"out of Israel" being an important difference. The Nazis didn't expell the Jews from their territories: the imprisoned them within their territories, where they could be systematically exterminated.Gaza has an elected government, and a political status recognized by the UN. It is not an internment camp inside Israel.
And yet,
citizens have no freedom of movement in and out of Gaza.
In response to warfare launched on Israel from Gaza. Not a feature of the Warsaw Ghetto.
How are babies and little children in Gaza guilty of warfare? No free movement of foodstuffs into Gaza. The same as Warsaw.
Also, where is Egypt in all this? Israel only controls three of Gaza's borders. Egypt controls the other one. So how is it that Israel is responsible for supplying a self-governing territory that it doesn't control all the borders of?
The Jews had no freedom of movement across foreign borders either.
Which works out to about 1200 calories a day; a lot more than the Warsaw Jews got. More to the point, where are the reports of Gazans actually dying of starvation? I have no trouble finding bombastic rhetoric using the term, but I have yet to see any evidence that Gazans are literally dying of hunger as occurred in the Warsaw Ghetto.
Degrees of hunger are irrelevant in the face of willful enforcement of utterly insufficient specified calorific intake.
Likewise, there are international organizations operating in Gaza and feeding people. Hence the UN report. Not something the Nazis permitted in the Warsaw Ghetto.
And, again, where are the Egyptians in all this?
This is a relatively fair distinction.
But - again - Israel does not control all of Gaza's access to the outside world. Egypt also has a say.
Egypt is irrelevant to this discussion. The comparison is between Israel, who is willingly and knowingly restricting water and electricity.
Moreover, if Gaza is to be an independent state, it's going to have to get used to not relying on Israel for utilities. The equation of Palestinian territories with the Warsaw Ghetto infantilizes the Palestinians in an offensive way.
If Gaza had unrestricted borders to conduct open commerce, perhaps it could attempt to pursue infrastructure.
Are they to be a sovereign nation, or simply a rhetorical bludgeon for you to edify your self-righteousness with?
?
That's a pretty ridiculous equivocation, even for you.
Is that a refutation or just the usual hot air?
Don't be ridiculous: Hamas has hardly been "crushed" as a "rebellion." They still rule the territory in question, brandish arms openly, etc.
1400 casualties in a severely congested area
is crushing.
And it's not like rebellions and responses are some unique feature of the Holocaust or something. That exact type of thing has occurred in countless different contexts throughout history.
That`s irrelevant to this discussion.
Again, hardly unique to the Holocaust or Nazis. That stuff has been a standard feature of warfare for centuries, all over the world.
We are focusing on one particular comparison here.
Again, hardly unique. Chauvinism is commonplace, the world over. The Arabs assign the Jewish people to a lesser status, for example.
Which does not change the validity of the comparison.
Now this is becoming vague to the point of irrelevancy. Determined belligerents throughout history have "applied whatever was at their means to break the will of" their opponents.
The Allies used whatever was at their means to break the will of the Nazis, for example. Including the indiscriminate firebombing of entire cities.
This is clearly occurring under the barricade conditions, with associated hunger, medical and economic conditions, and of course, physical assault.
Not really, no. They easily have the firepower to kill and destroy everything in Gaza, so that's the result you should expect if they cease to discriminate.
But they have, and do commit war crimes, including indiscriminate attacks on civilians and children, as recently noted in the Goldstone report.
It's not the same situation. If it were, the Palestinians would have been physically eliminated decades ago. Instead, their population flourishes, they govern their own territories, etc.
Not even close to flourishing. A people cannot flourish under circumstances of being barricaded, with accompanying, limitations on medical treatment and supplies, food and water and inadequate education.
And many Human Rights organizations have condemned these conditions, with hardly a whisper of protest from the world.
That's because the world, for the most part, didn't know what was afoot until afterwards. The Nazis weren't in the business of allowing permanent UN humanitarian missions in the Ghettos and camps.
It is common knowledge that the world was aware of certain, if not all aspects of the Endlösung, Jewish ghettos and concentration camps, with notable figures, like Oscar Schindler, standing out in saving Jews from extermination.
War crimes are not the same thing as systematic elimination of a population.
Since 1948, via various methods, there has been systematic, displacement and elimination of Palestinians by the Israeli state.
It was the Allies that charged the Nazis with war crimes, not "the Jews."
Initially yes, but then it was both the Allies and Jewish organizations, which continue to this day, Eli Wiesel being a prime example, and rightly so.
Exactly: you make a (tenuous) comparison with one small aspect of the Holocaust, and then try to leverage this to equate Israel with the Nazis. This is dishonest, because when people here the term "Holocaust," they understand it to refer to death camps and systematic liquidation of a minority, not just certain aspects of the Warsaw Ghetto.
There are any number of other instances of marginalization and oppression that would be more exact comparisons for the situation, and which would not carry the bombastic implications of industrialized extermination. But you never bother with those.
Yes, you have a point here, but the comparison is far from tenuous and I am far from being the only one to voice it.
So... what? This requires you to blow the situation out of proportion by invoking the Holocaust at any pretext? How does that help?
The recent Gaza assault remains indicative of the potential threat to innocent Palestinians. Which is in simple terms, murder and execution of a defenceless population.
No, what you laid out was a comparison to the Warsaw Ghetto, which is only a small (and not particularly unique or salient) aspect of the Holocaust. When you refer to the "gross injustice of the Holocaust," people understand that to refer to the industrialized liquidation of a minority population.
No, that is your interpretation. It refers to gross injustice, including constant imprisonment, starvation, and willful murder of the weak by the strong.
Jews were living in ghettos all over Europe for hundreds and hundreds of years, and nobody considers that to be part of the Holocaust.
The first pogrom against the Jews occurred in 38CE. It is widely recognized that the holocaust was the culmination of violent Antisemitism going way back in time. This historic and consistent Antisemitism, being a major factor in establishing Israel as a save haven for Jews. Unfortunately, to the detriment of the Palestinians.
