christian vs christian

[Lori_7]

Should be no sex life for you if you are so on fire for JC

exactly. there is NOTHING vague or even remotely debatable about this according to the bible. i asked a yes or no question...celibate or not, and she acts like i've asked for a sex video i can post all over the net.

and sandy, i don't believe that you posted that thread about gay marriage legislation because you just happened upon it and thought it to be randomly interesting. i think you posted it because as a CCR, you have some twisted interest in it, opinion about it, agenda for it...

how ironic.

 

[Lori_7]

*************
M*W: Too bad you can't just shoot-up Jesus into your veins.

that's actually not such a far-out idea. you know my theory about communion and perfected (sinless) blood right?

 

[Lori_7]

Why? Because I realize nothing else is more important than serving Him. Nothing.
***
My comment about half my stuff was just a comment and not my main reason for staying single. I love my life and don't want to change it.

serving Him REQUIRES change...ongoing. you know, the work he does in you. it always starts with a good hard look in the mirror.

and it wasn't "just a comment", it is your testimony! and it sucks.

i wonder if "i love my life and don't want to change it" translates into "i love this world and don't want to change it, as long as the world is still kissing my ass."

because if you love this world, and the things of this world, and the ways of this world, you are in deep shit.

No, I don't consider material wealth=a relationship with God. There are plenty of broke Christians. I witness by saying whatever God tells me to say. I am always led by the Holy Spirit--not my own thoughts or words.

did god tell you to make the comment about your precious stuff?

 

[sandy]

I will give you extra points if you can tell me where in the Bible this passage comes from and the context from which it was said. You seem like a fun enough lady, to bad I can not agree with your melding of politics and, seeing that you're not religious, spirituality (CCR).

The irony of this statement is palatable. The idea of being a "born-again Christian" is the main tenet of the manmade religion in which you follow. I understand, my mother makes this miss-association all the time. You kind of remind me of her.

One of the most frightening groups of verses in the Bible is found in Revelation 3:14-19, when Christ is talking to the Church of Laodicea.

He is addressing the people of a city known for its wealth. But despite its financial prosperity, it was spiritually impoverished. He says in regards to the people: "I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other! So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth. You say, 'I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.' But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked".

What's frightening about this statement is that most people in this world who call themselves Christians are lukewarm...

http://www.konig.org/wc2.htm

 

[Neverfly]

You first ascribe this quote to MW but it was written by Sandy in post#13:


See? You have it as originally posted by MW. Then you go on about Lori as if it was MW who had responded to Sandy with said quote. That's what I was referring to.

Holy SHit!
You're right.
I never noticed that.

I had thought you misread the separation between them and here it was that I had messed it up.

Very sorry about that Lucysnow and MW. Corrected.

 

[Lori_7]

One of the most frightening groups of verses in the Bible is found in Revelation 3:14-19, when Christ is talking to the Church of Laodicea.

He is addressing the people of a city known for its wealth. But despite its financial prosperity, it was spiritually impoverished. He says in regards to the people: "I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other! So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth. You say, 'I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.' But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked".

What's frightening about this statement is that most people in this world who call themselves Christians are lukewarm...

http://www.konig.org/wc2.htm

i don't find this to be frightening. i find it to be obvious.

 

[Lori_7]

and this is my point...

if we as christians believe in a kingdom that has no money, no financial institutions, no possessions, no government, no politics, and no taxes, and that is comprised by people who are committed to honesty, trust, love, absolute freedom, and equality in individuality, then how is being overly focused on those wordly things correct, or preparing you for the kingdom?

i think the average CCR is much more concerned with keeping themselves comfortable and wealthy than they are with what god actually expects from them.

 

[Adstar]

Hi Lori

now adstar brought up some good scripture that i'm familiar with suggesting that pursuing and engaging in a sexual relationship (marriage) would serve as a distraction from spirituality, because it's a physical relationship. it's of the flesh, of the world, and it's material. and that's true.

The scriptures that I quoted did not talk much about sex. It talked of the time one was spending serving the spouse and that taking time away from serving God. Loving other people is not of the flesh, but it should come second to loving God.

that's why nuns and priests and lots of other people are celibate, and that's noble.

Let it not be said that the institutionalised celibacy of catholic nuns and priests is noble. I would hate to think that anything I said on the subject of celibacy would be used to give praise to nuns or priests. We have seen where institutionalised celibacy of the catholic church has lead to. People who attempt to live a life of celibacy without being given the God given gift of doing so will always burn with passion and in the case of the catholic church where they teach lies they are given over to burn with “vile passions” (read Romans 1) as we have seen in the media in many places.

and i want to point out that usually, in a case where someone would forego marriage in an attempt to be more spiritually oriented, they would also forego the pursuit of material wealth and possessions.

For me it is not about foregoing. If one has had the desire for these things reduced (by God) to the point where they fall below the desire for a good relationship with God and to love other people then the person has not really made a sacrifice. It’s not their doing/effort. It is the doing of God.

If the desire to be right with God is paramount within one then desire or enjoyment of other things can still exist at a lower level. The spirit of the words of Jesus to me on this issue is not about embracing one and totally rejecting the other, but it is about having these things in the right order of importance.

So it is
1)God
2)People
3) everything else.

greed is wanting to have more than someone else, or at the expense of someone else.

I think wanting to have more than someone else has more to do with jealousy, pride and seeking to be admired/envied by others. But I agree that if a person places material gain above the love for others then it comes at the expense of others. In truth it also comes at the expense of the one who is greedy.

imo, and as scripture states, a much better indication of a relationship with god is how well and how truly you love other people. you don't have to have a lot of money to do that.

Agreed. But in the end loving other people must never cause us to compromise our Love for God.

Matthew 22
34 But when the Pharisees heard that He had silenced the Sadducees, they gathered together. 35 Then one of them, a lawyer, asked Him a question, testing Him, and saying, 36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?”
37 Jesus said to him, “ ‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbour as yourself.’



All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Adstar]

and this is my point...

if we as christians believe in a kingdom that has no money, no financial institutions, no possessions, no government, no politics, and no taxes, and that is comprised by people who are committed to honesty, trust, love, absolute freedom, and equality in individuality, then how is being overly focused on those wordly things correct, or preparing you for the kingdom?

i think the average CCR is much more concerned with keeping themselves comfortable and wealthy than they are with what god actually expects from them.

Ummm what does CCR stand for?


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Enmos]

Colonial Christian Republic?

 

[Lori_7]

I assumed it was conservative christian republican.

 

[Mrs.Lucysnow]

Holy SHit!
You're right.
I never noticed that.

I had thought you misread the separation between them and here it was that I had messed it up.

Very sorry about that Lucysnow and MW. Corrected.

No problem. Just thought you wouldn't want to confuse other's who might read the thread.

 

[Doreen]

Speaking of which... sandy is a man. I can tell by the way she/he writes.

Well, there isn't much you and I agree on, but I have always had the same impression. Of course, I have been wrong about the sex of certain posters. But in any case, I too think Sandy is a guy. The choice of Avatar only increases my sense this is the case.

 

[Lori_7]

Hi Lori



The scriptures that I quoted did not talk much about sex. It talked of the time one was spending serving the spouse and that taking time away from serving God. Loving other people is not of the flesh, but it should come second to loving God.

well, you know, "serving the spouse"...imo, the whole basis/definition of marriage is sexual. and a reason for celibacy could be to better enable a person to love other people...everyone, with a love that is not of the flesh. i noticed that when i was celibate...my perceptions of people changed...the way they related to me and i to them changed...when sex was taken out of the mix. even with women. it just frees everyone's mind up a bit to consider other ways to relate. it was very liberating.

Let it not be said that the institutionalised celibacy of catholic nuns and priests is noble. I would hate to think that anything I said on the subject of celibacy would be used to give praise to nuns or priests. We have seen where institutionalised celibacy of the catholic church has lead to. People who attempt to live a life of celibacy without being given the God given gift of doing so will always burn with passion and in the case of the catholic church where they teach lies they are given over to burn with “vile passions” (read Romans 1) as we have seen in the media in many places.

well, i'm not an advocate of institutionalized anything, and i sure do have a big problem with the catholic institution. in general, they substitute indoctrinization into their organization for a relationship with god. they equate their organization with "the church" in the bible. but i can say the same thing about many protestants. the protestants just don't admit it so blatently but trust that plenty are on the payroll, and don't know god.

that being said, i don't think that celibacy should be something you agree to as a stipulation for employment or for a particular title within an organization, but a very personal decision made for the right reasons. and i think that there have been and are plenty of nuns and priests who have made that decision with a calling, just like plenty of others have outside of the catholic organization. and it is not just the catholics who have been caught up in their vile passions. i think we're all aware of plenty of protestant/evangelical sex scandals.

For me it is not about foregoing. If one has had the desire for these things reduced (by God) to the point where they fall below the desire for a good relationship with God and to love other people then the person has not really made a sacrifice. It’s not their doing/effort. It is the doing of God.

If the desire to be right with God is paramount within one then desire or enjoyment of other things can still exist at a lower level. The spirit of the words of Jesus to me on this issue is not about embracing one and totally rejecting the other, but it is about having these things in the right order of importance.

So it is
1)God
2)People
3) everything else.

i would also add that it is god's love that we experience and learn from that even allows us to be able to love other people, and our love for god which makes us want to love others.

and there are sacrifices made and felt in the name of god. when decisions are made and paths are chosen in the name of a righteous calling, there are always other things and other paths foregone, and you feel that and miss that, but it's ok, because you have faith. when i was celibate i was very secure with my path, and i knew it was right for me at the time, but i still very aware of the fact that there was something forgone, and i missed it.

 

[Adstar]

I assumed it was conservative christian republican.

I would say your more correct then Enmos's Colonial Christian Republic, i looked them up... dangerous bunch.. i would love to be able to have a crack at reaching them.

As to your comment about conservative christian republicans

i think the average CCR is much more concerned with keeping themselves comfortable and wealthy than they are with what god actually expects from them.

Its a wide group that could be termed conservative christian republicans so it is very hard to make any generalised statements that cover them all. from my interaction with many who call themselves conservative Christians who are enthusiastic supporters of the more conservative elements in politics it seems to me that their main motivational factor is fear of losing control. They see their security in the faith as being inextricably linked to maintaining a dominant influencing role in the political leadership of their country.

They are to me like the religious who gave their support to constantine many generations ago. Getting into bed with the powers that be in this world because of the lack of faith in God as their rock of salvation.

Nothing ever good comes from playing the harlot with satan. They will not convert satan to believe Jesus by playing the harlot with him. They are the ones who will be given over to deception and be lead into darkness.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Adstar]

well, you know, "serving the spouse"...imo, the whole basis/definition of marriage is sexual.

I have never see it as exclusively about sex. I have seen it to be more about providing a stable environment of love and security for ones kids to grow up in. A loving partnership.

and a reason for celibacy could be to better enable a person to love other people...everyone, with a love that is not of the flesh.

Good point. It could well be

i noticed that when i was celibate...my perceptions of people changed...the way they related to me and i to them changed...when sex was taken out of the mix. even with women. it just frees everyone's mind up a bit to consider other ways to relate. it was very liberating.

I found it was easier to offer emotional support to woman when the possibility of a sexual relationship was taken out of the mix. Once the burden of expectation of performing that role was removed i could relax and be free to relate to them in a purely emotional way.

well, i'm not an advocate of institutionalized anything, and i sure do have a big problem with the catholic institution. in general, they substitute indoctrinization into their organization for a relationship with god.

Agreed.

they equate their organization with "the church" in the bible. but i can say the same thing about many protestants. the protestants just don't admit it so blatently but trust that plenty are on the payroll, and don't know god.

Agreed.

that being said, i don't think that celibacy should be something you agree to as a stipulation for employment or for a particular title within an organization, but a very personal decision made for the right reasons.

Totally agree.

and i think that there have been and are plenty of nuns and priests who have made that decision with a calling, just like plenty of others have outside of the catholic organization.

I believe most have been moved to accept celibacy because they have been taught that this is what they must accept if they wish to join the top tier of christianity. If one is lead to believe the highest relationship with God can only be obtained by accepting celibacy then they will attempt to be celibate by their own will power and self-discipline.

and it is not just the catholics who have been caught up in their vile passions. i think we're all aware of plenty of protestant/evangelical sex scandals.

Yep. The Harlot is the mother of harlots. Have a read of Revelation 17.

i would also add that it is god's love that we experience and learn from that even allows us to be able to love other people, and our love for god which makes us want to love others.

Seems very close to what i have said before about Gods forgivness allowing us to forgive ourselves and to forgive others. Forgivness opens to door to love.

and there are sacrifices made and felt in the name of god. when decisions are made and paths are chosen in the name of a righteous calling, there are always other things and other paths foregone, and you feel that and miss that, but it's ok, because you have faith. when i was celibate i was very secure with my path, and i knew it was right for me at the time, but i still very aware of the fact that there was something forgone, and i missed it.

I hope the one you are with will walk with you to the One i will be with forever.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[sifreak21]

started out good but guess sandy doesnt want to debate?

 

[Medicine*Woman]

started out good but guess sandy doesnt want to debate?

*************
M*W: Let's face it. Sandy is orgasmic for Jesus. Whatever. I think it's a ruse. Just look at her avatar. Sandy is hiding behind Christie Brinkley. Sandy writes like an older man who wants to be a young guy but pretends to be a woman. Sounds sick in the head to me.

Lori, take what Sandy says with a grain of salt. It's worthless, like a grain of salt. Sex is nothing to feel guilty about. It's a natural human/animal function. The whole guilt thing is about the ability or non-ability to reproduce. We can thank the folks down at the patriarchy for that one. Sex is life, whatever life we choose. It's personal. It's intimate. It's a reflection of our innermost being. It's who we are, and we should not be ashamed of who we are. Sex is wrong and evil when it crosses the boundary of intimacy. I'm talking about perverts here, not normal human beings.

Lori, what I'm trying to say is to ignore Sandy. He's got some serious sexual identity problems.

 

[(Q)]

Kristians Kreating Konflict.

 

[sifreak21]

Kristians Kreating Konflict.

ehh is that implying something else?