Is Buddhism a Failure?

S.A.M. said:
So when you go to a Buddhist temple the statue of the Buddha refers to any awoken one?
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Temples are just there to keep the faithful off the streets and the monks in food.

But yes any one who has awoken is a buddha and there are often statues for other buddhas besides Gautama, though a lot of people use photos these days. Also you don't have to be a Buddhist. Buddhism makes no claim that it has the patent on enlightenment and the Buddha was straight forward in saying that he should not be revered or worshipped, not that they pew sitters were paying attention while they wrote it down for posterity.

A religion is not successful in relation to other religions. Only in relation to itself.
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So we agree all religions are failures.
 
Enmos said:
Yes, but I'm pretty sure he/she/it wouldn't be very pleased.
I edited btw :)
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That depends on what you believe. :rolleyes:

Ultimately the only truth that we believe in is the one that convinces us. I believe in a universe based on order and reason, not randomness. I believe in a religion where truth is arrived at by educated consensus and social order by discipline, justice and responsibility. So I choose the religion which most clearly reflects my values.

If I no longer uphold those values the reasoning for failure is no longer relevant to me.
 
S.A.M. said:
That depends on what you believe. :rolleyes:
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No, it depends on the religion.

S.A.M. said:
Ultimately the only truth that we believe in is the one that convinces us. I believe in a universe based on order and reason, not randomness. I believe in a religion where truth is arrived at by educated consensus and social order by discipline, justice and responsibility. So I choose the religion which most clearly reflects my values.

If I no longer uphold those values the reasoning for failure is no longer relevant to me.
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So you really do not believe in any god then ? Are you actually an atheist that is just following a religion because it's appealing ?
 
Enmos said:
No, it depends on the religion.
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If I do not believe that Christ is divine I do not believe that drinking wine is drinking his blood.
So you really do not believe in any god then ? Are you actually an atheist ?
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Of course not. I have no idea what atheists believe in. They make little or no sense to me.
 
S.A.M. said:
If I do not believe that Christ is divine I do not believe that drinking wine is drinking his blood.
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Then you fail Christianity.

S.A.M. said:
Of course not. I have no idea what atheists believe in.
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Sorry, I edited again.
What you said there sure sounds like you don't actually believe in a god. It sounds like you just find Islam appealing to be involved in. And that you will discard it when you can no longer identify with it.
 
Enmos said:
Then you fail Christianity.
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Thats quite alright since I never believed in it. As such failing something I do not believe in is unconvincing and irrelevant to me.

Sorry, I edited again.
What you said there sure sounds like you don't actually believe in a god. It sounds like you just find Islam appealing to be involved in.
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I would not call it appealing so much as convincing. Appealing is for apple pie. Convincing is for values and a philosophy of life. I believe in the religion of Islam.
And that you will discard it when you can no longer identify with it.
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Thats true for anyone who adopts any values.
 
S.A.M. said:
Thats quite alright since I never believed in it. As such failing something I do not believe in is unconvincing and irrelevant to me.
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In the same way, you will fail Islam when you discard it one day.

S.A.M. said:
I would not call it appealing so much as convincing. Appealing is for apple pie. Convincing is for values and a philosophy of life. I believe in the religion of Islam.

Thats true for anyone who adopts any values.
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So you are not necessarily faithful to Allah then ?
I thought you were supposed to devote your life to him ?
 
Enmos said:
So you are not necessarily faithful to Allah then ?
I thought you were supposed to devote your life to him ?
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How do you arrive at "So you are not necessarily faithful to Allah" from "I believe in the religion of Islam"?
 
S.A.M. said:
How do you arrive at "So you are not necessarily faithful to Allah" from "I believe in the religion of Islam"?
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Because you say that you'll discard the religion if you no longer identify with it.
When you do that you'll have failed Islam and therefor Allah.
 
S.A.M. said:
:wallbang: if I no longer believed, why would I care?
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Does it matter to Allah whether you care or not ? You'll be an infidel to him regardless.
You're are arguing like you don't really believe in Allah. More like you just joined some club.
 
Enmos said:
Does it matter to Allah whether you care or not ?
You're are arguing like you don't really believe in Allah. More like you just joined some club.
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I'm explaining how the institution works. Its called objectivity.
 
S.A.M. said:
I'm explaining how the institution works. Its called objectivity.
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That's not how religion works. If you fail your religion you fail your god, simple as that. The only way you can disagree is if you don't really believe.
 
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