God sins a lot but is there no end to God’s greed?

Greatest I am said:
The Godhead I know does not hate. It is the God within the Gnostics speak of.

We are in basically Christian nations. I speak more of a Christian God.
I worry more for those close at hand than those further away.
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If you are upset or worried about X, go talk it over with X.
Trying to take it out on or with everyone else does not help.


And FYI, 786 is a Muslim and LG is a Hindu.
 
lightgigantic said:
seriously I will do this - although I don't think you read what I said.

The demonstration that god interferes is that we can't do it alone since we are empowered through issues of remembrance, knowledge and forgetfulness.

So here I am, sincerely beginning the task of chopping of my arm when I recall knowledge that it will probably be fatal, remember that I have things I want to do with this life above and beyond maiming myself and hence forget whatever necessity there is for me to cut off my arm since there is no logic behind fulfilling your need for me to cut off my arm.

This isn't of course sufficient to prevent any person from cutting off their arm. If the desire is there and if they get the green light through remembrance, knowledge and forgetfulness, its a done deed
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http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...a=X&ei=9owwTYTWI4z2tgPO4ojABQ&ved=0CBwQ9QEwAQ
 
786 said:
I was asking for logic, not stupidity. The OP and this thread assumes if God exists then he is 'greedy'.

So even if you consider it 'magic', it is part of this discussion. Otherwise you're free to leave.

Now if you're willing to work with the condition- if God exists, I can answer this question.

You can commit suicide because the owner of you has allowed you to do it. Its not because its your body- its because its His and he gave you the the ability to do whatever you are doing with it.



Why would he need to do something if he is allowed the action to occur.



I don't see the contradiction. Its a sin because he has told you not to do something. In layman terms:

Here, take this thing and use it properly, but don't do this and this with it, otherwise I'll beat the shit out of you when I take it back, until then be careful. :D



There is no reason to. Once you get the reasoning corrected.

Peace be unto you ;)
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Nothing you said above changes what I said, in the end we have control over our bodies.

You are just adding something that doesn't need to be added. Which is always the case with god.

We don't need god to do what we want with our bodies. Apparently, he doesn't care or he can't or won't stop us, so either way we are in control. This is the evidence. The rest is pure speculation.
 
Lg,

or alternatively, the non-believer has to place incredible reserves of pride in their powers of perception and deem that simply because right here, right now, they have no perception of god, this is sufficient to extrapolate to the claim that no where no one has had perception of god.

Needless to say, its a childish manner to investigate the problem.
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No what's childish is to continue to believe in fairytales.

Strange that we live in a world completely saturated with a wide array of literacy forms and communication and you deem that unless one has had a direct conversation with another one cannot know their intentions, desires or even existence.

I mean do you go to the political forum and poke the sore points in anther's argument because they have never had a conversation with Obama?
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LOL, I can understand very well exactly what Obama thinks about a wide variety of subjects, this is a very poor example, maybe you can try again.

Obama is not a god.

well actually one can't even do that if one insists, like you do on the subject of religion, that all authorities in the field must answer first and foremost to your perception (After all, when was the last time you had a conversation with an alien, huh?)
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You missed the point. We can speculate somewhat intelligently about aliens/ET because we have a lot of data to go on and more to come.

God is a supernatural being that we can not know anything about. By it's very definition there is no way to further define it, or know anything about it.

Yet here you are once again claiming that if only people would try harder they would understand.

Which is my question. What are you understanding ?

When you have nothing to go on. Nothing + nothing = nothing.

The reason that there is no meaning is because you begin any sort of investigation only for the sake of supporting your (mis)conceptions.

IOW you are not looking for clues how to understand, know or comprehend god. You are looking for clues how to disprove and question his existence.
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What clues can be determined or found from nothing.

If a murder took place between 2 unknowns in a stainless steel room that was completely sterilized so that not one clue was available in any form, could you tell me who was murdered and who commited the crime ?

If I asked you 5,000 years ago what a computer was giving you not one clue could you tell me what it is ?

The problem here is that we truly have nothing to go on, so it's all speculation, it's all guesses. Yet some want to turn their guess into knowledge.

This is different than claiming there is no god. Which I am not doing. I am saying that man has created the gods, none of them are correct because they can't be. God can not be known. Only believed in. It's called faith and one needs to make that leap because one can't have that type of knowledge. Period.
 
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Lori_7 said:
the lawmaker isn't separate from the law. god IS law and sin is transgression.

the creator isn't separate from the creation either. it's ownership is inherent, and therefore greed and covetousness in regards to it are not even possible.
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Ownership?

People of intelligence have outlawed slave ownership some time ago.
Get with the program slave and shed your shakles and get your head out of God's ass.

If the creator is not separate from his creations, then he used himself to reproduce a chimera without even coveting Mary. Now that is cold.

If it is God's law that two different species should reproduce then this is ok right?

http://imgur.com/a/90sTN

Regards
DL
 
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Signal said:
If you are upset or worried about X, go talk it over with X.
Trying to take it out on or with everyone else does not help.


And FYI, 786 is a Muslim and LG is a Hindu.
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I treat all Abrahamic religions the same so Muslims are part of the groups whose God is greedy. The Hindu God I do not know well enough to comment on but if it demands us to love honor and obey then he is also within my sights.

Regards
DL
 
Greatest I am said:
Ownership?

People of intelligence have outlawed slave ownership some time ago.
Get with the program slave and shed your shakles and get your head out of God's ass.

If the creator is not separate from his creations, then he used himself to reproduce a chimera without even coveting Mary. Now that is cold.

If it is God's law that two different species should reproduce then this is ok right?

http://imgur.com/a/90sTN

Regards
DL
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god isn't a species and jesus was human.

i know this is above your vulgar mentality, but you belong to something that is bigger than you are, and that you did not create. given that, the only thing that enslaves any of us is sin.
 
Lori_7 said:
god isn't a species and jesus was human.

i know this is above your vulgar mentality, but you belong to something that is bigger than you are, and that you did not create. given that, the only thing that enslaves any of us is sin.
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Quite a hypocritical way of retracting your initial stupid statement but thanks for recognizing your stupidity. There may be hope for you yet.

Now. Let's see if you can add two plus two.

Are you a parent?
Do you want your children to end up as less that whatever you are?

Why would you think your heavenly father would want us to be less than he is?

A & E showed that way to match God and you would have us do less and forever remain inferior.

Even as scripture tells us not to.

Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Ps 82:6 I said, "You are gods, And all of you are sons of the Most High.

Think. Are the above telling you to be a slave or to step up and be a true daughter of God and follow A & E and be as Gods?

Think for God's sake.

Regards
DL
 
Greatest I am said:
Quite a hypocritical way of retracting your initial stupid statement but thanks for recognizing your stupidity. There may be hope for you yet.

Now. Let's see if you can add two plus two.

Are you a parent?
Do you want your children to end up as less that whatever you are?

Why would you think your heavenly father would want us to be less than he is?

A & E showed that way to match God and you would have us do less and forever remain inferior.

Even as scripture tells us not to.

Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Ps 82:6 I said, "You are gods, And all of you are sons of the Most High.

Think. Are the above telling you to be a slave or to step up and be a true daughter of God and follow A & E and be as Gods?

Think for God's sake.

Regards
DL
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i didn't retract a thing.

think about this...for all of your knowledge, you're still a hateful, arrogant, prick.

care to explain?
 
Lori_7 said:
god isn't a species and jesus was human.

i know this is above your vulgar mentality, but you belong to something that is bigger than you are, and that you did not create. given that, the only thing that enslaves any of us is sin.
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vulgar mentality? lol.

you don't know what god is, you are just expressing your opinion. it makes you seem more like an imbecile than you appear when you talk about god as if it's some definitive and known fact. my god, it's so laughable actually. the subject of god is really all about opinions except in relation to questioning and in some cases judging a possible creator in relation to what exists and occurs here.

what i've noticed often is the religious or staunch theists tend to pretend that their belief in a god or being part of a larger and higher being is not at all selfish and try to spin that those who don't are the selfish and narrow-minded ones only concerned with their welfare.

that's some devious shit right there considering the true factors are that everything people do and think is ultimately for themselves or for those they care for yet christians like you pretend it's for 'god's' will.

what if there was no god or if god existed, it did not care about you in the least, would you be able to handle it? what if there was no after-life to look forward to? what if this was all there is?

could you handle existing knowing this or do you need to feel self-important and matter in the larger scheme of things by hitching your self-identity to a larger reality or being?

hypocrite! lmfao!


think about this...for all of your knowledge, you're still a hateful, arrogant, prick.
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how is he hateful and arrogant? because he doesn't have a high opinion of god? lmao

because he's not as dishonest as you and thinks everything is rosy about god and he actually questions? you mean because in actuality, he's more of a useful human being than you in that regard? that you are mentally dishonest but think acting nice about it somehow makes you more moral?

that's called disgusting, basically.
 
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birch said:
vulgar mentality? lol.

you don't know what god is, you are just expressing your opinion. it makes you seem more like an imbecile than you appear when you talk about god as if it's some definitive and known fact. my god, it's so laughable actually. the subject of god is really all about opinions except in relation to questioning and in some cases judging a possible creator in relation to what exists and occurs here.
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yes, it's my opinion that greatest i am didn't create the universe and everything in it including himself. do you disagree with my opinion birch?




how is he hateful and arrogant? because he doesn't have a high opinion of god? lmao

because he's not as dishonest as you and thinks everything is rosy about god and he actually questions? you mean because in actuality, he's more of a useful human being than you in that regard? that you are mentally dishonest but think acting nice about it somehow makes you more moral?

that's called disgusting, basically.
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fuck morals. for the 87th time really...may i reiterate that i couldn't care any less about your grandiose morals. you know, the morals that apparently rationalize a tendency to speak to anyone who disagrees with you like a dog. you know, like...

"Quite a hypocritical way of retracting your initial stupid statement but thanks for recognizing your stupidity. There may be hope for you yet.

Now. Let's see if you can add two plus two."

"Think for God's sake."

"Get with the program slave and shed your shakles and get your head out of God's ass."


and just what does this opinion of god, yours and greatest i am's, mean exactly? that because you disagree with it and think it's an asshole, that it doesn't exist? it does exist and it's your enemy? it does exist and it's whatever you want it to be? whatever suits you best? it does exist and it's YOU. YOU'RE GOD? i don't believe that. see, you can be like god, in the way of having some knowledge of good and evil. god has all knowledge of good and evil. but you yourself can have a bounty of it, and still not understand a goddamn thing. you have to want to understand.
 
Greatest I am said:
God sins a lot but is there no end to God’s greed?

"Jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sado-masochistic, capriciously malevolent bully" - Richard Dawkins.

Dawkins has listed a few of the --qualities-- that he has gleaned from reading scriptures.

He seems to have forgotten God’s main sin though, that of greed and coveting.

God, in his greed, wants or more rightly said, demands, that we love, honor, and obey him and repent for sinning against him when in reality, man can only sins against man.
Any that dare not give all that he greedily covets is punished quite severely. This shows the depth of his greed. Scripture is surely on the mark when it says that he is a jealous God and God live up to this label quite well. Scripture also says that we are to try to be as perfect as God and that would mean having all the immoral attributes shown here.

Most, including the pope and other main line religions hierarchies believe in evolution. Evolution tells us that God, if he exists at all and that is not really a proven fact, would have lived may years before creating mankind. Most think that God is and always has been perfect and never changing.

In the beginning there would only have been God. No one or anything to be jealous of.
Nothing to covet, no one to control etc.

If Dawkins list has some accuracy in it and I am told by theists that it does, where did these attributes come from. They all seem so human that one would think that a God would be above such petty and immoral attributes.

One would think that a good God would only have good attributes but as we know, he cannot or will not follow his own commandments.
A human law maker is expected to follow the law and we see this as good morals yet theist follow a God who is acting less moral than men.

Strange.

How then did he suddenly become so jealous and greedy?
Even to the point of coveting another man’s woman, Mary.

Are there no commandments worthy of him following?

Are we to follow a law maker who does not follow his own laws?

Regards
DL
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Mercy be, Forgiveness. Asks for your love, it is your free will to give our not
 
Without believers how can god exist? Ergo god demand for faith in it is not a matter of greed but survival.
 
Lori_7 said:
yes, it's my opinion that greatest i am didn't create the universe and everything in it including himself. do you disagree with my opinion birch?






fuck morals. for the 87th time really...may i reiterate that i couldn't care any less about your grandiose morals. you know, the morals that apparently rationalize a tendency to speak to anyone who disagrees with you like a dog. you know, like...

"Quite a hypocritical way of retracting your initial stupid statement but thanks for recognizing your stupidity. There may be hope for you yet.

Now. Let's see if you can add two plus two."

"Think for God's sake."

"Get with the program slave and shed your shakles and get your head out of God's ass."


and just what does this opinion of god, yours and greatest i am's, mean exactly? that because you disagree with it and think it's an asshole, that it doesn't exist? it does exist and it's your enemy? it does exist and it's whatever you want it to be? whatever suits you best? it does exist and it's YOU. YOU'RE GOD? i don't believe that. see, you can be like god, in the way of having some knowledge of good and evil. god has all knowledge of good and evil. but you yourself can have a bounty of it, and still not understand a goddamn thing. you have to want to understand.
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lol. you are freaking crazy. fuck morals? also, i don't think he said he created the universe but if he did, i don't agree with that. like wtf?

they are talking to you disrespectfully because you talk disprespectfully to others. you use an air of superiority with your concept of god. what do expect? just retort with what you agree or disagree with. and what makes you think i agree with greatest i am? i just said i agree with how he questions things at least but i never said i agree with all of his opinions, uh?

i've experienced all of this. i grew up around christians and i know how good they pretend to be innocent and you are not. they are some insidiously manipulative people. lol
 
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786 said:
Corrected by me. :D

Peace be unto you ;)
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Beliver: in the end we are given control over bodies given to us.
Non-believer: we can do what we want with our bodies.

Same thing, just that you add one that is not required. I will concede per the OP that god exists for the discussion, however, that still does not require that god cares, nor does it mean we are not in control of our bodies.

Depends on the god believed in.

But, if that is what you believe, go ahead. If that is what it takes for you to care for yourself then great.

But your belief doesn't equate to logic on the subject of our bodies. You are making assumptions before we even get there. 1) that your god exists 2) that he cares about our bodies

There is no evidence to support either.

There is evidence that people commit suicide, maim themselves in all sorts of ways and jump out of perfectly good airplanes for fun.
 
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