Yes, but not that far
Does it comfort you that we are heading the way of the countries you mentioned where women are sanctioned for showing flesh?
Er...we are??
Does it comfort you that the right in your country is pushing to deny women rights over their own bodies? Believe me,
the West is not that
far behind. We've gotten to the point where even cleavage is deemed so offensive that
a skit on Sesame Street had to be banned because so many parents complained because you could see her cleavage. And she wasn't even naked.
Sure sure, I remember Katy Perry and the Sasha Grey thing. There will always be critics, and sometimes more effective than others. But the levels of skin Perry was showing and the background Grey has are a pretty far cry from a society having a
grande mal freakout because now someone's
eyes are deemed too sexy for this
deen.
Look in the media, hell, look in this very forum and you will find men and women who supposedly live in the West, who blame women for their own rapes, who deem women to be responsible or share responsibility if they are raped.
Of course. But so many and so vociferous as elsewhere? I doubt that most sincerely. Will we enact laws that throw women in the slammer for having too few witnesses, either at all or in any number approaching those places that get a social rights skim-job from Sam? Well, no. As far as the record goes, it appears we're getting far more liberal about the rights of the allegedly assaulted (I know you will balk at that term, but it's not mean as an attack) as time goes on. Granted, there arrives eventually in every trend a limit to the ways in which evidence is collected and accepted, or at which point legalistics lifts the process of justice from accuser and/or accused.
Of course. I mean she is commenting on how the West deals with nudity and your response is to discuss Saudi Arabia. Makes sense, yes? How about you be a bit less reactive and discuss why the West also censors nudity? And why are we getting worse?
I really don't agree that we are. Hell, it's more and more prevalent every day, it seems. Nude protests, nude PETA, nude sculptures, nude protests of nude laws. It all seems well in train. I mentioned the old Saudis, but one could as easily point at Egypt, Tunisia, Iraq and Iran these days.
You see, this is interesting to me.
Look at your reaction to Sam's views on how men in all society's are making the rules for what women can wear and not wear, including Saudi Arabia where women's rights are so lacking. Something you have been whining about for a few pages now. Yet, you completely ignore the post where one member is coming out and saying that women are to blame if they are raped if they somehow provoke men by wearing something that turns some men on. We have a poster, a woman, who holds the view that women should cover up to avoid being raped (apparently that is a preventative) and if they do not, then they share the responsibility for their rape and you are so focused on Sam because she *gasp* criticised the West, that you don't even notice that Signal holds the views that would have women dressed as they are forced to dress in Saudi Arabia. It is astounding.
What do you think Geoff? Do you think people should be free to walk around naked if they so choose?
Hmmm - think that might be stretching it a bit. Naked where? There's such a thing as turning your head, but naturally societies do impart certain limits to personal expression. The limits of Western society are quite wide, of course, but finite within narrow periods. It appears that such limits are still moving, to my eye, and moving in the direction of increasingly liberal dress and comportment.
Do you think women should be allowed to dress as they please without being forced by society to dress a certain way or have their nipples blanked out in the media?
I don't want to hear about how the Saudi's ban even women's hair. We have covered that extensively and even
Sam agrees with you on that point. I am asking you what you think.
Well, I'm sorry you don't like that comparison, but it's a relevant one: planks and specks, as they say.
Do you even see the irony of this thread? A woman in Egypt strips to protest against her Government's view on nudity and women in general and the supposedly open West blanks out her 'nudie bits' lest it offends people. Would you find it offensive?
Not sure. But they provide the link; so what is lost, exactly? Tell me this: in which previous incarnation of our media
would they have printed her, nips and all, that illustrates this anti-liberalizing trend you describe?