge shaped supositories, that these a. retentives used.
Having had a good laugh, these same a.retentives physically took COBE's picture, and enlarged it, a portion of it, and enhanced it, over and over until some tiny marks were found, 'Quantum Ripples,' someone called these marks. Others privately suspected these marks were nothing more than abberations on COBE's lens. The meeting will always be famous for the excited Modern Scientist who claimed to have seen, in these marks, 'The Face of God!'
That picture of the Early Universe in Wiki is probably nothing more than the abberations on some Space Craft's lens.
 
Ophiolite said:
Do you have any proof you were ever in a physics class? All the evidence to date indicates you were not. If you only have a photograph of you with your mop and broom and janitor's uniform outside the room, that would help.
(My apologies to all janitors for this slur on their character.)
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I'm certainly not going to lower myself to your level by replying to that. You dissapoint me, Ophiolite.
 
astrocat said:
I'm certainly not going to lower myself to your level by replying to that. You dissapoint me, Ophiolite.
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It is a minor point, but you did just reply to that. At least you are consistent: no understanding of science, and now a demonstrated inability to understand language.

Seriously astrocat, you are a joke. If you are a troll, the joke has worn thin. If you are serious, you should seek professional help.
 
Ophiolite said:
It is a minor point, but you did just reply to that. At least you are consistent: no understanding of science, and now a demonstrated inability to understand language.

Seriously astrocat, you are a joke. If you are a troll, the joke has worn thin. If you are serious, you should seek professional help.
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And what have you ever come up with, Ophiolite?
 
phlogistician said:
Dodging the question has answered it, however.

You clearly have had little formal education in Science.
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I have a basic knowledge of Physics, and I find that satisfactory. In all this time, nobody has come up with an outward expansion that speeds up, a falling body that doesn't Speed Up, Cool Down, Expand and Lose Pressure, a way to explain the ridiculously low age they have given the Cosmos (a mere 13 billion years!) or any attempt to show me where I'm wrong, just a bunch of bald statements without any backing.
 
astrocat said:
I have a basic knowledge of Physics, and I find that satisfactory.
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You don't know what you don't know.
In all this time, nobody has come up with an outward expansion that speeds up,
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The early stage of an explosion, or pretty much any expansion.
a falling body that doesn't Speed Up, Cool Down, Expand and Lose Pressure,
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A cloud of gas collapsing on itself.
A balloon falling in atmosphere.
A thermally insulated balloon falling anywhere.
a way to explain the ridiculously low age they have given the Cosmos (a mere 13 billion years!)
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Try here
or any attempt to show me where I'm wrong, just a bunch of bald statements without any backing.
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Are we reading the same thread?
 
astrocat said:
And what have you ever come up with, Ophiolite?
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In this forum, or the world at large? I am not a practicing scientist, though I have often used scientific methodology in my work.

In this forum I have provided simple explanations to neophytes to scientific ideas; corrected incorrect expositions by others; engaged in lively debate with knowledgeable protagonists; vigorously attacked foolish posters whose arguments for ufos, alien abduction, Atlantis, the Face on Mars, ghosts, atrology, etc lack substance and logic; debunked creationist after creationist, and promoted the value of the scientific method.

In my work I have sought to convey the importance of integrity in any scientific investigation or engineering study to hundreds of subordinates and thousands of students.

What the fuck have you done?
 
Ophiolite said:
In this forum, or the world at large? I am not a practicing scientist, though I have often used scientific methodology in my work.

In this forum I have provided simple explanations to neophytes to scientific ideas; corrected incorrect expositions by others; engaged in lively debate with knowledgeable protagonists; vigorously attacked foolish posters whose arguments for ufos, alien abduction, Atlantis, the Face on Mars, ghosts, atrology, etc lack substance and logic; debunked creationist after creationist, and promoted the value of the scientific method.

In my work I have sought to convey the importance of integrity in any scientific investigation or engineering study to hundreds of subordinates and thousands of students.

What the fuck have you done?
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I discovered the Black Hole at the center of the Universe. There was no Big Bang, it was dreamed up by a Belgian Monsignor on hearing that the Observable universe was Expanding. Einstein's Cosmological Constant was denounced by Einstein himself, as his Biggest Blunder. Dark Energy was made up on news that the Expansion of the Observable Universe was increasing.

Sure, the Observable Universe is Expanding, but that's because it is falling into The Black Hole atthe Center of The Universe. Speeding Up leads to a drop in Pressure (Bernoulli) a Drop in Pressure is an Increase of Expansion, (The ideal gas law) and Expansion leads to Cooling Down, (the Joules Thomson Effect).

I realise how much you hate this idea. People like you and Steven Hawking who have devoted your lives to studying this Big Bang and Dark Energy are all wasting your time and getting nowhere. Steven Hawking even says Black Holes Evaporate and disappear. But where can we find a Galaxy that's unwinding because its Black Hole is shrinking? It's just hot-air.

Just as air approaching the nozzle of a vacuum cleaner Loses Pressure and Expands, the Observable Universe is doing the exact same thing. Notice please, that this kind of Expansion Starts Slowly and Speeds Up - again, just what the Observable Universe is doing.

Your concept that the Cosmos is smooth and isotropic went out the window years ago. The more you look, the more structure you will find. So much for the Cosmological Principle.

Really, if you could see the Big Bang the way I see it you'd soon be agreeing with me. This idea has been around for almost a hundred years now, and believe me, they didn't know much a hundred years ago.

Well, there you go. There's no such thing as an Outward Expansion that Speeds Up - the concept defies Nature and Physics both. It's simply impossible that the Cosmos' age could only be 13 billion years old. The Cosmos is trillions of years old, with some ofthe youngest stars being 20-40 billion years old.

Really, I don't know how you can believe all that. Your Cosmos is ruled by anti-gravity, and mine is ruled by Gravity. Which one do you think is more real? Looking in Wiki, at the curve of the Expansion, it's plain they think the Expansion Sped Up in 1998. That's ridiculous - the Observable Universe's Expansion has always been Speeding Up.

I don't know. You've obviously been 'juiced" in this Big Bang probably all your life, and never had enough imagination to look at any alternative - certainly not the Truth. So keep on believing in your silly Big Bang, why don't you, and leave the discoveries to people who know better.
 
Pete said:
You don't know what you don't know.

The early stage of an explosion, or pretty much any expansion.

A cloud of gas collapsing on itself.
A balloon falling in atmosphere.
A thermally insulated balloon falling anywhere.

Try here

Are we reading the same thread?
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A ballon falling in atmophere is subject to the forces of the atmosphere, and obviously will not fall freely because of these other forces. Take away these distractions, and your baloon will fall just like a feather or a hammer - or a rubber ball.

Let's see, you talk about the age of the Universe... Earth is 5 billion years old, and will probably go on existing for another five billion years. I don't have any problem ascribing a 10 billion year life span to Earth. Do you, if so, I'd like to hear it?

Now, if Earth was made from the 'ejecta' of an exhausted, blown up Star, then that Star could only have died 5 billion years ago. That means said Star was created only 8 billion years ago. After 8 billion years it died? Planets live longer than Stars? Is this what you believe?
 
astrocat said:
A ballon falling in atmophere is subject to the forces of the atmosphere, and obviously will not fall freely because of these other forces.
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You didn't ask for a freely falling body. If you want to be scientific, you need to be precise.
Take away these distractions, and your baloon will fall just like a feather or a hammer - or a rubber ball.
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A thermally insulated balloon falling into a gravity well won't cool down, expand, or lose pressure.

A cloud of gas collapsing on itself will heat up, compress, and gain pressure.

And I notice you're still ignoring the accelerating expansion of an explosion in its early stages.

Let's see, you talk about the age of the Universe... Earth is 5 billion years old, and will probably go on existing for another five billion years. I don't have any problem ascribing a 10 billion year life span to Earth. Do you, if so, I'd like to hear it?

Now, if Earth was made from the 'ejecta' of an exhausted, blown up Star, then that Star could only have died 5 billion years ago. That means said Star was created only 8 billion years ago. After 8 billion years it died? Planets live longer than Stars? Is this what you believe?
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It doesn't matter what I believe. I'm just here to poke holes in your logic, and point out mainstream science that says large stars have short lifetimes. (Wikipedia)

Do you believe that a 25 solar mass star will not go supernova in around ten million years?


I discovered the Black Hole at the center of the Universe...
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Astrocat, you're seriously deluded . You don't know what you don't know.
 
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