Did Jesus exist?

IceAgeCivilizations said:
Hey spidergoat, do you think the Roman guards at Jesus' tomb were "in on the plot" to make Rome look bad by helping whoever remove Jesus' body?

And do you think that over 500 witnesses of the resurrected Christ were all hallucinating, and why didn't they squeal foul when the Gospels were circulating?
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M*W: When did the gospels actually "circulate?" Do you think anyone would "squeal" to Rome and live to tell about it?

There are no Roman records of Roman soldiers being at any tomb. In fact, there was no tomb. It's a metaphor for nightfall. Jesus (the sun) rises the next morning.
 
I saw them Iasion and they were Wonderful. Keep it up dude! You rock!

Seriously though dude, You rock!
 
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IceAgeCivilizations said:
Why don't you scholars start trying to prove that the Biblical accounts are false?
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M*W: The bible has long been proved to be false. Read the the following sources:

Journal of Biblical Anthropology Research (BAR)

Books by:

Ahmed Osman (biblical scholar)
Hyam Maccoby (biblical scholar)
David Fideler (ancient history scholar),

plus many, many others. There are even Christian apologists and religious scholars (Dominic Crossan, et al.), who
have published books denying the virgin birth, the crucifixion and the resurrection, and the trinity.

Other authors who explain the mythical hero theme of the Jesus myth are:

Acharya S.
Joseph Campbell

Visit your local library or bookstore, and you will find much research on the disputation of many biblical events.
 
IceAgeCivilizations said:
Why couldn't have Mark written all of Mark?
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M*W: Because Mark is an Anglicized name for the god Mars. Mars is a mythical hero who didn't exist. Mars is also the planet who orbits the sun. The the Apostle Mark also hung around Jesus and proclaimed his "shining glory."
 
IceAgeCivilizations said:
I have a friend who had a brain aneurism (sp?), blood in the spinal fluid, the whole bit, bad deal, but after we prayed, they could not find it, and my friend has been fine ever since.
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M*W: I'm happy for your friend's recovery, but what he experienced was a mis-diagnosis in the first place.
 
In fact, Wikipedia states that "The biggest danger of ultrasound is often considered to be misdiagnosis by untrained operators."
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M*W: "Untrained operators" are not qualified to diagnose by ultrasound. Only licensed physicians are qualified to "diagnose" a patient's condition. Then there are those "unqualified licensed physicians" who misdiagnose.
 
Roman said:
Quick question for Medicine Woman,
Does sun = son in Latin, hebrew, or whatever the Bible was written in?
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M*W: The NT was originally written in Greek. Helios is the Greek word for sun. Iasius (sp) is the Greek word for Jesus. I am unable to interpret from Greek to English, but some biblical scholars have done so. Language evolves. For those of us who speak English, the NT in our language has been translated from the old English. We "assume" that our translations are correct. There is so much mistranslation and misinterpretation that has also evolved through the years. The way I see it, it is all symbolic. We cannot translate word for word correctly. We must look at the whole picture, the whole myth, and interpret from that. I don't speak Greek, so I cannot really answer your question adequately. I don't think it's beneficial to interpret word for word without looking at the whole dying demigod savior myth.
 
I don't see how IceAgeCiv. can ignore all of those posts made by M.W. ... it makes absolutely no sence to me. It appears that she is the one who has the evidence while iceageciv is just the one who is preaching. I hate preachers.

:p
 
And Jesus was widely quoted the Apostles in their historical renderings, but Aristotle and Plato have no biographical renderings about them from contemporaneous sources that I know of.
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M*W: The apostles are figurative characters for the 12 signs of the zodiac who revolve around the sun (Jesus). They didn't write anything. Metaphorically, they represent the characterizations of the signs in relationship to the sun (Apostles to Jesus). The NT was written by other factions (possibly by certain individuals in the Roman Empire) as a parody on or by the Roman emperors who were believed by the commoners to be god as was Jesus. Some common themes in this parody were the crown of laurels which turned into the crown of thorns, betrayals by close associates, etc.
 
Iasion said:
Greetings,

Many people DID questions the Gospels.

I posted examples, which can be checked easily.

All have been ignored.

:-(

Iasion
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M*W: Sorry, I, I have not been ignoring you. I am sure many people did question the gospels, such as Celsus, et al., but the more common people questioned more discretely I would think.
 
IceAgeCivilizations said:
The Gnostics tried to add on, they didn't directly challenge the Gospel accounts.
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The early Christians were not uniform in their beliefs, unlike today. They disputed many things and there were many more gospels existing than finally got chosen by a certain select group of politically connected Romans.
 
Greetings Bubber,

Bubber said:
I saw them Iasion and they were Wonderful. Keep it up dude! You rock!
Seriously though dude, You rock!
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Hey thanks :)

I like to look at the early evidence.

It's quite clear there were MANY disagreements in the early days of Christianity. The 2nd century is a huge argument between those who think Jesus was historical, and those who thought otherwise.


Iasion
 
No prob Iasion.

Notice the lack of response we all seem to get from the likes of IceAgeCivilizations?

Have you read his book?

me neither....
 
How many translations of the original written scriptures of the gospel were there? It went from Greek, to Latin, Syrian, Coptic, etc. Where the hell is the original text at this point?

It's very difficult to argue that the text seen in the current Bibles written in English is anything close to that of the original texts. When someone translates something from a foreign language, there is bound to be many mistakes since different languages use words and phrases in different ways. But the Bible isn't just one translation. It is a translation, of a translation, of a translation, of a translation, AND ON AND ON AND ON. With all these translations, the original text (if it even existed) has probably become so corrupted that it takes no resemblance to the original written text.

Also, who's to stop the translator from making up his/her own story and interpreting the text in his/her own way?
 
Greetings,

nds1 said:
How many translations of the original written scriptures of the gospel were there? Where the hell is the original text at this point?
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We have a large collection of Greek manuscripts. Together, these MSS form our witnesses for the text.

Here is a list of the MSS :
http://rosetta.reltech.org/TC/extras/Robinson-list.html

Scholars have re-constructed the NT as far as possible from these texts, noting the differences in the MSS.

This is what forms the Greek text of the NT.

You can buy it here:
http://www.amazon.com/Greek-New-Testament-Introduction-dictionary/dp/3438051133

Or read it online here:
http://www-users.cs.york.ac.uk/~fisher/gnt/
http://www.ntgateway.com/greek/


nds1 said:
It went from Greek, to Latin, Syrian, Coptic, etc. But the Bible isn't just one translation. It is a translation, of a translation, of a translation, of a translation, AND ON AND ON AND ON.
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You are mistaken.
This mistake seems very common for some reason.

Yes, it went -
from Greek to Latin,
from Greek to Syrian,
from Greek to Coptic.

But NOT
from Greek to Latin to Syrian to Coptic to English etc.

That is simply not true.
Our modern English NT is based on the best Greek MSS available - not original, but early.

You can see some examples of these Greek MSS right here:
http://www.earlham.edu/~seidti/iam/tc_pap75.html
http://www.earlham.edu/~seidti/iam/tc_pap66.html

That is what the NT is translated from - the early Greek MSS (around 200BCE for some of them.)


Iasion
 
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