Is Atheism Irrelavent?

[Seattle]

It is time for atheists to prove they are capable of telling the truth.
Do they never have Near Death experiences?
Do they never see ghosts?

Only people who believe in ghosts see ghosts. New Death experiences happen to (some) people who are near death. How you interpret that depends on the individual. There are physical reasons for the near death experience...it isn't God.

Really, the answer to everything isn't God.

 

[Robittybob1]

Only people who believe in ghosts see ghosts. New Death experiences happen to (some) people who are near death. How you interpret that depends on the individual. There are physical reasons for the near death experience...it isn't God.

Really, the answer to everything isn't God.

They keep telling me they are moral people but I have yet to hear an atheist say "I don't ever tell lies".
Well then do atheists not believe in ghosts? How would we know if they can't tell the truth? I have heard of atheists becoming believers after near death experiences.

 

[Seattle]

They keep telling me they are moral people but I have yet to hear an atheist say "I don't ever tell lies".
Well then do atheists not believe in ghosts? How would we know if they can't tell the truth? I have heard of atheists becoming believers after near death experiences.

They are people just like everyone else. Who walks around saying "I don't ever tell lies?". That would probably be a lie This view of atheists is childish.

Many people are fooled by many things. Having a near death experience means nothing. "The Amazing Randi" thought he had an out of body experience even though he doesn't believe in them.

He had to think about it before he realized what had actually happened. He thought he rose out of his bed and could observe the bedroom from the ceiling. He described it to his family. He described the patterns of the sheets on his bed and several other things.

It seemed real until someone pointed out that the things he described weren't in his room on that particular night. He owned those things and therefore those images were in his brain but they weren't in his bedroom on that night.

That's the way it works with our brains. We can think an experience was real when it was not.

 

[Robittybob1]

They are people just like everyone else. Who walks around saying "I don't ever tell lies?". That would probably be a lie This view of atheists is childish.

Many people are fooled by many things. Having a near death experience means nothing. "The Amazing Randi" thought he had an out of body experience even though he doesn't believe in them.

He had to think about it before he realized what had actually happened. He thought he rose out of his bed and could observe the bedroom from the ceiling. He described it to his family. He described the patterns of the sheets on his bed and several other things.

It seemed real until someone pointed out that the things he described weren't in his room on that particular night. He owned those things and therefore those images were in his brain but they weren't in his bedroom on that night.

That's the way it works with our brains. We can think an experience was real when it was not.

You and I are on this mission together remember. We are still waiting for the dream that is a possible premonition. Your dream or mine let's see if it can be proven.
What would happen in your life if you had to choose/vow that every word passing your lips were to be the truth? No more "pulling sickies" to get a day off work. No more excuses not based on truth. Yes there is a cost in telling the truth?
Then once you have mastered that try not coveting anyone's property.

Why are atheists finding telling the 100% truth so difficult? I can see it, since there is no "God" to punish them, there is no incentive to tell the truth, for lying is more profitable and convenient. But then how can they claim to be moral? What morals are they talking about?

 

[Seattle]

You and I are on this mission together remember. We are still waiting for the dream that is possible premonition. Your dream or mine let's see if it can be proven.
What would happen in your life if you had to choose that every word passing your lips were truth? No more "pulling sickies" to get a day off work. No more excuses not based on truth. Yes there is a cost in telling the truth?
Then once you have mastered that try not coverting anyone's property.

Why are atheists finding telling the truth so difficult. I can see it, since there is no "God" to punish them, there is no incentive to tell the truth, for lying becomes more profitable. But then how can they claim to be moral? What morals are they talking about?

You are the one claiming that theists are more moral than atheists. I see no large group of atheists who aren't telling the truth. I think you keep trying to convince yourself of this for some reason.

They are just as moral (or more so) than theists.

 

[Robittybob1]

You are the one claiming that theists are more moral than atheists. I see no large group of atheists who aren't telling the truth. I think you keep trying to convince yourself of this for some reason.

They are just as moral (or more so) than theists.

I'm not comparing them to theists or Buddhists or Zen Masters or whatever, no I am just comparing them to myself. Can they operate as I do without ever lying?

Last week I was banned and everyone as far as I could tell was lying in one way or the other. How can we get truth to be at the top of our concerns?

Maybe James R did not lie but work was done under his name (so I was thinking it was him). Like to operate a sock puppet would be lying to me.

 

[Seattle]

I'm not comparing them to theists or Buddhists or Zen Masters or whatever, no I am just comparing them to myself. Can they operate as I do without ever lying?

Last week I was banned and everyone as far as I could tell was lying in one way or the other. How can we get truth to be at the top of our concerns?

Maybe James R did not lie but work was done under his name (so I was thinking it was him). Like to operate a sock puppet would be lying to me.

Dividing the world into theists and non-theists isn't going to tell you very much. It's not a useful distinction in most cases.

 

[Robittybob1]

Dividing the world into theists and non-theists isn't going to tell you very much. It's not a useful distinction in most cases.

That is right, all I'm looking for is someone to say "I'm going to tell the truth, the whole truth and bloody well mean it". Lots of people say I'm lying but they don't (can't ) show the actual example. Sometimes there could be a minor error in the written form for sometimes I forget to include the word "NOT" in a sentence, or make a sentence with a double negative in it and the meaning gets a bit confusing. But my writing technique has continued to get clearer and clearer as time goes on.

 

[Beer w/Straw]

As long as you can always convince yourself of a double meaning, you can lie all you want.

Then you can cover it up in a spew of posts -purposely of course.

 

[Yazata]

Since nothing spiritual has ever been shown to exist, you can define it anyway you want and it will still be nonsense.

I'm not convinced that the word 'spirituality' in its modern usage can be equated with belief in 'spirit beings'.

The 'spirit' family of ideas has a long and fascinating history. In ancient times, the word originally meant something like 'life force'. It was imagined as what animated living bodies, made them capable of moving on their own, and made them conscious and aware. Spirit was often identified with the breath, since death occurred when breathing stopped. We have the imagery in the Bible and elsewhere that had creator gods "breathing" life into inanimate bodies to give them life. And there was an idea that one's life force could drift off like a gas, either during 'out-of-body' experiences or when death occurred. So the idea of ghosts and vaporous spectral spirits appeared. Angels and even gods themselves were sometimes imagined as spirits of this sort. We see the idea developing in the Jewish tradition that God's breath or 'spirit' is kind of an intermediary between heaven and this world. That suggested Christianity's idea of the 'holy spirit', which naturally directed attention to the idea of people who had supposedly been touched by this holy spirit. And that idea of people infused with the holy spirit was associated with the early emergence of the idea of spirituality.

In the modern period, the early Christian idea of spirituality has changed dramatically. Emphasis moved away from pneumatology, from a concentration on the divine gas that had supposedly flowed out of heaven and entered into and animated living things, particularly the Christian reborn and reanimated by the holy spirit, to a new concern with the behavior that these Christians were supposed to display. The whole idea of spirituality became psychologized as the metaphysical theory of pneumatology faded away and was replaced by modern biology's understanding of life.

This new psychologized idea of spirituality has gradually become disassociated from the Christian tradition and has broadened out to the point where people today speak easily of all varieties of non-Christian spirituality. What the word 'spirituality' seems to suggest today is the idea of inner transformation. Some people see the meaning of 'spirituality' as being broader than 'religion', which can suggest the doctrines of a single narrow faith tradition. Others see spirituality as referring to the heart and essence of any and all religion, to religion's inner experiential core. Today the word 'spirituality' is even commonly used in more secular contexts such as psychology and art, where it typically refers to feelings of, and to the cultural artifacts capable of invoking, feelings of transcendence and/or psychological centeredness.

 

[Robittybob1]

As long as you can always convince yourself of a double meaning, you can lie all you want.

Then you can cover it up in a spew of posts -purposely of course.

Like you know why you used these words in the current quoted post. Whether I believe them or not, doesn't matter for you know what you intended. Just like when I deliberately write posts with double meanings, allowing you to choose whichever meaning you think I'm saying. But in the end it told me what I had wanted to know; that is whether you were male or female and you revealed yourself (unless you were meaning to deceive all of us).
But Bells confirmed it, so I'm fairly certain. So you were finally outed after 3 years of picking on me, after 3 years I found you.

 

[Balerion]

What would happen in your life if you had to choose/vow that every word passing your lips were to be the truth? No more "pulling sickies" to get a day off work. No more excuses not based on truth. Yes there is a cost in telling the truth?
Then once you have mastered that try not coveting anyone's property.

This really is all moot because you've been caught out in lies here already. If you can't be honest in such an inconsequential setting as this, there's no reason to believe you tell the truth in the real world. But given the question, I have to wonder if you've ever been in a relationship, romantic or otherwise. No one tells the truth all the time, because telling the truth isn't always in everyone's best interests. You'd know that if you'd ever had a normal social interaction in your life, but I'm genuinely doubtful of that now.

And what's wrong with coveting someone else's property?

Why are atheists finding telling the 100% truth so difficult? I can see it, since there is no "God" to punish them, there is no incentive to tell the truth, for lying is more profitable and convenient. But then how can they claim to be moral? What morals are they talking about?

So you're saying now that atheists have no moral center? Overwhelming evidence to the contrary exists all around you. It's up to you to show how morality is somehow exclusive to believers.

 

[Robittybob1]

This really is all moot because you've been caught out in lies here already. If you can't be honest in such an inconsequential setting as this, there's no reason to believe you tell the truth in the real world. But given the question, I have to wonder if you've ever been in a relationship, romantic or otherwise. No one tells the truth all the time, because telling the truth isn't always in everyone's best interests. You'd know that if you'd ever had a normal social interaction in your life, but I'm genuinely doubtful of that now.

And what's wrong with coveting someone else's property?



So you're saying now that atheists have no moral center? Overwhelming evidence to the contrary exists all around you. It's up to you to show how morality is somehow exclusive to believers.

That is the point Balerion, people accuse me of lying but they don't show me the example, the actual lie as such.
OK you came very close for I had virtually referred to the 10 year old as "Lover Girl" but it still had a degree of separation, but it was too close. So I appreciated your challenge on me then.
No Balerion, at every point in my day I tell the truth. In the Beautiful Christian Songs thread I write about having romantic relationships, (sometimes dating 3 women at the same time). Now in circumstances like that it does get tricky to tell the truth, but the truth is essential.
Now when I was dating the married woman was the most difficult to justify with everyone. Could that be done and be sin free?

Coveting means "planning to steal" in my way of thinking, or something like that. If it is not in the rubbish it's got to be returned to the owner.

 

[Beer w/Straw]

Deceive?

Heck, I still remember when I told AlphaNumeric my real name. Stop hanging around RealityCheck and you'll get banned less.

 

[Beer w/Straw]

after 3 years I found you.

Was I hiding?

 

[Robittybob1]

Deceive?

Heck, I still remember when I told AlphaNumeric my real name. Stop hanging around RealityCheck and you'll get banned less.

RealityCheck hangs around me not the other way around. I don't know your name sorry.
But this is all off topic and more suited to PM really.

Atheism is when there is no God to stop one from lying. So are you a theist or an atheist?

 

[Robittybob1]

Was I hiding?

My cat stays asleep, probably not intentionally hiding but she can easily go missed. And then later I find she has peed inside!

 

[Beer w/Straw]

RealityCheck hangs around me not the other way around. I don't know your name sorry.
But this is all off topic and more suited to PM really.

Atheism is when there is no God to stop one from lying. So are you a theist or an atheist?

Neither. If you thought there was no God would you go around killing, raping, stealing, lying etc?

 

[Balerion]

That is the point Balerion, people accuse me of lying but they don't show me the example, the actual lie as such.
OK you came very close for I had virtually referred to the 10 year old as "Lover Girl" but it still had a degree of separation, but it was too close. So I appreciated your challenge on me then.
No Balerion, at every point in my day I tell the truth. In the Beautiful Christian Songs thread I write about having romantic relationships, (sometimes dating 3 women at the same time). Now in circumstances like that it does get tricky to tell the truth, but the truth is essential.
Now when I was dating the married woman was the most difficult to justify with everyone. Could that be done and be sin free?

I don't follow your thread, so you'll forgive me for not being up-to-date on your fiction. Your lies have been laid bare, however; this is not in question. Even if we took you at your word (we don't), your intentional choice to mislead through "double-meaning" is dishonest. And besides, you were caught registering sock puppets and have lied about it since, so, again, it's not up for debate.

Why is the truth essential?

Coveting means "planning to steal" in my way of thinking, or something like that. If it is not in the rubbish it's got to be returned to the owner.

Oh, so again we have a theist rewriting the dictionary to make a superficial point.

 

[Robittybob1]

I don't follow your thread, so you'll forgive me for not being up-to-date on your fiction. Your lies have been laid bare, however; this is not in question. Even if we took you at your word (we don't), your intentional choice to mislead through "double-meaning" is dishonest. And besides, you were caught registering sock puppets and have lied about it since, so, again, it's not up for debate.

Why is the truth essential?



Oh, so again we have a theist rewriting the dictionary to make a superficial point.

You are missing out on a chance of salvation. No lies have been laid bare, so stop telling lies. Double meaning posts are not lying in my language.
"And besides, you were caught registering sock puppets and have lied about it since, so, again, it's not up for debate." No that has been sorted out with the moderators and Carol.Robson is registered and will post in due time, There were never any sock puppets and Bells has sorted it for Carol and I.
I suffered a week long ban for a genuine misunderstanding.

"Why is the truth essential?" Lying seemed to be the worst sin possible. So it was something that could not be justified, so I vowed to "God" to never lie, unless it was to save someone's life.