Deliver Us from Evil

[John99]

i found it. i cannot listen to audio on this computer but when you see the faces that is enough, in a way it is anyway.

the thing is, this is not a religious issue so it is more suited to human science. i cannot remember the number but i heard on t.v that one pedophile molests an incredibe number of people. but what is the answer? well we need a short term solution to a long term problem.

drugs and therapy? i think many with high recidivism have gone that route.

at a lecture the simplest explanation was give: it is how their brains are wired. granted it was on a different offense but then i wondered aloud ' how the brain is wired':scratchin: honestly, i had never looked at it that way. simple...but now what?

We can make the wiring assumption about many long term disorders, if so then we can also examine the positive traits exhibited and if we can do that we will then work towards re-wiring these brains. First thing is to identify the wires but for the life of me i cannot figure out where to begin. How can this possibly be done without further damage\risk? it is worth looking into further.

I am referring to hard core molesters, there is most likely a commonality between this and other violent crimes right up to serial killers because they are repeat offenders. also, the reason i say violent is due to total disregard for the victims.

 

[Enmos]

My husband has never been in a church. My daughter is Christian so she goes to church. We each have to follow our hearts and this is where her's has taken her.

Oh ok, cool
Is she going to a Christian school then ?

 

[nietzschefan]

Which case does the movie go into? I may rent it but i am not really into those docs. at all. Sooooo, cant you just tell us?

No, you have to watch it to get it. Understand? You have to actually watch the volume of DAMAGE this guy has done to people to get it. Get it? Watch a hard core Japanese-American(with the most amazing U.S accent) break down and ball his eyes out on camera while saying the things this guy did. Then watch the court dog and pony show and come back and tell us you don't get it.

 

[Learned Hand]

I am Catholic myself but not practicing at all!! My Dad was catholic and would drag me to church here and there. My mom was not catholic and I finally said well if she isn't going why should I ? Finally he let it go, and I really never went anymore. I noticed even at young age they sure passed around the collection basket alot during the service. I didn't even marry in the Church because there were too many rules. I did baptise my kids, only because they were going to go to Catholic school. (at the time it was right across the street from my house) As soon as the Public school was built beside it, I transferred both over.

Later after hearing what other corrupt disgusting things were going on, similar to this documentary. I can't understand how ppl could be so faithful to the church.

I'm Catholic as well, but I don't blame the faith or religion which is the Church. Priests are human, and disposed to immorality as any other. I'm sure Baptist, Lutheran, and Methodist faiths also have their fair share of weirdo ministers, but I won't condemn their "Church" simply because they are the exception, not the rule.

 

[nietzschefan]

The Catholic church is to be condemed for their OWN coverup, not the actions of the individual priests(regardless of numbers).

 

[Orleander]

Oh ok, cool
Is she going to a Christian school then ?

well, I have gotten the odd 'God bless' memo, they get xmas break, they sing Silent Night at the xmas pageant, and prayer is said at graduation, so yes, she goes to a xtian school.
If it was my school, I might complain, but its hers, so I don't.

 

[Orleander]

If my local school kept covering for a teacher and moving him from class to class, I'd be pissed at that school. Not all of them. However, if it was done nationwide, I'd be pissed at the school system and I'd start home schooling, no matter what state I lived in.

Its teh same as what the Catholic Church did.

 

[Learned Hand]

The Catholic church is to be condemed for their OWN coverup, not the actions of the individual priests(regardless of numbers).

Certainly society may condemn what was done. But contrition and forgiveness of sin is at the heart of the Catholic Church. I think the Church should avail itself of its believes, and only when one does not act with a contrite heart and continues to sin to the point of harming the foundation of the Church it becomes blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, and the priest should be excommunicated.

 

[Orleander]

... the priest should be excommunicated.

yeah, you would think so, wouldn't you? But no...

 

[nietzschefan]

Certainly society may condemn what was done. But contrition and forgiveness of sin is at the heart of the Catholic Church. I think the Church should avail itself of its believes, and only when one does not act with a contrite heart and continues to sin to the point of harming the foundation of the Church it becomes blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, and the priest should be excommunicated.

Well that's a whole other topic. The fact that this guy just says "Hey God, I'm sorry" and gets to go to "heaven". Yeah, really makes the rest of us "sinners" want to go to heaven. What a fucking joke, it just amazes me, such ancient bullshit is still believed.

 

[Enmos]

well, I have gotten the odd 'God bless' memo, they get xmas break, they sing Silent Night at the xmas pageant, and prayer is said at graduation, so yes, she goes to a xtian school.
If it was my school, I might complain, but its hers, so I don't.

Nah, it's good to experience it and make up your own mind about it.
I went to a Christian school and even went to church when I was a kid

 

[John99]

No, you have to watch it to get it. Understand? You have to actually watch the volume of DAMAGE this guy has done to people to get it. Get it? Watch a hard core Japanese-American(with the most amazing U.S accent) break down and ball his eyes out on camera while saying the things this guy did. Then watch the court dog and pony show and come back and tell us you don't get it.

Well that is why this is called a discussion forum. I thought that possibly we would be able to discuss the facts without the melodrama.

The Catholic church is to be condemed for their OWN coverup, not the actions of the individual priests(regardless of numbers).

What cover up? If you can just outline what was mentioned in the documentary we would be able to make an assessment, why are you getting so defensive? I believe an organisation who demands such difficult requirements as that of Priests would leave its doors open to evil people infiltrating it. Doesnt it always? i can take any field and well what do you know? They have their fair share of molesters.

it just amazes me, such ancient bullshit is still believed.

Why? have you ever heard of incorruptibility?

http://www.google.com/search?client=opera&rls=en&q=incorruptibility&sourceid=opera&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

 

[nietzschefan]

Well that is why this is called a discussion forum. I thought that possibly we would be able to discuss the facts without the melodrama.



What cover up? If you can just outline what was mentioned in the documentary we would be able to make an assessment, why are you getting so defensive? I believe an organisation who demands such difficult requirements as that of Priests would leave its doors open to evil people infiltrating it. Doesnt it always? i can take any field and well what do you know? They have their fair share of molesters.



Why? have you ever heard of incorruptibility?

http://www.google.com/search?client=opera&rls=en&q=incorruptibility&sourceid=opera&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

I'm not defensive. I'm just saying go watch the documentary(with sound). You are defensive.

Lenin is also Incorruptable.

 

[John99]

I'm not defensive. I'm just saying go watch the documentary(with sound). You are defensive.

Lenin is also Incorruptable.

Asking questions is not defensive, and i am neutral. I dont know much about Lenin nor do i care to, from what i do know this is a person i would sooner forget. The term is incorruptible. And he is not anyway.

 

[Bells]

What cover up? If you can just outline what was mentioned in the documentary we would be able to make an assessment, why are you getting so defensive? I believe an organisation who demands such difficult requirements as that of Priests would leave its doors open to evil people infiltrating it. Doesnt it always? i can take any field and well what do you know? They have their fair share of molesters.

I think this might shed some light on what you wish to know:

If there is a single priest whose transgressions could cover wide and daunting ground, director Amy Berg found him in Oliver O'Grady. Throughout the 1970s and 1980s, "Father Ollie" ingratiated himself with parishioners all over southern California who entrusted him with their children's spiritual care. As both O'Grady and his victims' parents testify here, he was an apparently insatiable sexual predator whose acts of rape, sodomy and abuse of children numbered in the hundreds.

The, soft-spoken O'Grady, now living free in Ireland after serving half of a 14-year jail sentence, not only enjoyed sex with pre-adolescents and teenagers, but with newborn babies. He was also not above seducing parents as a way of getting intimate with their children.

What really agonizes these victims -- and will infuriate audiences -- is that instead of doing something about O'Grady, his superiors in the California diocese kept moving him from parish to parish in an effort to cover up his behavior. Berg, a veteran of both CBS News and CNN, carefully and calmly assembles a devastating case against church officials' mendacity. There are videotapes of Los Angeles Archbishop Roger Mahoney and other leaders lying about how much they knew about O'Grady's transgressions.

Link

The cover-up John is the means by which the Catholic Church lied and tried to hide his indiscretions by moving him from parish to parish, continuing his access to children. They did not report him to the police, instead they lied. For any organisation to act this way is deplorable. That it is a church makes it even more disgusting. This, sadly, is not that uncommon. It also occurs in other organisations, religious and non-religious.

 

[(Q)]

Certainly society may condemn what was done. But contrition and forgiveness of sin is at the heart of the Catholic Church. I think the Church should avail itself of its believes, and only when one does not act with a contrite heart and continues to sin to the point of harming the foundation of the Church it becomes blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, and the priest should be excommunicated.

Little boys are getting buggered by filthy old sods, who ARE the foundation of the Church. No one gives a flying fuck about blaspheming the fucking Holy Spirit, because little boys are getting buggered by filthy old sods. Filthy old sods do not deserve forgiveness for buggering little boys.

As anyone can plainly see, the Catholic Church AND it's brethren (you) are more concerned about their own interests and reputations than they are about filthy sods buggering little boys.

The condemnation of the Catholic Church by society is a necessity.

 

[Learned Hand]

Little boys are getting buggered by filthy old sods, who ARE the foundation of the Church. No one gives a flying fuck about blaspheming the fucking Holy Spirit, because little boys are getting buggered by filthy old sods. Filthy old sods do not deserve forgiveness for buggering little boys.

As anyone can plainly see, the Catholic Church AND it's brethren (you) are more concerned about their own interests and reputations than they are about filthy sods buggering little boys.

The condemnation of the Catholic Church by society is a necessity.

Well, then, by your take, we should all be condemned because our society generates filthy old sods who go after kids and we allow them to "get buggered" as they move around from town to town.

My only point was that the Church should put a limit on this type of behavior internally within the tenets of their belief; if it gets to the point of continuous and intentional "buggering," the Church should kick them out & work with civil authorities in bringing them to justice. I certainly don't praise the Church for their priest hopping, but I'm not going condemn a faith because of the sin of the man.

 

[Orleander]

...I'm not going condemn a faith because of the sin of the man.

Its not the faith, its the church I condemn.

 

[John99]

Little boys are getting buggered by filthy old sods, who ARE the foundation of the Church. No one gives a flying fuck about blaspheming the fucking Holy Spirit, because little boys are getting buggered by filthy old sods. Filthy old sods do not deserve forgiveness for buggering little boys.

As anyone can plainly see, the Catholic Church AND it's brethren (you) are more concerned about their own interests and reputations than they are about filthy sods buggering little boys.

The condemnation of the Catholic Church by society is a necessity.

Well if we took the pictures of ALL children who were sexually abused as the link in bells post does, how far do you think that line would go? AND it mentions a handful of perpetrators responsible for the devistation. I can mention a field\profession that it is much MUCH more widespread. In fact the link BELLS linked to has a link to it embedded right in the page. BUT the way i see it is why gloat? i am not here to hurt people. But sometimes the truth hurts. And it is swept under the rug in too many way there too.

We can BS all we want but i prefer facts and statistics so just do the research. My post can\should be viewed as NOT having an ANTI-religious chip on my shoulder but people see what they want to see and ignore what they want.

Not to mention children crying themselves to sleep every single night because they live with addicted parents and the long term\destructive effects that has but lets just forget they exist. They are probably poor and under educated anyway. Insignificant to most people.

Yeah, poor slobs to be stepped on. So go right ahead with this self righteous crocodile tears bullshit because they turn into adults...adults to be ridiculed and make those who were\are perfect feel better.

 

[(Q)]

Well, then, by your take, we should all be condemned because our society generates filthy old sods who go after kids and we allow them to "get buggered" as they move around from town to town.

That makes no sense.

My only point was that the Church should put a limit on this type of behavior internally within the tenets of their belief; if it gets to the point of continuous and intentional "buggering," the Church should kick them out & work with civil authorities in bringing them to justice. I certainly don't praise the Church for their priest hopping, but I'm not going condemn a faith because of the sin of the man.

The only thing worse than a corrupt organization are the people who defend it.

Sin? WTF are you talking about? Buggery isn't a sin, numbnuts, it's a fucking crime.

You of all people should be demanding his head on a stick, not some bullshit 'behavior limitations." The entire fucking Catholic organization needs a damn good enema.