How convincing for a proof of UFOs does this sound, AS A WHOLE?

[goofyfish]

You asked me to show you a credible Poll, to back up my previous statement. Did I not provide you this?

Not at all. CNN claims that polling 1024 people justifies the statement that 80% of
all Americans believe the government is withholding information? Laughable, really.

:m: Peace.

 

[VRob]

Goofyfish,

This is the same method they use for all those Political Polls we'll be seeing over the next 8 months. Laugh all you want, but I have yet to have anyone ask me for my political opinion for a Poll.

You know, you debunkers are really pathetic. I provide you with the evidence you asked for, but you're still not happy.

What do you want? Another Poll?? I can find many more if you'd like. I selected this one simply because it was from CNN, and I was in a hurry.

 

[goofyfish]

Pathetic? Your observation about political polls is on the mark, but you refuse to see how it relates to your original comment. You have never been polled? Amazing - neither have I. So what makes you think that asking 1024 people out of the estimated 292,610,159 people in this country is in any way representative of the beliefs of the entire nation? I don't see it. And I am not a debunker in any way. I merely ask that someone who makes sweeping statements of fact support their statements. You cannot, so you resort to name-calling when you know nothing about me.

:m: Think again about who might be pathetic.

 

[blackholesun]

Your last 4 words are 100% INCORRECT!!

There is plenty of VERY Credible evidence. Have you ever read a book on the subject? I'm not talking about some abduction case, or some other fringe article. I'm talking about a book that goes back to the beginning and steps you through the subject from day 1 up to today? I think you might be very surprised by what you learn. And trust me, you have much to learn on this subject.

Here's a couple for you to ponder:

Above Top Secret, by Timothy Good.
Blank Check, (Author ??) - Attempts to follow the money with regards to Black Projects.
Alien Agenda, by Jim Marrs.
Above Black, (Author ??)

Most of these books do not attempt to make any sensational assumptions. They mearly state the facts on this issue, and how it has been handled by the Military and intelligence communities.

One key FACT I've found in reading these books is this. You don't tell your deepest secrets to Elected Officials. This includes Presidents!

Science is facts; just as houses are made of stones, so is science made of facts; but a pile of stones is not a house and a collection of facts is not necessarily science.
Henri Poincare (1854 - 1912)

The quote explains so well why this thread sits where it is. So why does money moved to black projects suggest alien life the government is hiding? If we have a rather advanced aircraft in development, I don't want anyone else knowing about it either.

 

[VRob]

Goofyfish, Here's another Poll for your entertainment. However, I'm sure you'll find something wrong with this one too.

http://www.freedomofinfo.org/poll.html

Here's a question:

Do most of those 292,000,000 people consider the CNN Political Polls to be accurate with about 3% accuracy?? I believe they do. They certainly must, because you and I both know that EVERY news media in the Nation will be bombarding us with these same Polls on a daily basis over the next 8 months. Then why shouldn't the poll I provided you be given the same respect? Does it have something to do with the subject matter??

 

[goofyfish]

Do most of those 292,000,000 people consider the CNN Political Polls to be accurate with about 3% accuracy?? I believe they do.

A belief based on no facts.

You are missing the point. Badly. It is not the source of the poll, it is the sample size. How can questioning .0003% of the people in this country provide any meaningful data with regards to the opinions of an entire population. It cannot. I put no more faith in this poll than I do in any other polls - the subject matter is irrelevant.

:m: Peace.

 

[VRob]

So why does money moved to black projects suggest alien life the government is hiding? If we have a rather advanced aircraft in development, I don't want anyone else knowing about it either.

You've obviously NEVER read any of the books I've listed here. Specifically, Blank Check. It doesn't SIMPLY state that certain monies were contracted for this project and that, it attempts to follow the money from its source, to its FINAL Destination. Often times, it hits a dead end, however many times that dead end becomes very suspisious.

You people amaze me sometimes. Do any of you realize how a trial works? You combine different types of evidence relating to a similar subject matter. Many times there is ZERO hard evidence, yet there is enough evidence to convict. I am not trying to PROVE my issue here. If I could do that, then the subject would no longer unknown. We'd have absolute proof. However, because I can't PROVE the issue, doesn't mean it isn't true?

Was OJ really innocent because he was found Not Guilty? IMO, what you people are debating here is that this issue CANNOT be real, simply because there is no PROOF. :bugeye: But what I'm trying to show you people is that there IS Plenty of evidence, from multiple sources. When you tie these multiple sources of evidence together, you come up with a case, and in this case, there is absolutely no doubt that there's something going on relating to this subject.

 

[VRob]

A belief based on no facts.

Correction - It is not a belief. It is a conclusion I've drawn, from the thousands of available facts!

Please answer these questions:

Do you put ANY Credibility into any of the Political Polls we'll be seeing?

Do you think the population of this nation puts any credibility into these Political Polls? If so, what percentage of the population?

 

[goofyfish]

Correction - It is not a belief. It is a conclusion I've drawn, from the thousands of available facts!

Please show the thousands of facts that show people consider the CNN Political Polls to be accurate with about 3% accuracy

Do you put ANY Credibility into any of the Political Polls we'll be seeing?

I have already said that I do not, and the question is irrelevant to the discussion.

Do you think the population of this nation puts any credibility into these Political Polls?

Unfortunately, they do, and they allow themselves to be swayed by polls without pausing to think about the overall methodolgy. And the question is irrelevant to the discussion.

My question: Do you, VROB, believe that a sample size of 3/10000ths of a percent of the total provides data accurate enough to draw an absolute conclusion?

:m: Peace.

 

[blackholesun]

You've obviously NEVER read any of the books I've listed here. Specifically, Blank Check. It doesn't SIMPLY state that certain monies were contracted for this project and that, it attempts to follow the money from its source, to its FINAL Destination. Often times, it hits a dead end, however many times that dead end becomes very suspisious.

Isn't that the whole point of black projects? So you DON'T know what the money is being spent on? Since you read the books, what is suspisious about some of the money trails?

Was OJ really innocent because he was found Not Guilty?

No, OJ was found innocent because of incompetent jury members worried more about race and Mark Fuhrman.

IMO, what you people are debating here is that this issue CANNOT be real, simply because there is no PROOF.

Well how do we know the issue is real without proof? Faith? [insert string theory joke here....]

 

[VRob]

No, OJ was found innocent because of incompetent jury members worried more about race and Mark Fuhrman.

But there was NO CONCERETE Proof! How could they have been incompetent? Are you saying they couldn't put the evidence together?

Well how do we know the issue is real without proof? Faith?

EVIDENCE!

You have contradicted yourself with these two above statements.

 

[VRob]

Goofyfish,

You asked me to provide proof for a statement I made regarding the populations thoughts on the UFO Subject. I provided you the only means I think I could. A Poll, done by a respected News media(CNN).

My comments on your use of the word 'Belief' had NOTHING to do with these Polls. I was speaking on my specific opinion of the subject, drawn from the evidence. NOT on a belief.

 

[goofyfish]

But you did not answer my question: Do you believe that a sample size of 3/10000ths of a percent of the total provides data accurate enough to draw an absolute conclusion?

:m: Peace.

 

[VRob]

But you did not answer my question: Do you believe that a sample size of 3/10000ths of a percent of the total provides data accurate enough to draw an absolute conclusion?

:m: Peace.

I believe it's accurate to a point, but I do not put 100% credibility into any poll that uses such a small percentage of people.

Anyways, I'm done with this Poll discussion. Is there any other comment of mine you'd like to address?

 

[goofyfish]

I believe it's accurate to a point, but I do not put 100% credibility into any poll that uses such a small percentage of people.

Yet you did just that when you stated that more Americans believe that the government is withholding information than those that don't. Accepting information that is presented as "fact" without considering the source or the methodology is useless. I don't know if aliens exist or not. There is no hard evidence either way. If you choose to "believe" that aliens exist, I have no problem with that. But you cannot mistake bad science and anecdotal presentations as proofs that support your beliefs.

I, too, am finished. Thanks for your time.

:m: Peace.

 

[blackholesun]

But there was NO CONCERETE Proof! How could they have been incompetent? Are you saying they couldn't put the evidence together?

Very much so they were incompetent. There was concerete proof in the victims' DNA and OJs DNA (blood, hair, his actions after the murders). But because of Mark Fuhrman's past as a racist, the jury ignored all the evidence. Just look at what some jurors said after the trial, that they voted not guilty because of Mark Fuhrman and the fact that the black jurors thought he was involved in a conspiracy.

http://www.cnn.com/US/OJ/

The wrongful death trial cleared that up though.

EVIDENCE!

You have contradicted yourself with these two above statements.

What I want is concrete evidence...not implied.

 

[VRob]

Yet you did just that when you stated that more Americans believe that the government is withholding information than those that don't. Accepting information that is presented as "fact" without considering the source or the methodology is useless.

What I did was provide you with a article/poll that is accepted by the majority of citizens. It's irrelevent whether you or I consider it credible.

 

[VRob]

Very much so they were incompetent. There was concerete proof in the victims' DNA and OJs DNA (blood, hair, his actions after the murders.

I didn't follow the trial, in fact, I thought it was an absolute joke that it was headline news for over a year. What an pathetic country we live in.

However, I'm confused how you consider OJ's actions after the murder to be in any way 'Concrete proof' of anything?

 

[blackholesun]

The cops came to question him and he and his friend led them on a car chase in the famous white Bronco. Actually his friend drove, and he hid in the back seat the entire trip.

 

[spudbud21]

Captain, I have only read the first few pages but this seems pretty Sci-fi to me.