Electric cars are a pipe dream

Massachusetts Set To Install 100 EV Charging Stations:

This is big for the US since the US is an oil and gas worshiping Country.

"You’d have expected such news to come from the Prius-loving state of California, but it’s actually Massachusetts that has announced that it is going to make life easier for its EV drivers by installing 100 new charging stations!




http://tinyurl.com/244v6oa
 
adoucette said:
http://www.chinaeconomicreview.com/today-in-china/2010_07_22/The_BYD_bubble_finally_pops.html ...Arthur
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Yes that is the same article I found. With second reading I see it does had a "word" about BYD's batteries being unreliable, but does not site why the author, Malcolm Moore, repeats that without any reference or supporting evidence. All Malcolm state is "that the batteries have been reported to be unreliable" Was it his sister who originated that report, or if not who? Note he is not asserting that they are unreliable - that could open him to legal action.

I note that the China Economic Review is not at all like the Economist, which has its own staff writting articles. The C.E.R. simply picks up articles (this one from Malcolm's blog it seems) and reprints them. I was (and still am) very suppious of this undocumanted report of unrelibality for several reasons:

(1) It does not come from a Chinese source and only a Chinese source would have had the opportunity to have tested BYD's batteries - only 28 cars sold to the public all in China.

(2) Anyone can put almost anything in their blog and many do for economic reasons.

(3) I read the ChinaDaily almost evey day and have for several years. If BYD's batteries were unreliable, that would be big news and several articles would have appeared about BYD's serious problem. They have had articles on fact that BYD's electric hybrid has had essentailly no sales (only to Chinese government.)

(4) BYD is by far the world's most experienced maker of Li-ion batteries - Counting their small ones for computers, cell phone, etc., probably has made more than the rest of the world's total!

I think the next step if some one wants to do it is to read Malcolm Moore's blog and see if there is an obvious reason why he might fabricate an undocumented report that BYD's batteries are unreliable.

It seems to me that he would have no way to know - He has never seen in person even the car and certainly does not have access to the battery histories of the few sold.


One needs to be highly sceptical when the circumstances nearly make it impossible for him to know what he is posting about on his blog in this case.
 
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X-Man2 said:
Massachusetts Set To Install 100 EV Charging Stations:

This is big for the US since the US is an oil and gas worshiping Country.

"You’d have expected such news to come from the Prius-loving state of California, but it’s actually Massachusetts that has announced that it is going to make life easier for its EV drivers by installing 100 new charging stations!

http://tinyurl.com/244v6oa
Click to expand...

We in Tennessee, spit on your piddly 100 charging stations......

Nissan contracted with to provide public charging stations for Leaf drivers released a map of Middle and East Tennessee that shows the general locations of the chargers along 425 miles of interstate highways, mostly between Nashville and Knoxville and Chattanooga. About 2,500 of the charging stations will be installed over the next year in and around those three cities and the corridors between them
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That's nearly as many charging stations as there are gasoline stations.

Tennessee is also offering a $2,500 rebate in addition to the Fed $7,500 rebate.

Arthur

ps, about 2500 charging stations will be installed in Calif, and they are offering an additional $5,000 rebate as well. Massachusetts, as usual, is sucking hind tit.
 
Yeah, just $100 from a millon people.

If that's all it took then France, Germany or Japan, with essentialy no oil of their own, would have paid for this 100 times over.

What BS.

Arthur
 
I suspect MrGreeen, a very new posters in more than one thread, is financially connected to GreenGas.cc which I am 99% sure is a scam to collect money. At that site there is in large type:
"Producing NH3 as a green fuel"
but nothing is said as to how the NH3 would be produced.

I think they are trading on the fact that many do not know thousand of tons of NH3 are produced from natural gas for agricultural use mainly every spring. Producing from natural gas is the cheapest way to make it and in basically a 150 year old process that has not been much improved.

I will call his post to the attention of stronger mod as this, I am almost sure, is trying to use Sciforums to steal from the ignorant.
 
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I didn't even bother to look at what he was selling.

You know it's bogus because of the impossible hype "Costs next to nothing and makes no pollution"

Right.

Arthur
 
http://blogs.motortrend.com/6719595/green/127-mpg-this-volt-story-must-be-told/index.html

"Here's why I'm so geeked on the Chevy Volt and why you should be, too. In normal, everyday driving we got 127 miles per gallon (fine, 126.7 mpg). Which is pretty amazing. Broken down, over the course of 299 miles on Los Angeles highways, byways and freeways, the Volt burned 2.36 gallons of gasoline (fine, 2.359 gallons -- we rounded up). Most other cars use up a tank of gas going 299 miles. The Volt, to reiterate, used 2.36 gallons over 299 miles. That's freaking amazing!"
 
FUCK! It still has a mechanical linkage between its generator and the wheel, and can't believe it, what happened to that whole independent energy source BS?
 
It's not a total waste, it just shows the technology is not quite there yet.

But I look at my own driving and only on long trips do I drive 70 miles an hour or more, so in my own personal use, the motor would only drive the generator for 95% or more of my use.

This car is really designed for someone whose typical driving averages around 60 miles or less per day and most of that is not over 70 mph.

If your driving is typically long distance interstate driving or most is at or above 70 miles per hour, this maybe this isn't the car for you.

Personally I think the write up in Motortrend will sell a lot of Volts.

http://blogs.motortrend.com/6719595/green/127-mpg-this-volt-story-must-be-told/index.html

I particularly got a chuckle from: "It would have taken weeks to make that drive in the Leaf." Wry Reynolds also suggested that with a little bit of hacking, you could use Volts to go and recharge dead Leafs.

Arthur
 
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ElectricFetus said:
How the fuck is it not there yet, why can't an electric drive train drive about without assistance, in other EV systems it can!
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Because an Electric only system doesn't have the back up generator and gas tank to cart along.

So designers quickly run into weight issues when having to have both.

So, one way is to handle the above 70 MPH requirement by using both the electric motor and the gas engine.

The alternative would require a much larger electric motor AND a bigger generator to supply that much more continuous electricity AND probably a bigger gas motor to drive the bigger generator, and all of that would weigh more and cut the overall efficiency.

Engineering is all about trade offs.

GM made theirs at 70 MPH.

If they could have met the high speed requirement with out doing so, they would have, but as I said, we are not there yet.

Arthur
 
adoucette said:
Because an Electric only system doesn't have the back up generator and gas tank to cart along.

So designers quickly run into weight issues when having to have both.

So, one way is to handle the above 70 MPH requirement by using both the electric motor and the gas engine.
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Weight issues? You think 600 kg of batteries is not a weight issue for all EV systems?!? Heck the gasoline engine and supporting systems in a PHEV weigh less then a full EV. No the only reasons I can figure for doing this is:
1. The electric motors on the Volt are crap and can't put out enough torque at 70 mph to sustain driving at that speed in all conditions
2. It's serial EV mode is just not very efficient., converting from mechanical to electrical back to mechanical and using an inefficient internal combustion engine like a gasoline engine for the generator instead of something like a microturbine makes the whole system to dam inefficient to make continuous highway driving on serial hybrid mode efficient.


If they could have met the high speed requirement with out doing so, they would have, but as I said, we are not there yet.
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We are completely there! Tesla can do over 70 with a 40 kg electric motor, GM is just cutting corners like they always have, why the fuck did we not just let them die!
 
Again, the Tesla is an all electric, so it does have a bigger motor.

An Extended Range EV like the Volt is quite different, and at present has the best all around specs on the market.

No EV could have done what the Volt did in that MotorTrend test drive and the Gas milage is better than any existing hybrid.

Broken down, over the course of 299 miles on Los Angeles highways, byways and freeways, the Volt burned 2.36 gallons of gasoline
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And if you read that, that was in stop and go driving, on highways, up and down mountains, in 100 degree heat with the AC running.

The net is GM designed a different car for a different market and initial appearances look like they have done a good job.

Arthur
 
adoucette said:
... An Extended Range EV like the Volt is quite different, and at present has the best all around specs on the market. ...
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True, assuming price is not a "spec." In hard times, that may be the most important one except for the rich minority.
 
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