Christians: Your Thoughts

Medicine*Woman said:
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M*W: That depends on who's listening. If you're talking to a christian, they already have pre-set boundaries of what they're willing to hear (Note: I did not say 'believe'). So, most of the time, anything anyone of any level of knowledge will fall on deaf christian ears.

Those who are more inclined to read and research will listen with open ears, and hopefully discuss and share knowledge.

Some atheists, on the other hand, don't want to discuss religious matters, simply because they're not interested and even coming from another atheist can fall on deaf atheist ears.

If I want to make a point, depending on who's listening, I use a combination of the works of legitimate scholars and what I glean for myself if it applies. I don't usually come up with my own theories, but if I feel what I'm thinking applies to other scholarly research, then I'll express it.

I love to read and research. I've learned a lot, and I would like to share it, especially to those who turn a deaf ear. I believe they are the ones who would benefit most from what I have to say. I love the discussions. It doesn't really matter who is right or wrong. I respect those individuals more who will at least listen whether they end up agreeing or not. I think it's said when some refuse to listen, because they show they are close-minded. I was like them at one time, so I understand where they're coming from. I am truly thankful I listened when I did.

Regarding believing what science can prove, I am an advocate for evidence based knowledge. Because I'm in the medical field, science has special meaning to me. I want to know how good medicine comes to be and how we can eliminate bad medicine. I respect biblical scholars and archeologists for the training they've had and for the work they do. They don't necessarily set out to prove this or prove that, they set out to find out what the truth is to their findings, regardless of which way it turns out. They don't conclude such things as did Jesus exist or did the Exodus really happen. They take the tangible evidence (if any) and base their conclusions on the science behind the artifacts they study.

I don't usually form my own opinion from one scholar saying this or the other scholar saying that. I prefer to read everything I can find and base my opinions on what seems logical to me. Sometimes I may be right, and sometimes I may be wrong, but I never stop searching. I believe there are just some things that have been handed down to us that we best not take at face value. I just don't have that kind of naive faith. I need to have it proven to me with evidence.
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I agree with your philosophy on debating. That is why I dont use scripture to lend authority to my arguments most of the time here because it has no authority in the minds of most people here so it would be nonsense, even though I believe it is truth. I really do understand your frustration with Christians, honestly I do, I think it is rediculous the way we act sometimes. I really do apologize for that. The truth is we do what makes sense to us. That is not debatable. Jesus Christ makes sense to me so that is the way I will look at things, so is it neccessary for people to lash out at me. I do not lash out with harsh words or derrogatory remarks because they believe different. You say it does not make a difference who is right or wrong but it does. The ideas discussed here make up the foundations of our world so is there any moral obligation? Of course that is why you have a need to want to teach people, right? In your heart of hearts I really do think you believe it matters. And to address you stating "I just don't have that kind of naive faith. I need to have it proven to me with evidence." At some point in time there is no evidence and you have to believe a report from someone. You are in medicine so tell me if someone says that they are in pain you have to believe them, because that is your only way of knowing.

Thank you,
His son,
><>Warrior61<><
 
Warrior61 said:
So your plan is to piss them off and show that they are stupid by bickering. Your whole point is to show who is more intellectual? The stupid thing is that alot of people either "red hair" the argument or just stop responding. This thread has evoled into people bickering hardly anyone has stuck to the topic. This is a "common thread" in this forum. Now that is what is stupid.

Thank you,
His son,
><>Warrior61<><
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No. My point is to show onlookers that those who have roots in Christ can have certain traits come out more strongly than others. Again, I didn't engage in the swearing and personal insults, I merely played around with him without getting offensive or hostile, all the while answering the questions raised to me about my previous argument.
 
Redefine91 said:
No. My point is to show onlookers that those who have roots in Christ can have certain traits come out more strongly than others. Again, I didn't engage in the swearing and personal insults, I merely played around with him without getting offensive or hostile, all the while answering the questions raised to me about my previous argument.
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Well obviously you got some negative feed back. Again your point for debating is to show onlookers who have roots in Christ that they can have certain traits come out more strongly than others? So your point is to debate for people to see... I am confused. I am not trying to make you seem stupid I am just questioning your intent. They saw it as more than playing around.
 
W61 said:
I agree with your philosophy on debating. That is why I dont use scripture to lend authority to my arguments most of the time here because it has no authority in the minds of most people here so it would be nonsense, even though I believe it is truth. I really do understand your frustration with Christians, honestly I do, I think it is rediculous the way we act sometimes. I really do apologize for that. The truth is we do what makes sense to us. That is not debatable. Jesus Christ makes sense to me so that is the way I will look at things, so is it neccessary for people to lash out at me. I do not lash out with harsh words or derrogatory remarks because they believe different. You say it does not make a difference who is right or wrong but it does. The ideas discussed here make up the foundations of our world so is there any moral obligation? Of course that is why you have a need to want to teach people, right? In your heart of hearts I really do think you believe it matters. And to address you stating "I just don't have that kind of naive faith. I need to have it proven to me with evidence." At some point in time there is no evidence and you have to believe a report from someone. You are in medicine so tell me if someone says that they are in pain you have to believe them, because that is your only way of knowing.

Thank you,
His son,
><>Warrior61<><
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M*W: Well, of course I care, otherwise I wouldn't be here. I guess I should have stated that it really does matter in the long run who is right and who is wrong, I just don't believe in the consequences christians apply to their beliefs. It really isn't a matter of who is right or who is wrong. One chooses their beliefs because they believe they're right (or at least I would hope so). The only thing I want is for them to listen to me. I know there is no way I can change their belief system directly. That is something they must do for themselves. I just want them to listen. I also know that they may listen to me in my lifetime, but hopefully, they will always listen. I also understand that sometimes there is no evidence, and a person would just have to go on their gut feeling. I would also question why people believe what they're told but don't follow up with doing their own research. That's where I'd like to help them. I'll do the reading. I'll do the research. I'll learn all I can from the professionals, and then I will ask them to listen. They don't have to believe me, better yet, they can go directly to the professionals. I just hope to point them in that direction.

Thank you for you insightful post. You seem to be a christian who will at least listen and converse regardless of your beliefs. I also see that you are confident in your beliefs. I guess that's where other christians are lacking. When someone proposes something other than what they've been taught, they become fearful. Regardless of what one believes, believe in it with confidence!
 
Medicine*Woman said:
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M*W: Well, of course I care, otherwise I wouldn't be here. I guess I should have stated that it really does matter in the long run who is right and who is wrong, I just don't believe in the consequences christians apply to their beliefs. It really isn't a matter of who is right or who is wrong. One chooses their beliefs because they believe they're right (or at least I would hope so). The only thing I want is for them to listen to me. I know there is no way I can change their belief system directly. That is something they must do for themselves. I just want them to listen. I also know that they may listen to me in my lifetime, but hopefully, they will always listen. I also understand that sometimes there is no evidence, and a person would just have to go on their gut feeling. I would also question why people believe what they're told but don't follow up with doing their own research. That's where I'd like to help them. I'll do the reading. I'll do the research. I'll learn all I can from the professionals, and then I will ask them to listen. They don't have to believe me, better yet, they can go directly to the professionals. I just hope to point them in that direction.

Thank you for you insightful post. You seem to be a christian who will at least listen and converse regardless of your beliefs. I also see that you are confident in your beliefs. I guess that's where other christians are lacking. When someone proposes something other than what they've been taught, they become fearful. Regardless of what one believes, believe in it with confidence!
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I have grown up in a Christian home and Jesus has been preached all my life. I have always been inquisitive and I agree with you fully on following up on a report or a gut feeling. I would love to listen I really do want to strengthen my argument and my beliefs and I believe I do have truth so why not put it to the test. I have the same feelings you have though. I want people to listen to me, however, on here they just wont respond.

So now I am compelled to ask. What are your views on the history of the world? How did we get here?

Sidenote: You said you were in the medical field well I am currently afflicted with mono. I believe I have had it for a while. The concensus is to rest it off, but I have other things to get done. As I mentioned earlier I am 17 so I have school and sports. I know I can not play sports for at least to weeks but I was just wandering your thoughts on the matter. I would greatly appreciate it.

Thank you,
His son,
><>Warrior61<><
 
Medicine*Woman,

One chooses their beliefs because they believe they're right (or at least I would hope so).
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That's not necessarily so MW, some people choose their beliefs because the philosophy makes sense. Also, people may choose a particular belief because through it, they can make sense of themselves, especially in relation to the world they live in, plus the philosophy.

The only thing I want is for them to listen to me. I know there is no way I can change their belief system directly.
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They listen to you, but most probably can't understand why you would want to change their belief system. They may probably see you as someone who is unable to grasp the practical and philosophical sides to their belief system. It may be in your interest to gain more understanding of what it is you want them to change, and to show how your method/belief/knowledge/understanding is superior.

I would also question why people believe what they're told but don't follow up with doing their own research.
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This is condescending remark (albeit not intentional), as it implies that such people lack the basic intelligence of discrimination. While they're obviously people who do, such a conditional state is not mutually exclusive to theists, as your implication suggests.

That's where I'd like to help them. I'll do the reading. I'll do the research. I'll learn all I can from the professionals, and then I will ask them to listen. They don't have to believe me, better yet, they can go directly to the professionals. I just hope to point them in that direction.
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That's how all relgions work according to their respective sources. How is this one going to be any better?

Jan.
 
Warrior61 said:
This is to anyone. To any person who reads this please answer.

What is a Christian? What do you think they believe? Please give any other thoughts on Christianity that you might want to say.

I know everyone has got something to say so please don't hold back.

Thank you,
His Son,
><>Warrior61<><
I Peter 3:15
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The real definition of "Christian", IMO, is a person who follows in the footsteps of Christ Jesus.
But it seems, these days, that that is not requirement, so I honestly cannot answer that question.
What do you think a Christian is?

Jan.
 
Jan Ardena said:
Medicine*Woman,

That's not necessarily so MW, some people choose their beliefs because the philosophy makes sense. Also, people may choose a particular belief because through it, they can make sense of themselves, especially in relation to the world they live in, plus the philosophy.
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Make sense and what is believed to be right are the same thing in this case.
 
Jan Ardena said:
The real definition of "Christian", IMO, is a person who follows in the footsteps of Christ Jesus.
But it seems, these days, that that is not requirement, so I honestly cannot answer that question.
What do you think a Christian is?

Jan.
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I answered that earlier in the thread. Go back and read it, not being rude, just saying I already answered it.

Thank you,
His son,
><>Warrior61<><
 
zenbabelfish said:
I disagree - the idea that a human is distinct from their environment is an illusion.
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It's not an illusion, just an idea (way of thinking about a particular issue).

But ok I see where you stand. ;)

A one track mind is not necessarily very useful.
 
Medicine*Woman said:
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I would also question why people believe what they're told but don't follow up with doing their own research. That's where I'd like to help them. I'll do the reading. I'll do the research. I'll learn all I can from the professionals, and then I will ask them to listen.
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I would question that assumption of people not folowing up with their own research.

They may indeed follow up and obtain scholarly information, yet apply knowledge, learn, and think critically to form their own conclusions, and alas(!) disagree with the professionals. :eek:

Even professionals can be wrong... ;)

*Kum bah yah...*
 
Vindicator said:
I would question that assumption of people not folowing up with their own research.

They may indeed follow up and obtain scholarly information, yet apply knowledge, learn, and think critically to form their own conclusions, and alas(!) disagree with the professionals. :eek:

Even professionals can be wrong... ;)

*Kum bah yah...*
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M*W: I question how many theists do any kind of research at all. I wish I could believe that christians sought to find out more about their religion. I remember when I was a christian, I wouldn't read anything that was contrary to my religion. The pope would authorize each book we as catholics could read. I stuck to it, until I visited Rome. Then I had questions! Then I needed answers!

Yes, even professionals can be wrong. That's why I think it is important to not follow blindly. It's not a terrible thing to want knowledge. It's a terrible thing to not want it!

Come on, IAC... I know this is your sock puppet. Admit it!
 
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