Well apparently, all we need to do is some DNA testing, and we'll find out who has a gene for a crown of thorns...
Apparently not.
Well apparently, all we need to do is some DNA testing, and we'll find out who has a gene for a crown of thorns...
Well, no. You believed you had free choice because you did not have a very good knowledge of the future. In fact you could only make one choice, and were not free to change it. No matter what you did, no matter how much you wanted to not kill him, you would. That is the opposite of free choice.My choice was real at the time it was made. You saw the result of that free choice, after the free decision was made.
We don't know for sure that anybody was ever crucified with a crown of thorns, do we? All we have is the stories in the Bible - and they also say that Jesus was resurrected. We can't very well use the Bible to confirm itself, can we? This thread is about external evidence, so roll it out.
I keep asking you for evidence that links the Shroud to Jesus and all you provide is speculation. Speculation is not evidence.The Shroud of Turin is external evidenc, that confirms the Bible accounts.
It is only evidence, not proof.
Well, no. You believed you had free choice because you did not have a very good knowledge of the future. In fact you could only make one choice, and were not free to change it. No matter what you did, no matter how much you wanted to not kill him, you would. That is the opposite of free choice.
Let's take a simpler example. A criminal is holding a gun on you. He tells you he will kill you in five seconds no matter what else happens, and he has a history of being pretty infallible about such things. Would you consider yourself to be free to choose life or death?
I keep asking you for evidence that links the Shroud to Jesus and all you provide is speculation. Speculation is not evidence.
Evidence is the same for everybody. You don't get your own private set. You can believe what you like but don't pretend you have evidence if you don't.There are many kinds of evidence.
As I said, the question is not relevant. The Bible says Jesus was resurrected, so if the Bible is a reliable source of information, you don't need to duct-tape on anything about the Shroud to back it up. On the other hand, if the Bible is not reliable about the resurrection, it might not be reliable about the crown of thorns either.If you want to consider the evidence I presented, answer the first question, your choice.
Evidence is the same for everybody. You don't get your own private set. You can believe what you like but don't pretend you have evidence if you don't.
As I said, the question is not relevant. The Bible says Jesus was resurrected, so if the Bible is a reliable source of information, you don't need to duct-tape on anything about the Shroud to back it up. On the other hand, if the Bible is not reliable about the resurrection, it might not be reliable about the crown of thorns either.
So, do you have any real evidence or not?
For God's sake, show us the other pieces.The question I gave you is one of the many individual pieces of evidence that could build a case either for or against the validity of the Shroud of Turin, which is the very thing we have been discussing.
It isn't obvious. It's hardly even plausible.Why am I crazy for seeing something that is so obvious to anyone?
There are three kinds of evidence: convincing, unconvincing and inadmissible.There are many kinds of evidence.
How many people do you think were crucified with a crown of thorns, as depicted both on the Shroud and described in the written historical accounts?
So why are we still talking about this?Apparently not.
It's fine, up to a point. We all have limited time and have to be selective in what we reply to.I really appreciate your comments but I have limited time, and I certainly (100% chance) do not know the answer to every question.
So I just try to do my best, that is all I can do.
I will look into your excellent questions and points, and respond the best that I can.